Engine Rebuild
Discussion
Hi All,
Having blown a head gasket on the first day of owning our new kit car, my Dad and I set about dismantling and skimming the head.
We are now ready to rebuild but I have a few questions. Firstly, the engine is a 2.0l Zetec, circa 1998 (Mondeo).
I suspect the problem originally cropped up courtesy of a blockage in the rad which we will sort out / replace when we rebuild the car. But, I did notice the engine was running hot even before there were any problems (around 90 degrees). I have since learned that Zetec's run hot intentionally to keep a grip on emmissions.
Now, seeing as I don't intend on using the car for much other than track days and the occassional weekend blat through the countryside I don't really care too much about the emissions (or... something a little more politically correct). So, does anyone know of a replacement thermostat which will keep the engine running a bit cooler ? or.. even whether it is ok to run without a thermostat.. at least whilst the weather is still relatively warm ?
Secondly, we have a set of racey cams which have been reworked by Kent. The tuner (who skimmed the head for us) suggested these were a pretty saucy set of cams and were basically one stage below full race cams. But, using the measurements we have taken it would appear that the cams are infact from an 1800 Zetec.. Is it common practice to swap cams from one engine to another or is more likely our measurements are... well, less than accurate ?
Finally, with the racey cams and tuned bike carbs will we be seeing the full potential of the head or would we need to gas flow the head etc. to really feel the benefit of the other bits ?
Hopefully, someone out there might have plenty of time on his (or her) hands to ponder my questions.
Cheers, Dave.
Having blown a head gasket on the first day of owning our new kit car, my Dad and I set about dismantling and skimming the head.
We are now ready to rebuild but I have a few questions. Firstly, the engine is a 2.0l Zetec, circa 1998 (Mondeo).
I suspect the problem originally cropped up courtesy of a blockage in the rad which we will sort out / replace when we rebuild the car. But, I did notice the engine was running hot even before there were any problems (around 90 degrees). I have since learned that Zetec's run hot intentionally to keep a grip on emmissions.
Now, seeing as I don't intend on using the car for much other than track days and the occassional weekend blat through the countryside I don't really care too much about the emissions (or... something a little more politically correct). So, does anyone know of a replacement thermostat which will keep the engine running a bit cooler ? or.. even whether it is ok to run without a thermostat.. at least whilst the weather is still relatively warm ?
Secondly, we have a set of racey cams which have been reworked by Kent. The tuner (who skimmed the head for us) suggested these were a pretty saucy set of cams and were basically one stage below full race cams. But, using the measurements we have taken it would appear that the cams are infact from an 1800 Zetec.. Is it common practice to swap cams from one engine to another or is more likely our measurements are... well, less than accurate ?
Finally, with the racey cams and tuned bike carbs will we be seeing the full potential of the head or would we need to gas flow the head etc. to really feel the benefit of the other bits ?
Hopefully, someone out there might have plenty of time on his (or her) hands to ponder my questions.
Cheers, Dave.
Can't answer most of your questions
But
Don't run without a stat as the engine needs it to maintain the correct engine temp so find out which is the right temp for your engine (Look it up in Halfords) just in case someone has put the wrong one in there.
90 degrees is about right. As long as that is what it stayed at. If you think there are issues with the rad start by asking other owners of the same car what rad they are running.
Steve
But
Don't run without a stat as the engine needs it to maintain the correct engine temp so find out which is the right temp for your engine (Look it up in Halfords) just in case someone has put the wrong one in there.
90 degrees is about right. As long as that is what it stayed at. If you think there are issues with the rad start by asking other owners of the same car what rad they are running.
Steve
Like I say the engine is meant to run at 90 degrees, BUT only as a method of reducing emissions. I think the hotter the engine, the easier it is to burn of some of the harmful by-products of combustion. I would expect that, providing the air temp is not horrifcally cold, the engine should be pretty capable of keeping warm enough to not cause problems. Who knows ?
On a track I don't think there would be any problems with constant cooling as the engine is basically going to hammered non-stop. Not quite so sure on the road though ?
On a track I don't think there would be any problems with constant cooling as the engine is basically going to hammered non-stop. Not quite so sure on the road though ?
in response to Lotus nova, the engine has GSXR 1100 bike carbs and bogg bros manifold. The ignition is managed by an alpha system.
