BTCC legend John Cleland...

[F.M]

Nice video montage with good footage..Pity they wrere all FWD after the early 90`s...but truly entertained me as a youngster every weekend watching the races on TV..

www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsz8WscOMTo&search=BTCC

www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtzRC1j8dn4&search=BTCC

Edited by F.M on Thursday 3rd August 19:31

[fidgits]

i was a huge fan of his as a teenager...

when he left BTCC it was never the same..

[anonymous-user]

imho john cleland was responsible for the decreasing driving standards in touring cars now witnessed. i always thought he came across as an arrogaant jock who complained bitterly if anyone used his level of tactics against him... he could dish it out but he could never take it. i was always an andy rouse or a steve soper fan.

[eccles]

i always liked cleland, to me he was just about the last of the old school drivers that didn't tow the team/sponsor line in post race interviews. none of this 'making sure the race suit collar is done up to show off the sponsors logo' (despite sweating pints on a hot day!), if he thought the team had done a bad job he said it, if he thought someones driving was crap he just said it, which i always thought was much better than the bland team line.

having said that, some of the recent exchanges between matt neal and jason plato seem to match john clelands level of bluntness!

[GarrettMacD]

pablo said:

imho john cleland was responsible for the decreasing driving standards in touring cars now witnessed. i always thought he came across as an arrogaant jock who complained bitterly if anyone used his level of tactics against him... he could dish it out but he could never take it. i was always an andy rouse or a steve soper fan.

Ironic that you're a Steve Soper fan. It was Soper who knocked Cleland off the track in the final round of the 1992 BTCC, handing the title to Tim Harvey. Soper and Harvey were team mates, but any suggestions that Soper did it deliberately to hand the title to Harvey were immediately ignored by TOCA.

I agree that Cleland was a bit of a whinger, but disagree that he was a dirty driver. He maybe over-drove the car on occasion, resulting in the odd bang here and there, but he's very much an amateur, compared to the 'professional' antics of Neal, Plato, etc.

[chassis 33]

I think he he was a quick driver, but let the red mist descend occasionally, for example 1995...or was it 96 at Brands in the last season of the Caviler, pissing it down he leaves the track, for whatever reason, can't remember if he was pushed or if he fell, the long and the short of it he ended up effectively a lap down, then starts to race the leaders as they come round, he out brakes himself and ends up in the kitty litter at Paddock Hill.

I think it was the same weekend Rydell rolled out the back of the circuit when his throttle stuck open.

Regards
Iain

[JonRB]

Everyone is using the past tense. Has he died then?

[chassis 33]

Not as far as I'm aware, he's just not racing much these days. Saw him out testing with his son and his son's Mini Cooper at Mallory last September, think he's more into management that driving these days.

Regards
Iain

[HAB]

pablo said:

imho john cleland was responsible for the decreasing driving standards in touring cars now witnessed. i always thought he came across as an arrogaant jock who complained bitterly if anyone used his level of tactics against him... he could dish it out but he could never take it. i was always an andy rouse or a steve soper fan.

Yes! Yes! Its Cleland that must take responsibiliy for how the current BTCC drivers conduct themselves on track.

What a load of complete Boll*cks.

Edited by HAB on Saturday 5th August 15:34

[fidgits]

GarrettMacD said:

pablo said:

imho john cleland was responsible for the decreasing driving standards in touring cars now witnessed. i always thought he came across as an arrogaant jock who complained bitterly if anyone used his level of tactics against him... he could dish it out but he could never take it. i was always an andy rouse or a steve soper fan.

Ironic that you're a Steve Soper fan. It was Soper who knocked Cleland off the track in the final round of the 1992 BTCC, handing the title to Tim Harvey. Soper and Harvey were team mates, but any suggestions that Soper did it deliberately to hand the title to Harvey were immediately ignored by TOCA.

I agree that Cleland was a bit of a whinger, but disagree that he was a dirty driver. He maybe over-drove the car on occasion, resulting in the odd bang here and there, but he's very much an amateur, compared to the 'professional' antics of Neal, Plato, etc.

I'm with Garrett there - the Soper incident was actully last lap, Cleland behind Harvey in the world championship fight, if the positions remained John would've taken the title, Steve Soper pretty much ran Cleland off the road to get in front (and giving Harvey the point gap he needed), Cleland fought back - went up the inside, hit the kerb putting his cav on two wheels which lent onto Sopers car but fairly gained the position, then soper just drove straight into the side of the Vauxhall at the next bend - not even braking or trying to go around the corner.

And i think you'll find, if you search back, following that incident it was reccomended to Soper that he seek employment in other racing series, whereas John continued for many years, but never had the car underneath him.

As for the comment on it being his fault about todays banger racing - he was actually one of the cleaner drivers on the circuit, and only occasionally let the red mist get in the way - the Brands incident being one, where he lost it on cold tyres and only took himself off - no-one else.

[LongQ]

chassis 33 said:

Not as far as I'm aware, he's just not racing much these days. Saw him out testing with his son and his son's Mini Cooper at Mallory last September, think he's more into management that driving these days.

Regards
Iain

Saw him at Donington a few weeks ago when the Scottish Coopers raced there.

[KJR]

LongQ said:

chassis 33 said:

Not as far as I'm aware, he's just not racing much these days. Saw him out testing with his son and his son's Mini Cooper at Mallory last September, think he's more into management that driving these days.

Regards
Iain

Saw him at Donington a few weeks ago when the Scottish Coopers raced there.

His son is competing in that championship.

John is/was also a regular at Bathurst in the V8 Supercars .

[regional]

Where he hit Plato up the arse at 130mph whilst Plato had a puncture.

[MoJocvh]

fidgits said:

GarrettMacD said:

pablo said:

imho john cleland was responsible for the decreasing driving standards in touring cars now witnessed. i always thought he came across as an arrogaant jock who complained bitterly if anyone used his level of tactics against him... he could dish it out but he could never take it. i was always an andy rouse or a steve soper fan.

Ironic that you're a Steve Soper fan. It was Soper who knocked Cleland off the track in the final round of the 1992 BTCC, handing the title to Tim Harvey. Soper and Harvey were team mates, but any suggestions that Soper did it deliberately to hand the title to Harvey were immediately ignored by TOCA.

I agree that Cleland was a bit of a whinger, but disagree that he was a dirty driver. He maybe over-drove the car on occasion, resulting in the odd bang here and there, but he's very much an amateur, compared to the 'professional' antics of Neal, Plato, etc.

I'm with Garrett there - the Soper incident was actully last lap, Cleland behind Harvey in the world championship fight, if the positions remained John would've taken the title, Steve Soper pretty much ran Cleland off the road to get in front (and giving Harvey the point gap he needed), Cleland fought back - went up the inside, hit the kerb putting his cav on two wheels which lent onto Sopers car but fairly gained the position, then soper just drove straight into the side of the Vauxhall at the next bend - not even braking or trying to go around the corner.

And i think you'll find, if you search back, following that incident it was reccomended to Soper that he seek employment in other racing series, whereas John continued for many years, but never had the car underneath him.

As for the comment on it being his fault about todays banger racing - he was actually one of the cleaner drivers on the circuit, and only occasionally let the red mist get in the way - the Brands incident being one, where he lost it on cold tyres and only took himself off - no-one else.

Thats going back a bit but I remember that! wasnt it a BMW stichup? (sorry french keyboard!)