Did the Tuscan V8 SE have rear discs?
Discussion
Turbster said:
I've seen it mentioned this car had rear discs, if so does anyone know what they were.. maybe Jag inboard to go with the 4HU diff?
yes and no.The production cars No.
1 Racing Tuscan / Griffith owned in the 60's by E H Paul I believe.
Plus some butchered american cars which evolved over time.
The last thing you want to fit to a griffith or Tuscan are inboard Discs from a jag.
N
Thanks for that, thought the spec saying they had rears was wrong. I wouldn't consider fitting the inboards, they're so heavy and I'd have to duct air to cool them etc.
Do most Griffith race cars run drums,obviuosly FIA cars will, but do the others and are they needed with such a light car?? I put rears on my Scimitar and all I seem to do is add front bias to stop them locking...
Do most Griffith race cars run drums,obviuosly FIA cars will, but do the others and are they needed with such a light car?? I put rears on my Scimitar and all I seem to do is add front bias to stop them locking...
David Hunt (I think) built a few excelently engineered V8 Vixens that had inboard rear disc brakes. Kash Biddle has one. A lot of changes to the rear chassis are required if you want to do it properly. http://tvr.at/vixen2-28.html
Slow M said:
heightswitch said:
...some butchered american cars which evolved over time.
Neil, how/why were they butchered? Were they Tuscan V8 SEs?heightswitch said:
The last thing you want to fit to a griffith or Tuscan are inboard Discs from a jag.
Why? B.
By butchered I mean non std / original and modified.
The second question is answered by the previous poster. They are heavy. the chassis is in the way, they get hot and are difficult to cool. They are a pig to work on.
The first thing you do with discs is bias them to stop them locking prematurely.
Fia cars with 450hp don't need rear discs so why would anyone else??
N.
Paul.
just looked at your profile. that scimtar was an n indecently quick little beast at Snett a few weeks ago. Sounded lovely as well.
Edited by heightswitch on Friday 1st May 21:11
Neil, thanks for that.
Re: cooling -I think they should be ducted regardless of where they live, inboard or out and that holds true for drums too.
Turbster,
good luck! By the way, there are finned Aluminium drums from Datsun/Nissan 240Z/260Z/280Z that fit with little modification and have better heat dissipation; also available are some aftermarket aluminium drums -both styles have cast-in iron liners.
B
Re: cooling -I think they should be ducted regardless of where they live, inboard or out and that holds true for drums too.
Turbster,
good luck! By the way, there are finned Aluminium drums from Datsun/Nissan 240Z/260Z/280Z that fit with little modification and have better heat dissipation; also available are some aftermarket aluminium drums -both styles have cast-in iron liners.
B
Well the fia cars (Griff's) would "LIKE" rear discs, but not homologated as not on the road cars.
The front on the FIA cars are the weak point (not being as up to the job as the same tperiod one on the Cobras - if they had been they would have won a few more SPA 6 hours
. John Shipmans fia Monster (yep about 450bhp) was leading for most of the first 4 hours in 08 only to fad late on with bad fading / knackered brakes (Jag 2 or 3pots).
I have these but will only have on for a bit when my car hits the road, once I can afford it they will go on the shelf and a proper set of BG Racing AP's and big vented rotors will go on (will have "At least what the fia cars have" power wise). The back will be staying as is (Drums), would be nice to have as discs but then not an easy swap to fia (and not really needed as most of the braking is done on the fronts, back more to stablise the whole lot.
The front on the FIA cars are the weak point (not being as up to the job as the same tperiod one on the Cobras - if they had been they would have won a few more SPA 6 hours
. John Shipmans fia Monster (yep about 450bhp) was leading for most of the first 4 hours in 08 only to fad late on with bad fading / knackered brakes (Jag 2 or 3pots).I have these but will only have on for a bit when my car hits the road, once I can afford it they will go on the shelf and a proper set of BG Racing AP's and big vented rotors will go on (will have "At least what the fia cars have" power wise). The back will be staying as is (Drums), would be nice to have as discs but then not an easy swap to fia (and not really needed as most of the braking is done on the fronts, back more to stablise the whole lot.
TVR_owner said:
Not the same league, but my M racer copes quite well with 300mm front discs and drums at the rear with good shoes and alfins. Brake bias is almost all front...
That is alot of brake for a 3000 (AP's - 4pots?). I just put 300mm on the wife shopping car! (She has not tried it yet!).jellison said:
TVR_owner said:
Not the same league, but my M racer copes quite well with 300mm front discs and drums at the rear with good shoes and alfins. Brake bias is almost all front...
That is alot of brake for a 3000 (AP's - 4pots?). I just put 300mm on the wife shopping car! (She has not tried it yet!).TVR_owner said:
jellison said:
TVR_owner said:
Not the same league, but my M racer copes quite well with 300mm front discs and drums at the rear with good shoes and alfins. Brake bias is almost all front...
That is alot of brake for a 3000 (AP's - 4pots?). I just put 300mm on the wife shopping car! (She has not tried it yet!).My car will not have much bigger discs (as has to run on 15" rims), mind BG managed to get 315mm (Solids) in there on the TR's ML's!
My old 3000 was crap for moving stuff about! Wonder where it is now!
jellison said:
My old 3000 was crap for moving stuff about!