In all honesty, I don't know what the car has at the moment in terms of power. The estimates of the previous owner were around 190Bhp, though I suspect this might be a bit ambitious. I would think, based on what I've read, that the engine would be around the 175-180 mark.
TR7V8, thanks for the heads up. That would definitely be a bit of a bummer. I will get some info on that.
I think we're planning on doing the majority of the rebuild tomorrow, so I will try and get some pics... and yes, I will try and include some greasy hands : )
In all honesty, I don't know what the car has at the moment in terms of power. The estimates of the previous owner were around 190Bhp, though I suspect this might be a bit ambitious. I would think, based on what I've read, that the engine would be around the 175-180 mark.
TR7V8, thanks for the heads up. That would definitely be a bit of a bummer. I will get some info on that.
I think we're planning on doing the majority of the rebuild tomorrow, so I will try and get some pics... and yes, I will try and include some greasy hands : )
gilbertdave said:
Secondly, we have a set of racey cams which have been reworked by Kent. The tuner (who skimmed the head for us) suggested these were a pretty saucy set of cams and were basically one stage below full race cams. But, using the measurements we have taken it would appear that the cams are infact from an 1800 Zetec.. Is it common practice to swap cams from one engine to another or is more likely our measurements are... well, less than accurate ?
If swapping cams from one engine to another, it's the 2litre cams that people fit to 1800's, not the other way roundIt's not clear from what you are saying whether these are a set of kent cams or a set of standard zetec 1800 cams? If you are not sure, should you be fitting them?
Hi singlecoil... I re read my earlier and post and its not all that clear is it... Doh !
Basically, we bought the car and the previous owner told it has kent cams in it. However, when we stripped the engine the cams appear (visually) to be standard Ford parts (i.e, ford stamps on them and no additional markings). So, I rang Kent and asked them if they ever re-work cams rather than just replace them. I was told that they do this and whilst they usually put a stamp or a mark on the cams once they've finished, it is possible that the cams could have been re worked without any obvious visual changes.
The measurements we took (when compared to dimensions we found online) suggested that these were more similar to 1800 cams than 2.0l ?
So, we were as confused as you are
So, we then took the cams to the engine tuner for him to have a look at. He took some measurements which suggested that whatever they were from are whoever has modified them, they are quite aggressive and should give us some significant power gains over standard parts.
What is confusing is that they don't seem to represent a standard part from anywhere ?
Basically, we bought the car and the previous owner told it has kent cams in it. However, when we stripped the engine the cams appear (visually) to be standard Ford parts (i.e, ford stamps on them and no additional markings). So, I rang Kent and asked them if they ever re-work cams rather than just replace them. I was told that they do this and whilst they usually put a stamp or a mark on the cams once they've finished, it is possible that the cams could have been re worked without any obvious visual changes.
The measurements we took (when compared to dimensions we found online) suggested that these were more similar to 1800 cams than 2.0l ?
So, we were as confused as you are
So, we then took the cams to the engine tuner for him to have a look at. He took some measurements which suggested that whatever they were from are whoever has modified them, they are quite aggressive and should give us some significant power gains over standard parts. What is confusing is that they don't seem to represent a standard part from anywhere ?
Update:
Well, yesterday we made some good progress, but didn't get the engine finished as we'd hoped.
Senior spent some time in the morning re-making a bracket for the alternator which was decidedly tatty to start with and cutting a new inlet manifold gasket.
We got the head back on and followed the head tightening procedure with minimal problems (see pics). We used a torque and angle gadget which seemed to be pretty effective.
All of the little abits and bobs that bolt onto the side of the head were pretty trouble free. We re-wired a few tatty terminals on some wiring (temp sender and some earth cables) and generally tidied the car up as we went.
We did however have a bit of a nightmare with the exhaust. We just couldn't get the manifold back onto the head without it all looking out of position and being generally a bit crap. After about an hour and a half of sweating and cursing we decided to take the 4-1 collector of and fit it that way, which seemed to work... but it wasn't fun.
Hopefully, we'll get back on it today as all we need to do is fit the cams (and panic about the timing) and we should be good to go
On the way home from Wales !
First look inside the engine
The head looking satisfyingly shiny after its been skimmed
Mounting the Bogg Bros inlet manifold, with home made gaskets ! Yikes.
More shiny stuff
fixing down the head bolts with torque and angle
giving it a bit of welly... (technical term)
Well, yesterday we made some good progress, but didn't get the engine finished as we'd hoped.
