When will Button take responsibility?
Discussion
Time and time again I see JB blaming this, that and the other about the Honda / other drivers / the fact he has to drive a whole race distance / the weather / tyres etc ad nauseum.
I have *never* seen him actually admit he wasn't quick enough on the day, or that he just made a few errors which together with car problems meant he couldn't get a decent result. Everyone else (particularly JPM) seems to have far less trouble owning up to their mistakes and failings. Button's worse than Mansell at this, by far.
The fact is that he's done 108gp's now (only 14 less than Hill over his whole career) and has 13 podiums and 3 pole positions to his record. I just can't see him as any sort of great British hope, more likely is that he'll spend the rest of his career as an also ran.
Bring on Gary Paffett and Lewis Hamilton.
I have *never* seen him actually admit he wasn't quick enough on the day, or that he just made a few errors which together with car problems meant he couldn't get a decent result. Everyone else (particularly JPM) seems to have far less trouble owning up to their mistakes and failings. Button's worse than Mansell at this, by far.
The fact is that he's done 108gp's now (only 14 less than Hill over his whole career) and has 13 podiums and 3 pole positions to his record. I just can't see him as any sort of great British hope, more likely is that he'll spend the rest of his career as an also ran.
Bring on Gary Paffett and Lewis Hamilton.
I have to confess this crossed my mind when watching the GP, I am definitely losing my patience with him.
There can't be a single component left on that car which hasn't been looked at, improved or fixed over the time he has been with BAR/Honda. He's the only component left as-is over that time. Honda's approach to motorsport always yields good results, they just don't allow it not to. To blame people with their track record, to say that the problem is with their methods and their employees, is a rotten thing to do.
Whenever I watch Button race, he seems more concerned with stopping the guy behind from overtaking him than getting past the guy in front. If he was going to be any kind of a great F1 driver, never mind F1 champion, he would have won a race by now.
My better half and I always gauge how well he is doing by how far away he is from 5th place...
There can't be a single component left on that car which hasn't been looked at, improved or fixed over the time he has been with BAR/Honda. He's the only component left as-is over that time. Honda's approach to motorsport always yields good results, they just don't allow it not to. To blame people with their track record, to say that the problem is with their methods and their employees, is a rotten thing to do.
Whenever I watch Button race, he seems more concerned with stopping the guy behind from overtaking him than getting past the guy in front. If he was going to be any kind of a great F1 driver, never mind F1 champion, he would have won a race by now.
My better half and I always gauge how well he is doing by how far away he is from 5th place...
stumartin said:
Time and time again I see JB blaming this, that and the other about the Honda / other drivers / the fact he has to drive a whole race distance / the weather / tyres etc ad nauseum.
I have *never* seen him actually admit he wasn't quick enough on the day, or that he just made a few errors which together with car problems meant he couldn't get a decent result. Everyone else (particularly JPM) seems to have far less trouble owning up to their mistakes and failings. Button's worse than Mansell at this, by far.
The fact is that he's done 108gp's now (only 14 less than Hill over his whole career) and has 13 podiums and 3 pole positions to his record. I just can't see him as any sort of great British hope, more likely is that he'll spend the rest of his career as an also ran.
Bring on Gary Paffett and Lewis Hamilton.
If you look at the laptimes you will see that the first set of tyres were rubbish, after his pitstop he made changes to the car and another set of tyres and his laptimes were much better, he set 10th best lap of the race, but because of the poor first stint it was too late to do anything.
Double world champion Mika Hakkinen too 96 races before he won a race, supreme talents like Chris Amon never won a race at all. The Honda is not a car capable or winning so far this year, like it hasn't been in BAR guise. It doesn't matter what the driver is capable of if the car isn't up to the job they won't be able to win.
runnersp said:
I have to feel sorry for the guy because the amount of pressure he gets from the British media is insane
Yes, the trouble with the British media is that they only seem capable of following one driver. Johnny Herbert was pretty much ignored in comparison. DC is probably ignored for not being 'English'.
