Robin Hood 2B - How good are they?

[ArtVandelay]

I've decided to get a kitcar as a weekend toy. The idea of driving a lightweight sports car with good acceleration and handling at the weekend whilst driving something a bit more comfortable through the week really appeals to me, and as such I've been scouring the classifieds for the past few weeks.

I've looked at bike engined and car engined variants, and in all honesty I'm just looking for something with the right price to go with the performance and looks.

Recently, a Robin Hood 2B has caught my eye, however, being a complete novice to kit cars, I don't know what to look for. This is the car in question:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2018672.htm

Now, hideous wheels aside, what are your thoughts on this. Unfortunately I doubt I will buy that exact one as I can't get insured on it for another few months. I'm also interested in what sort of performance the above example would have, the power isn't listed but any rough ideas would be appreciated.

I do like the classic 7-esque shape but the likes of the Fisher Fury also appeal. Budget wise, including insurance is between £6-7k (insurance makes up approx 10% of the budget)

Thanks in advance.

EDIT: Did a quick search, seems that opinion of them is pretty poor Anyone got some positives to say.

Also if anyone fancies selling one around November, give me a call

Edited by ArtVandelay on Saturday 4th September 22:39

[Jerkins]

The Robin Hood is fine for cruising around the lanes watching the world go by, and I've seen some well-made examples.

However, it is heavy as sevens go and therefore will not be as nimble or rapid as a 'proper' seven. If you want a fast and capable car then you'd be better looking at Caterhams or Westfields (prob out of your budget) or one of the Locost derivatives such as MK, Luego, MNR and so on. Any of these will give you tons of fun, and the latter can be found within your budget.

As far as insurance is concerned, keeping to modest horsepower, keeping away from bike engines (can be 50% more expensive to insure) and limiting your annual mileage will all help to reduce the cost.

HTH,
David

[ArtVandelay]

Jerkins said:

The Robin Hood is fine for cruising around the lanes watching the world go by, and I've seen some well-made examples.

However, it is heavy as sevens go and therefore will not be as nimble or rapid as a 'proper' seven. If you want a fast and capable car then you'd be better looking at Caterhams or Westfields (prob out of your budget) or one of the Locost derivatives such as MK, Luego, MNR and so on. Any of these will give you tons of fun, and the latter can be found within your budget.

As far as insurance is concerned, keeping to modest horsepower, keeping away from bike engines (can be 50% more expensive to insure) and limiting your annual mileage will all help to reduce the cost.

HTH,
David

Thanks for the fast reply David.

The whole idea of a kit car to me is to be a lightweight pocket rocket. Insurance is about £450 for a car engined car and £650 for a bike engined car so I still feel that a bike engine is a possibility, if not a necessity. I've been getting quotes for an annual mileage of 2000, which is probably an overestimate but I'd rather be extra careful.

Ideally, I'd like something more akin to the Fury, the classic roadster lines just look right to me. I've also been looking at some of the more modern designs (i.e. Toniq R) however these tend to be marginally out of budget.

If the RH is a heavy beast, it looks like it has been ruled out already.

[slomax]

ArtVandelay said:

I've also been looking at some of the more modern designs (i.e. Toniq R) however these tend to be marginally out of budget.

Have you looked at the MEV range of cars?

From what i have heard, the RH seem to be some of the worst 7 type cars you can get from a major manufacturer. You might be better looking towards tiger, sylva etc etc

Are you looking to build or buy second hand?
If second hand depending on your budget you may consider looking towards the bottom of the westfield cars on offer.

[ArtVandelay]

slomax said:

ArtVandelay said:

I've also been looking at some of the more modern designs (i.e. Toniq R) however these tend to be marginally out of budget.

Have you looked at the MEV range of cars?

From what i have heard, the RH seem to be some of the worst 7 type cars you can get from a major manufacturer. You might be better looking towards tiger, sylva etc etc

Are you looking to build or buy second hand?
If second hand depending on your budget you may consider looking towards the bottom of the westfield cars on offer.

I've looked at Westfield cars but have found that they're more expensive (although probably better set up) than similar 7-like cars.