Senior spent some time in the morning re-making a bracket for the alternator which was decidedly tatty to start with and cutting a new inlet manifold gasket.
We got the head back on and followed the head tightening procedure with minimal problems (see pics). We used a torque and angle gadget which seemed to be pretty effective.
All of the little abits and bobs that bolt onto the side of the head were pretty trouble free. We re-wired a few tatty terminals on some wiring (temp sender and some earth cables) and generally tidied the car up as we went.
We did however have a bit of a nightmare with the exhaust. We just couldn't get the manifold back onto the head without it all looking out of position and being generally a bit crap. After about an hour and a half of sweating and cursing we decided to take the 4-1 collector of and fit it that way, which seemed to work... but it wasn't fun.
Hopefully, we'll get back on it today as all we need to do is fit the cams (and panic about the timing) and we should be good to go
On the way home from Wales !
First look inside the engine
The head looking satisfyingly shiny after its been skimmed
Mounting the Bogg Bros inlet manifold, with home made gaskets ! Yikes.
More shiny stuff
fixing down the head bolts with torque and angle
giving it a bit of welly... (technical term)
Edited by gilbertdave on Sunday 10th August 12:48
I'll let David tell the full story. But we got it going. I managed to losse the cam timing by taking one of the cam pullies off (it has no key or locator pin). But thanks to Eddie Perk who drove all the way from Ashford Kent to help me we got it sorted.
It goes like the clappers and feels strong.Plenty of of liitle jobs to do now but it is running YEH.
David sampled the pleasures of open top motoring when he got caught in cloud burst as we were taking it back (finally) to its new home in Chelmsford.
(GilbertDave's Dad)
It goes like the clappers and feels strong.Plenty of of liitle jobs to do now but it is running YEH.
David sampled the pleasures of open top motoring when he got caught in cloud burst as we were taking it back (finally) to its new home in Chelmsford.
(GilbertDave's Dad)
I've been running a Zetec in my MK for a few years now. Run with the thermostat which is set for 93 deg, only use Ford Zetec "E" oil which was recomended by Dunnel tuning who have done loads with these engines. Might be worth getting a new rad if it's the VW Polo unit as they are only £40 and good for engines into the 200+ bhp range due to the amount of cooling they get in a "7" style car. I set a rev limit of 7200 rpm with soft cut off at 6900. They tend to have plenty of torque so no need to rev the nuts off it.
I'm just on the edge of Essex, where are you based?
I'm just on the edge of Essex, where are you based?
mkindy03 said:
I've been running a Zetec in my MK for a few years now. Run with the thermostat which is set for 93 deg, only use Ford Zetec "E" oil which was recomended by Dunnel tuning who have done loads with these engines. Might be worth getting a new rad if it's the VW Polo unit as they are only £40 and good for engines into the 200+ bhp range due to the amount of cooling they get in a "7" style car. I set a rev limit of 7200 rpm with soft cut off at 6900. They tend to have plenty of torque so no need to rev the nuts off it.
I'm just on the edge of Essex, where are you based?
We'll check out the rad soon but the car has little running since we bought it due to engine problem. I have fitted an 82 deg thermostat and the engine runs around that temperature now. I'm just on the edge of Essex, where are you based?
I,ve spannered on a number of club level race cars and we never use a thermostat.If the car runs too cool (which rarely happens) we just tape up the rad a bit. We also warm up the engines in the pits befor running.OK this is alright for racing but this a road car too.
I'm not sure if the rad is a VW polo item but we can follow that up as well. I think our rev limit is set at 6500rpm ish.Dave hit the limiter and it sounded like a soft cut to me. We have a pre-programmed Alpha management system and we havn't got into that yet. Its not user programmable althoughI do have an Emerald unit in the garage which is and we may change to that at some time.
The car lives in Chelmsford but should be (weather permitting) at the next Essex meet in South Woodham Ferrers. See the threads under Kent and Essex. Come along is a good evening.
Daves off line at the moment, bannished to Jaguar's Castle Brom plant installing production equipment. He will be back soon though.
Ken
I'd certainly be interested in the map. What sort of induction setup do you have. We are running bike carbs and we do have throttle pot. I havn't played with the Emerald for a couple years, time I dug it out I think.
Ken
PS Woodford to South Woodham 30mins or less ??
Ken
PS Woodford to South Woodham 30mins or less ??
Edited by Fbloke on Wednesday 13th August 22:57
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