Spyker in the USA? No TVR?
Discussion
You need to understand TVR.
They currently make around 1000 cars a year.
Used to be about 2000 (at the griff/chim height) but they have decided to produce less cars, but at a better margin. So I believe the turnover is about the same.
This figure is a quarter of Ferrari's output a year.
Less than a months of Porsches annual output.
So for a small company, why bother with America, and the associated risks, when they have a large, closer to home, market in Europe, as yet not really exploited by them... As I said, even if only a small fraction of Porsche owners in Germany alone, want to try something different, that is enough to potentailly double production...
MAYBE TVR (ie Peter Wheeler) is happy with the current size of the company....
And only willing to expand, if a suitable partner could be found (ie carry the finacial risk/can)
B
They currently make around 1000 cars a year.
Used to be about 2000 (at the griff/chim height) but they have decided to produce less cars, but at a better margin. So I believe the turnover is about the same.
This figure is a quarter of Ferrari's output a year.
Less than a months of Porsches annual output.
So for a small company, why bother with America, and the associated risks, when they have a large, closer to home, market in Europe, as yet not really exploited by them... As I said, even if only a small fraction of Porsche owners in Germany alone, want to try something different, that is enough to potentailly double production...
MAYBE TVR (ie Peter Wheeler) is happy with the current size of the company....
And only willing to expand, if a suitable partner could be found (ie carry the finacial risk/can)
B
los angeles said:
Well, BJ Woods, and fellow Griffith owner, I know for a fact that TVR have been in talks with one of the most respected USA dealers of sports cars, but for reasons unknown to me, the talks came to nothing. As I am a long-time friend of the president of that company I'll ask him why. There may have been a condition too many put on the deal, by one side or the other. But it's plain TVR are looking seriously at the USA market again.
Well I also know for a fact that there have been stories, like this for the last 10 years... I guess we will keep having to wait and see... i.e there were series talks with, The operation in Brazil, for example, penske, et al.... didn't actually happen though, could be same again, perhaps....
TVR DID have a 'joint'? venture recently. Where a company in Malaysia was building/assembling Chimarea's.
But I don't think there is any move for tvr in america, Unless the right deal came along.
Maybe it is happening as we speak. Maybe not
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Thursday 22 April 11:21
According to this, Spyker make only about 50 cars a year:
http://inserviceextra.firechief.com/ar/transportation_dutch_luxury_car/
They use the Audi V8, so certification and development hassles are reduced in that regard. That leaves the crash testing...
http://inserviceextra.firechief.com/ar/transportation_dutch_luxury_car/
They use the Audi V8, so certification and development hassles are reduced in that regard. That leaves the crash testing...
No, more diificult.
Remember the Spyker engine, is already certified for the USA as it's made by AUDI. AT a very large economy of scale.
Whereas TVR make their own Speed Six engine, at 'around' 1000 units a year..
Before anyone else says, fit a ford v8. It won't fit, be to heavy, the whole point of the tuscan is the straight 6, and the low bonnet ( the engine actually lays quite a few degrees onto its side)
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Thursday 22 April 11:17
Remember the Spyker engine, is already certified for the USA as it's made by AUDI. AT a very large economy of scale.
Whereas TVR make their own Speed Six engine, at 'around' 1000 units a year..
Before anyone else says, fit a ford v8. It won't fit, be to heavy, the whole point of the tuscan is the straight 6, and the low bonnet ( the engine actually lays quite a few degrees onto its side)
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Thursday 22 April 11:17
jpf said:
I thought the Speed 6 met EU emission requirements--if the Speed 6 did, the US emission couldn't be that more stingent?
I have been told that the Speed Six meets strigent EU4 requirements.
The problem isn't passing the US tests, it is the expense of having to take them. It isn't like driving a car to the corner garage and having them stick a probe into the tailpipe. It costs milions and takes a long time for the tests to be conducted.
The fact of the matter is that it just doesn't make financial sense for TVR to tackle the well-protected North American market. They could never sell enough cars to recoup the expense of crossing the pond.
I completely understand why they are happy to concentrate on building European marketshare.