I'm looking to buy second hand, unfortunately I don't have the space for a build, although I probably do have enough to tinker/maintain my own kit car. As I'm looking at second hand cars, the MEV range are out of budget, although I do like the look of them (sort of an Ariel Atom and Caterham cross).

I guess there's a reason that the RH cars are so cheap then. I've looked at the Tiger, Sylva, MK and Fisher mostly as they seem to offer what I'm after.

I know it's stupid to be looking so early, but with the varying quality not to mention the variations on a theme that are out there, I keep thinking that if I stop looking, I'll miss that "perfect" car

Thanks for the reply

[slomax]

Another option is a locost. These tend to be cheaper than "branded" 7s but if you can find one with a company built chassis (I'd be wary of a homebuilt chassis) and the right engine and sus set up then you could get a real bargain. The build quality is very important with a locost as to make things a bit cheaper, some parts are fabricated.

[Mr2Mike]

ArtVandelay said:

Recently, a Robin Hood 2B has caught my eye, however, being a complete novice to kit cars, I don't know what to look for. This is the car in question:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2018672.htm

Now, hideous wheels aside

I can't put such abortions aside, I need to go and bleach my eyes now!

The 2B is a loose collection of bent exhaust pipe and bits of stainless steel sheet and GRP. It should win an award as the car with the smallest amount of actual engineering applied to a design. The quality of the finished item varies from utterly terrible to superficially good depending on the amount of time and skill the builder had, but ultimately they are (IMO) the worst designed 7 styled car you can still buy.

If it was extremely cheap and you only wanted to trundle around country roads at the weekend it may be sufficient. If you are buying a 7 for it's original attributes (i.e. lightness and handling) then look elsewhere.

Edited by Mr2Mike on Sunday 5th September 11:19

[ArtVandelay]

Mr2Mike said:

ArtVandelay said:

Recently, a Robin Hood 2B has caught my eye, however, being a complete novice to kit cars, I don't know what to look for. This is the car in question:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2018672.htm

Now, hideous wheels aside

I can't put such abortions aside, I need to go and bleach my eyes now!

The 2B is a loose collection of bent exhaust pipe and bits of stainless steel sheet and GRP. It should win an award as the car with the smallest amount of actual engineering applied to a design. The quality of the finished item varies from utterly terrible to superficially good depending on the amount of time and skill the builder had, but ultimately they are (IMO) the worst designed 7 styled car you can still buy.

If it was extremely cheap and you only wanted to trundle around country roads at the weekend it may be sufficient. If you are buying a 7 for it's original attributes (i.e. lightness and handling) then look elsewhere.

Edited by Mr2Mike on Sunday 5th September 11:19

So, you're not a fan?

Thanks for the replies everyone, I had heard the odd bad word about them but I didn't realise they were a 7 in looks alone. I'll continue to hunt through the classifieds until I find something else.

[TonyHetherington]

My dad and I are building one; have a look here for more details - www.johnskitcar.com

Like everything, they're as good as the builder. Our exact chassis was stress tested at Cardiff university and was found to be more rigid than a Caterham 7's chassis.

Having said that, I'm inclined to agree with many above. And that's what my dad and I are finding in the challenge. We're, quite literally, only using the chassis and some fibreglass bits. The rest we've totally designed ourself.

So, the rule? You can get well built Caterhams and badly built ones. You can get well built Hoods and badly built ones. It's just the good/bad ratio is somewhat different, that's all

If you see a car you like, for a good price, and it feels good, there's absolutely nothing wrong with it at all.

[ArtVandelay]

TonyHetherington said:

My dad and I are building one; have a look here for more details - www.johnskitcar.com

Like everything, they're as good as the builder. Our exact chassis was stress tested at Cardiff university and was found to be more rigid than a Caterham 7's chassis.

Having said that, I'm inclined to agree with many above. And that's what my dad and I are finding in the challenge. We're, quite literally, only using the chassis and some fibreglass bits. The rest we've totally designed ourself.