However, I think he does bring a lot of the attention on himself, as he's always willing to talk himself up.
I'd have a lot more respect for someone who keeps themselves to themselves, quietly plugging away until success comes. Compare Alonso's indistinct Oxford life to Button's 'look at me I'm a F1 driver who lives in Monaco'.
Great result for DC btw.
magic torch said:
However, I think he does bring a lot of the attention on himself, as he's always willing to talk himself up.
Nothing wrong in that, I never see a winning sportsman or woman in any sport who says they aren't going to do their best, try their hardest, beat the others or other such statement. Saying you have no chance or have no chance to win is defeatist. Which is a good reason I hate the typically english mentality of "it's not the winning it's the taking part that counts". No it isn't, anything other than winning is losing. You have to "big yourself up" before any race, believe you can win and the way to do it is to say it to anyone who'll listen as they will agree with you and support you and make you feel as if you can do it.
FourWheelDrift said:
However, I think he does bring a lot of the attention on himself, as he's always willing to talk himself up.
Nothing wrong in that, I never see a winning sportsman or woman in any sport who says they aren't going to do their best, try their hardest, beat the others or other such statement. Saying you have no chance or have no chance to win is defeatist. Which is a good reason I hate the typically english mentality of "it's not the winning it's the taking part that counts". No it isn't, anything other than winning is losing. You have to "big yourself up" before any race, believe you can win and the way to do it is to say it to anyone who'll listen as they will agree with you and support you and make you feel as if you can do it.
That isn't what I was getting at, I wouldn't want to hear him say "I've got no chance".
But, there's only so long you tell people you're the greatest without producing a result, or at least beating your team mate.
What annoys me the most is the media's obsession with one driver at any one time. There's a wealth of British talent out there, lets 'big them up' too.
magic torch said:
However, I think he does bring a lot of the attention on himself, as he's always willing to talk himself up.
Nothing wrong in that, I never see a winning sportsman or woman in any sport who says they aren't going to do their best, try their hardest, beat the others or other such statement. Saying you have no chance or have no chance to win is defeatist. Which is a good reason I hate the typically english mentality of "it's not the winning it's the taking part that counts". No it isn't, anything other than winning is losing. You have to "big yourself up" before any race, believe you can win and the way to do it is to say it to anyone who'll listen as they will agree with you and support you and make you feel as if you can do it.
That isn't what I was getting at, I wouldn't want to hear him say "I've got no chance".
But, there's only so long you tell people you're the greatest without producing a result, or at least beating your team mate.
What annoys me the most is the media's obsession with one driver at any one time. There's a wealth of British talent out there, lets 'big them up' too.
I wasn't aware that Button proclaims himself to be 'the greatest'. Are you sure?
magic torch said:
There's a wealth of British talent out there, lets 'big them up' too.
Yes, I very much agree. Like rooting for Lewis Hamilton - I'd like to see him in a middling team such as Red Bull next year to cut his teeth, Button's proved that launching into a major team can be fatal.
I'd also like to see Gary Paffett in the second McLaren seat next year - the 2005 DTM champion who gave up his drive to be McLaren's test driver this year; now that's a show of commitment and determination worthy of reward.
I think Button is a genuinely quick driver, he has shown it many times but there is always another car just as quick with a better strategy. Towards the end of last season he was showing good pace because the car was good, he got some podiums and showed he was a talented driver. This season he has been having trouble after a good start.
What is interesting is that when Barichello was saying the car was difficult to drive becuase you needed to be smooth, Button was doing well. But as they've developed the car its resulted in Barichello having better finshes and Button dropping down the grid. He has a very different driving style to others in F1 and it seems to be very tricky to get a chassis that suits him.
What is interesting is that when Barichello was saying the car was difficult to drive becuase you needed to be smooth, Button was doing well. But as they've developed the car its resulted in Barichello having better finshes and Button dropping down the grid. He has a very different driving style to others in F1 and it seems to be very tricky to get a chassis that suits him.
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