Poll: F1 Q3 Format
Total Members Polled: 47
Discussion
Just wondering what our thoughts are about Q3. At the moment, we have the issue of some drivers not wanting to do a Q3 run to conserve tyres. We also have traffic issues when all drivers try to do their fastest time in the last few minutes of the session.
I think perhaps a new format should be considered: a shootout style qualifying session, with the top 10 drivers all doing a single flying lap to set their grid position. They will run in reverse Q2 order: the slowest Q2 driver running first and the fastest Q2 driver running last. Each car will depart maybe 1 minute apart from each other from the pit lane, so as to avoid traffic problems.
There are two main downsides to this idea: mixed-weather sessions will make it a lottery, and in dry conditions the fastest Q2 driver will be artificially favoured by running last.
The benefits are: team, driver, and sponsor exposure; good for fans because we get to see all the top 10 do a lap; it will highlight the most skilled and composed drivers who are able to extract the maximum in just one opportunity.
What do people here think about this?
I think perhaps a new format should be considered: a shootout style qualifying session, with the top 10 drivers all doing a single flying lap to set their grid position. They will run in reverse Q2 order: the slowest Q2 driver running first and the fastest Q2 driver running last. Each car will depart maybe 1 minute apart from each other from the pit lane, so as to avoid traffic problems.
There are two main downsides to this idea: mixed-weather sessions will make it a lottery, and in dry conditions the fastest Q2 driver will be artificially favoured by running last.
The benefits are: team, driver, and sponsor exposure; good for fans because we get to see all the top 10 do a lap; it will highlight the most skilled and composed drivers who are able to extract the maximum in just one opportunity.
What do people here think about this?
Edited by Jungles on Sunday 27th November 09:33
The "extra set" idea is good, but wont it lead to a similar situation we have now where some drivers don't go out in Q3 so they can have tyre choice ? e.g. run prime in Q2 to get through then run option in Q3 for grid place, allowing them to start on the hard tyre for strategy reasons ?
Any driver not able to complete a lap in any qualifying session gets a 3 place grid penalty. Don't fancy running in Q3? Then start 13th instead of 10th. The problem, of course, is that it might be preferable to not make it through to Q3 and start from 11th with a spare set of tyres. But I think it would be sufficiently hard to judge that it wouldn't be a problem in reality.
I prefer the simple solutions.
Can't we have a situation where for every car that doesn't do a run in Q3 the spectators get 10% of their entrance money back? Or how about those who show their contempt for spectators being taken out the back and given a good kicking?
Or for something a bit more exciting: if they don't want to drive then they have to walk back to their hotel through Sao Paulo carrying their gear and wearing their expensive watches.
Whilst I think Coulthard's suggestion is a good one, it lacks imagination.
Can't we have a situation where for every car that doesn't do a run in Q3 the spectators get 10% of their entrance money back? Or how about those who show their contempt for spectators being taken out the back and given a good kicking?
Or for something a bit more exciting: if they don't want to drive then they have to walk back to their hotel through Sao Paulo carrying their gear and wearing their expensive watches.
Whilst I think Coulthard's suggestion is a good one, it lacks imagination.
Simple is usually better.
The current format seems to work well and the spectators understand what it's about, so the easiest thing to change and which will not affect the spectators understanding of what's going on is to remove the option of choosing your tyres to start the race on if you don't run in Q3. Make it a simple rule that all Q3 cars must start on the tyres they made their fastest qualifying lap on - regardless of session.
You'll find the only cars who are quick enough to make it to Q3 on hard tyres are the ones who have a shot at pole if they run on soft. So they won't waste that opportunity.
If the likes of Mercedes and Force India knew they'd have to start on the softs from Q2 unless they go faster, then the opportunity to start one or two places higher up the grid becomes one worth pursuing because they can't gain any tyre advantage if they don't run.
So, nothing changes for the cars or teams, just an amendment to one line in the rulebook.
The current format seems to work well and the spectators understand what it's about, so the easiest thing to change and which will not affect the spectators understanding of what's going on is to remove the option of choosing your tyres to start the race on if you don't run in Q3. Make it a simple rule that all Q3 cars must start on the tyres they made their fastest qualifying lap on - regardless of session.