So, the rule? You can get well built Caterhams and badly built ones. You can get well built Hoods and badly built ones. It's just the good/bad ratio is somewhat different, that's all

If you see a car you like, for a good price, and it feels good, there's absolutely nothing wrong with it at all.

Cheers Tony, I've had a quick flick through your website, and I'm surprised at how much you've ignored the instructions

I guess to build a RH you need to have a bit of ingenuity about you. It looks like it's coming together well and I've no doubt you and your father are building a capable machine. My worry is that some people wouldn't go to the trouble of getting it perfect and as you say, it's the same with any kit car. The problem I'm having is that I've never been in a "sorted" kitcar before so I'm not sure I personally could tell the difference, perhaps I should get myself down to a show sometime to have a proper browse. I'm away on the 25th for seven weeks so it'll probably have to be in November (closer to when a purchase is more likely to be made) when I go to view some.

Good luck with your build, I look forward to seeing it when it's finished

[h4muf]

Best 2b dash ever tony!

This is my mates 2b with my westie.



He's just melted a piston in the pinto,but a blacktop zetec is ready to drop in!

[ArtVandelay]

h4muf said:

Best 2b dash ever tony!

This is my mates 2b with my westie.



He's just melted a piston in the pinto,but a blacktop zetec is ready to drop in!

Which is which? I know there must be some subtle differences in styling but I can't make them out :|

There's a beauty of a Toniq-R in the classifieds but it's out of budget, damn it!
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/largepic.asp?i=19...

[TonyHetherington]

ArtVandelay said:

Cheers Tony, I've had a quick flick through your website, and I'm surprised at how much you've ignored the instructions

The instructions aren't that great anyway, and so we're not ignoring much

Simply put, aside from the chassis and some of the suspension parts (which I'm sure will be swopped and changed at some point anyway) it's all totally bespoke, as you can see from the dash, pedal box, scuttle panel etc.

Dad really has made a fantastic job of it - I can see where my attention to detail comes from! - and I think it's this that really makes the difference.

The most impressive bit, I think, is the engine bay - it's finished, and yet looks like there's nothing in there! Superb

Anyway, back to your question - with the Hood, you really do have to design so much of it yourself, and as such there are many different ways people choose to wire up electrics (once saw a guy who had used household electrical switch boxes all over the place), many different ways people choose to mount things, retain things etc. Ultimately it all has to pass an IVA and so will be of a safe standard, however it's certainly not as simple as a Caterham or Westfield which has been designed very well and is ready to be put together, if that makes sense?

Just don't discount them because they have a bad name, that's my advice. You could pick up a good deal and a fun, relatively cheap, car. Just make sure it's been built right

[TonyHetherington]

h4muf said:

Best 2b dash ever tony!

On behalf of my dad, a massive thanks


Love the look of yours! Did you build it yourself?

[TonyHetherington]

ArtVandelay said:

perhaps I should get myself down to a show sometime to have a proper browse.

Absolutely I think Exeter is the only show left, though I may be wrong, however we are somewhat coming to the end of the kit car show season so it may be a bit late.

[Furyblade_Lee]

£6.5k buget in November..... I think you will get yourself a very tidy car for that, I'd be looking at cars in the ads for £7-7.5k and haggling. That would net you a decent Westfield if car going car engined or a very nice MK if you crave bike power. Robin Hoods and the like have a place, but not in your garage if you can stretch to 6.5k. That buys you a lot of Fury too, but you need to get yourself onto the JPSC forum to discuss a potential Fury purchase as no two are ever the same and vary significantly, very bespoke to the builder so research your options there first . Good luck and fun sourcing a toy!

[TonyHetherington]

TonyHetherington said:

ArtVandelay said:

perhaps I should get myself down to a show sometime to have a proper browse.

Absolutely I think Exeter is the only show left, though I may be wrong, however we are somewhat coming to the end of the kit car show season so it may be a bit late.

Just to add to this, there's Stafford car show 18th/19th September (forgot about that one).