Once upon a time I had my Saluki, Afghan hound AND Chinese take-out in my 2500M. BTW, jellison, look-> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi...
B
Slow M said:
jellison said:
My old 3000 was crap for moving stuff about!
Once upon a time I had my Saluki, Afghan hound AND Chinese take-out in my 2500M. BTW, jellison, look-> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi...
B
That is the Ex-Farrell Preston early Griff 200. Does make you laugh - when they think this is the worlds fastest Griff. It would not live with a Big Buck FIA car (the top ones of these pack 450bhp) or a few other I have raced against, interesting to see the full spec though - I see it is a stroker and with alloy heads (so could not be fia as is), and only 400bhp (340cu (anout 5.55 ltrs) you would expect a hell of alot more, 10:1 is a pretty low CR too). There are some Griffs about with even bigger lumps still and make Much much more power than this!
Some other odd bits Custom A- arms (rose jointed)
E-type Rear end?
Rear Discs, weird rose jointed links on the rear too (well and the front!)
Weird Exhaust existing where the wheel spats should be (there is a much better way of doing this and making alot more power).
It is a bit of a Hotrod really - Nice though (if You race in the US).
Some very useful pics for my files though
CheersLove the exhaust!
I really tried to leave this alone buuuuuuut........ I won't.
1.) The principal purpose of inboard brakes, be they drum or disc, is to reduce unsprung weight. This is done for the purpose of making the suspension react more quickly to input stimuli such as driving over a curb, bump or rumble strip via a reduction in inertial mass.
2.) If converting to inboard disc brakes, with properly selected components, the overall weight should not change much or even go down in an M.
Opting for Jaguar pieces that were designed to be used not only in the E-Type but also in the 3600-3700Lb 3.4 & 3.8 S-Type is NOT proper component selection ANY MORE! There are simply too many good and, yes, even great parts to be found in the breaker's yard. Jaguar cars were wonderful and heavy and large. The components they used were excellent ON THOSE CARS. They were sedans and GT cars. Arguably, the last true sports car Jaguar made was the early, lightweight version of the E around 1961. Enough production cars have used aluminium calipers that one can find these with a little research
3.) I'm very irritable because I made my coffee WWAAYY too strong this morning.
4.) Disc brakes next to the diff are in the air stream. One of the drawbacks of the production version of drum brake systems is that they a) are nicely tucked away in the wheel and out of the air flow and b) don't have any inherent way of introducing cooling air INTO them. Often, scoops are added to cut-out backing plates to alleviate these issues.
Thanks for letting me vent,
B.
1.) The principal purpose of inboard brakes, be they drum or disc, is to reduce unsprung weight. This is done for the purpose of making the suspension react more quickly to input stimuli such as driving over a curb, bump or rumble strip via a reduction in inertial mass.
2.) If converting to inboard disc brakes, with properly selected components, the overall weight should not change much or even go down in an M.
Opting for Jaguar pieces that were designed to be used not only in the E-Type but also in the 3600-3700Lb 3.4 & 3.8 S-Type is NOT proper component selection ANY MORE! There are simply too many good and, yes, even great parts to be found in the breaker's yard. Jaguar cars were wonderful and heavy and large. The components they used were excellent ON THOSE CARS. They were sedans and GT cars. Arguably, the last true sports car Jaguar made was the early, lightweight version of the E around 1961. Enough production cars have used aluminium calipers that one can find these with a little research
3.) I'm very irritable because I made my coffee WWAAYY too strong this morning.
4.) Disc brakes next to the diff are in the air stream. One of the drawbacks of the production version of drum brake systems is that they a) are nicely tucked away in the wheel and out of the air flow and b) don't have any inherent way of introducing cooling air INTO them. Often, scoops are added to cut-out backing plates to alleviate these issues.
Thanks for letting me vent,
B.
Turbster said:
I've seen it mentioned this car had rear discs, if so does anyone know what they were.. maybe Jag inboard to go with the 4HU diff?
The Barnet Motor Company racing Griff had discs front and rear - DB5 calipers on the rear and Merc 230SL calipers on the front. As an aside, the dif was a 3.77 E-Type Salisbury with LSD - 155mph at 7,000rpm.GBRM said:
Turbster said:
I've seen it mentioned this car had rear discs, if so does anyone know what they were.. maybe Jag inboard to go with the 4HU diff?
The Barnet Motor Company racing Griff had discs front and rear - DB5 calipers on the rear and Merc 230SL calipers on the front. As an aside, the dif was a 3.77 E-Type Salisbury with LSD - 155mph at 7,000rpm.
Neil.
Neil, nope, I'm much dis-liked by the FIA/MSA (I even have homologation papers for the Mazda RX7 - they don't!!) but at least all my info is period stuff and the Griff stuff is very relevant - not a lot of people like that!!
Edited to Add - my Griff details are from April '66.
Edited to Add - my Griff details are from April '66.
Edited by GBRM on Saturday 16th May 22:15
GBRM said:
Neil, nope, I'm much dis-liked by the FIA/MSA (I even have homologation papers for the Mazda RX7 - they don't!!) but at least all my info is period stuff and the Griff stuff is very relevant - not a lot of people like that!!
Edited to Add - my Griff details are from April '66.
The Barnet car?? was tht Martins MMT gregor?Edited to Add - my Griff details are from April '66.
Edited by GBRM on Saturday 16th May 22:15
N.
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