If Americans want to import TVRs, they'll have to convince Congress to pass a law allowing them to import them and register them the same way kit cars are registered in the US.
jpf said:
Why does Ferrari, Lotus and Lamborgini go through the hassle to sell less than 1,000 cars each?
Weak response, Jon.
Because for them )ferrari/lambo especially it is a very large market for them... Lotus use someone elses engine (toyota/rover- so allready verified)
TVR would be starting from scratch... If TVR want to double their sales, they have the potential to do this in Europe, at minimal cost to them.
B
It is all down to the individual companies, they decide what they want to spend their money on and what their priorities are - TVR don't seem keen on going in to the USA market for whatever reason (be it the costs of type approval, the costs of setting up a dealer network, not liking the national speed limit, not wanting to bother getting their cars to run on different fuels, Peter Wheeler just not wanting to -who knows) but Lotus, Ferrari, Lambo decided they DO want to do it
You have to remember this is a privately owned company and as such PW has no one to answer to but himself, there are no investors or shareholders to please with big returns, so he can do what he pleases and this rarely is what anyone expects! But look at the results, TVR have grown in stature and respectability over the PW years so he must be doing something right (and didn't TVR go bust when selling in the USA?)
Anyway, we can argue all we like, in the end TVR do not sell in the USA yet, maybe they will soon, maybe they wont, we will just have to wait and see
Just my 2 cents worth
Graham
You have to remember this is a privately owned company and as such PW has no one to answer to but himself, there are no investors or shareholders to please with big returns, so he can do what he pleases and this rarely is what anyone expects! But look at the results, TVR have grown in stature and respectability over the PW years so he must be doing something right (and didn't TVR go bust when selling in the USA?)
Anyway, we can argue all we like, in the end TVR do not sell in the USA yet, maybe they will soon, maybe they wont, we will just have to wait and see
Just my 2 cents worth
Graham
That is one nice looking Tuscan Graham!
Wonder where that photo was taken?
It's too bad about TVR in the USA, we
ve been waiting a long time but there are alot of unique alternatives. Ginetta G4 or even G12 ($75,000+ ?) are available. Leading edge's Tommy Kaira sport car should be available. Caterham 7's, the Ultima GTR is a fantastic car here. They ain't the tiv but they do allow alot of individuality in the spec you choose. The engines are all easily serviced (mostly american lumps).
I often pondered how a person could retire to the UK from the USA but be based out of a tax haven like all the WRC and F1 drivers.
>> Edited by PiB on Saturday 1st May 23:24
Wonder where that photo was taken?
It's too bad about TVR in the USA, we
ve been waiting a long time but there are alot of unique alternatives. Ginetta G4 or even G12 ($75,000+ ?) are available. Leading edge's Tommy Kaira sport car should be available. Caterham 7's, the Ultima GTR is a fantastic car here. They ain't the tiv but they do allow alot of individuality in the spec you choose. The engines are all easily serviced (mostly american lumps).
I often pondered how a person could retire to the UK from the USA but be based out of a tax haven like all the WRC and F1 drivers.
>> Edited by PiB on Saturday 1st May 23:24
Cheers PiB
The picture was taken in the French Alps somewhere north of Nice - not quite sure where as I had got a bit lost!
Had just been on a 2 week tour of France, Le Mans, then down near Nice for my mates wedding, then Monaco and back up through the Alps - which is where I 'took the scenic route' and doubled back somehow - was all good fun though, even driving on less than a gallon looking for a filling station
Graham
The picture was taken in the French Alps somewhere north of Nice - not quite sure where as I had got a bit lost!
Had just been on a 2 week tour of France, Le Mans, then down near Nice for my mates wedding, then Monaco and back up through the Alps - which is where I 'took the scenic route' and doubled back somehow - was all good fun though, even driving on less than a gallon looking for a filling station
Graham
Spyker is a totally different sort of car. It's three times the price of a TVR, has extreme build quality and uses the Audi engine which makes it easier to export to the USA. I met Maarten de Bruijn, (he started with the idea and is the designer) when it was in the concept stage and he didn't have a financier. we spend an hour having coffee and wondering around the prototype and explaining his ideas for improvements. Even then it was a great car and it developed into something fantastic.
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