Also, predicatbly, there is the Robin Hood owners club if you want more info

[ArtVandelay]

Furyblade_Lee said:

£6.5k buget in November..... I think you will get yourself a very tidy car for that, I'd be looking at cars in the ads for £7-7.5k and haggling. That would net you a decent Westfield if car going car engined or a very nice MK if you crave bike power. Robin Hoods and the like have a place, but not in your garage if you can stretch to 6.5k. That buys you a lot of Fury too, but you need to get yourself onto the JPSC forum to discuss a potential Fury purchase as no two are ever the same and vary significantly, very bespoke to the builder so research your options there first . Good luck and fun sourcing a toy!

I figured that they might drop in price (as per convertibles) in the winter, hopefully it won't snow though as I'd have to drive it home Mechanically wise, I'm going to buy a few manuals so I can do some of the basics. I'm a qualified Marine Engineer but all the engines I've worked on have been considerably more than 1 litre - 2 litre, but I think I'll pick it up easily enough. The only downfall is the lack of tools which can easily be sorted.

TonyHetherington said:

ArtVandelay said:

Cheers Tony, I've had a quick flick through your website, and I'm surprised at how much you've ignored the instructions

The instructions aren't that great anyway, and so we're not ignoring much

Simply put, aside from the chassis and some of the suspension parts (which I'm sure will be swopped and changed at some point anyway) it's all totally bespoke, as you can see from the dash, pedal box, scuttle panel etc.

Dad really has made a fantastic job of it - I can see where my attention to detail comes from! - and I think it's this that really makes the difference.

The most impressive bit, I think, is the engine bay - it's finished, and yet looks like there's nothing in there! Superb

Anyway, back to your question - with the Hood, you really do have to design so much of it yourself, and as such there are many different ways people choose to wire up electrics (once saw a guy who had used household electrical switch boxes all over the place), many different ways people choose to mount things, retain things etc. Ultimately it all has to pass an IVA and so will be of a safe standard, however it's certainly not as simple as a Caterham or Westfield which has been designed very well and is ready to be put together, if that makes sense?

Just don't discount them because they have a bad name, that's my advice. You could pick up a good deal and a fun, relatively cheap, car. Just make sure it's been built right

All of this bespoke engineering, has your dad thought about making his own kit I haven't discounted the RH but if something looks too good to be true, i.e. it's extremely cheap, I can't see the amount of hard work in both fitting and design going into it as you have done. I must say I'm impressed by your build Tony, you and your father have a good eye for detail.

TonyHetherington said:

TonyHetherington said:

ArtVandelay said:

perhaps I should get myself down to a show sometime to have a proper browse.

Absolutely I think Exeter is the only show left, though I may be wrong, however we are somewhat coming to the end of the kit car show season so it may be a bit late.

Just to add to this, there's Stafford car show 18th/19th September (forgot about that one).

Also, predicatbly, there is the Robin Hood owners club if you want more info

Stafford could be doable, it's a fair trek but I could make a week of it by visiting friends on the way down. I'll definitely be joining the owners club of the car I eventually chose, a few companies offer discounts which would ease the financial strain a bit The plan is to continue running the Megane as my daily, at least for another year, it would probably make a decent tow car too

[ColinM50]

Looking in this month's Complete Kitcar mag, there's a RH 2B for £4250, a part built RH 2B for £1500 a quite nice looking Dutton Phaeton with a 1300 engine for £1400 and another one with a 1800 Zetec for £1350 and I bet that'd go some. Also theres a Tigercat for £4200 and if you want to go a bit mad there's a GT40 for £65K, though that might be outside your budget.

The point is there's tons of cars out there if you look. Go and have a look at one or two and have a test drive. No obligation to buy, you want to make sure you fit in it and feel comfortable in it.

[Sam_68]

TonyHetherington said:

Like everything, they're as good as the builder. Our exact chassis was stress tested at Cardiff university and was found to be more rigid than a Caterham 7's chassis.

Tony,

At risk of drifting off-topic, what tested torsional stiffness did your chassis achieve and what stiffness were they quoting for the Caterham?

Reason I ask (apart from plain curiousity) is that Caterham are very cagey about releasing torsional stiffness figures for their chassis.

I've tested one myself, but it was a number of years ago and I'd be interested to know if the game has moved on!