You'll find the only cars who are quick enough to make it to Q3 on hard tyres are the ones who have a shot at pole if they run on soft. So they won't waste that opportunity.
If the likes of Mercedes and Force India knew they'd have to start on the softs from Q2 unless they go faster, then the opportunity to start one or two places higher up the grid becomes one worth pursuing because they can't gain any tyre advantage if they don't run.
So, nothing changes for the cars or teams, just an amendment to one line in the rulebook.
Give everyone 1 hour, 12 laps and let them start the race on the tyres they set the fastest time with.
You dont go out, you start at the back, you dont go on the softs, you get slower cars on soft starting ahead of you. All cars out at any time so traffic can become a factor also.
Sometimes the rules get played around with too much, but a single session, restricted number of laps format seems the best for me.
You dont go out, you start at the back, you dont go on the softs, you get slower cars on soft starting ahead of you. All cars out at any time so traffic can become a factor also.
Sometimes the rules get played around with too much, but a single session, restricted number of laps format seems the best for me.
Crafty_ said:
The "extra set" idea is good, but wont it lead to a similar situation we have now where some drivers don't go out in Q3 so they can have tyre choice ? e.g. run prime in Q2 to get through then run option in Q3 for grid place, allowing them to start on the hard tyre for strategy reasons ?
How could giving the drivers a free set result in a situation where they don't go out?If they set their fastest time in Q2 on the hard tyre then they start on the hard tyre - this seems quite fair to me - why would it be a problem? The reality is even the RedBulls are burning a set of softs in Q2 so it seems a risky strategy to possibly miss out on Q3 altogether.
how about all driver get randomly drawn into three groups of 8, bear with me, they have one session each of 20 minutes which sorts out the order of each group, the fastest lap of each group also get put in order so outright fastest starts first, second fastest starts 9th and third fastest starts 17th....or those groupd could be ordered by random draw too, anybody who doesn't post a time goes to the back? I know it's a ridiculous idea but wouldnt that be interesting - or success weight penalty in quali only, say 30kg if you won the last race, 15kg for second and 5kg for third? take that back out for the race...
Simplest way is that you are not allowed to keep new tyres for the race if you get through to Q3 - You have to have done at least one flying lap on each race set.
This way, the fast guys will save sets for Q3, but then make the most of them. Also means that those who go out in q1 and 2 will have a race advantage which will also make better viewing.
This way, the fast guys will save sets for Q3, but then make the most of them. Also means that those who go out in q1 and 2 will have a race advantage which will also make better viewing.
Simply say that everyone who gets through to Q3 starts on the tyre that set their fastest lap at any point during qualifying. That way if you fail to run in Q3, you start the race on the tyres you qualified with in Q2.
It doesn't prevent a bailout completely because staying in the pits still means keeping one set of tyres fresh, but it takes away the advantage of starting on your choice of tyre so could leave you vulnerable to those starting 11th etc who will be on better rubber, therefore you'd be better off in 8th on used softs than 10th on used softs.
It doesn't prevent a bailout completely because staying in the pits still means keeping one set of tyres fresh, but it takes away the advantage of starting on your choice of tyre so could leave you vulnerable to those starting 11th etc who will be on better rubber, therefore you'd be better off in 8th on used softs than 10th on used softs.
LocoBlade said:
Simply say that everyone who gets through to Q3 starts on the tyre that set their fastest lap at any point during qualifying. That way if you fail to run in Q3, you start the race on the tyres you qualified with in Q2.
It doesn't prevent a bailout completely because staying in the pits still means keeping one set of tyres fresh, but it takes away the advantage of starting on your choice of tyre so could leave you vulnerable to those starting 11th etc who will be on better rubber, therefore you'd be better off in 8th on used softs than 10th on used softs.
Yup, what I said. It doesn't prevent a bailout completely because staying in the pits still means keeping one set of tyres fresh, but it takes away the advantage of starting on your choice of tyre so could leave you vulnerable to those starting 11th etc who will be on better rubber, therefore you'd be better off in 8th on used softs than 10th on used softs.
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