Diffusers Legal

[stifler]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/73915

Well Done Scrutineers.

[Cara Van Man]

yep, just heard it on the radio....great news!

Come on Jens!

[Asterix]

Excellent - I can't see an appeal making any difference now.

touch wood - let the racing begin and let us leave all this nonsense behind.

Edited by Asterix on Thursday 26th March 13:01

[shoestring7]

Can someone please explain this fuss for me? I understand that some teams feel the diffuser designs have been used for some time and are legal, and others feel they aren't, but what exactly is the point of dispute?

SS7

[ajprice]

Well done to the scrutineers, but don't get happy just yet...

said:

It is expected that the teams will appeal against the stewards' decision, which will force the matter to go to a hearing of the FIA's International Court of Appeal.

Such a meeting cannot take place until after the Malaysian Grand Prix, meaning that Brawn GP, Williams and Toyota will unofficially be racing under appeal at this weekend's race in Australia and would likely be subject to another appeal in Sepang.

[spitfire-ian]

More discussion here...

http://pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f...

[Jungles]

Now the protesting teams have... (checks the clock)... 40 minutes to inform the FIA of their intention to appeal.

I can't see any particular reason why the ICA will rule against The Three. The FIA tech group have said OK, Charlie Whiting said OK, scrutineers have said OK - twice. So that's four times that the designs have been OK'ed.

[Scuffers]

good call....

can we just get on with it now?

[Alex97]

Excellent news. Come on Tim! err sorry i mean Jensen

[stephen300o]

Brilliant news, Brawn, Williams and Toyota now have a chance to get in the championship.

[Altrezia]

excellent!!

[burnt]

stephen300o said:

Brilliant news, Brawn, Williams and Toyota now have a chance to get in the championship.

Well for one race anyway. All teams will have this design come Sepang

[Asterix]

burnt said:

stephen300o said:

Brilliant news, Brawn, Williams and Toyota now have a chance to get in the championship.

Well for one race anyway. All teams will have this design come Sepang

Except RedBull if their suspension set up doesn't allow it!

[stephen300o]

Asterix said:

burnt said:

stephen300o said:

Brilliant news, Brawn, Williams and Toyota now have a chance to get in the championship.

Well for one race anyway. All teams will have this design come Sepang

Except RedBull if their suspension set up doesn't allow it!

Would that be Toro Rosso too?, I suppose different engine = different gearbox = different rear suspension ?

Not sure everyone will catch up till europe with all the back to back flyaways.

[Cara Van Man]

The race is on for the other teams to design alternative diffusers then.....

[FNG]

burnt said:

stephen300o said:

Brilliant news, Brawn, Williams and Toyota now have a chance to get in the championship.

Well for one race anyway. All teams will have this design come Sepang

True, but the three teams above have been working on cars using this diffuser principle for a year already, and that extends into the rest of the car not just the treatment at the rear.

I can't believe that the other teams haven't already started work on the newly (re)approved design just in case it passed scrutineering, but they are a long way behind.

On the one hand they have had a good look at how the Brawn car works.

On the other, their cars aren't optimised for similar design strategies and they have limited testing.

I don't think just throwing on a new rear crash structure will find 0.5s and give a nicely balanced car, but they should be closer.

[Asterix]

stephen300o said:

Asterix said:

burnt said:

stephen300o said:

Brilliant news, Brawn, Williams and Toyota now have a chance to get in the championship.

Well for one race anyway. All teams will have this design come Sepang

Except RedBull if their suspension set up doesn't allow it!

Would that be Toro Rosso too?, I suppose different engine = different gearbox = different rear suspension ?

Not sure everyone will catch up till europe with all the back to back flyaways.

Not sure tbh - haven't done my homework well enough to know.

[IainT]

Asterix said:

stephen300o said:

Asterix said:

burnt said:

stephen300o said:

Brilliant news, Brawn, Williams and Toyota now have a chance to get in the championship.

Well for one race anyway. All teams will have this design come Sepang

Except RedBull if their suspension set up doesn't allow it!

Would that be Toro Rosso too?, I suppose different engine = different gearbox = different rear suspension ?

Not sure everyone will catch up till europe with all the back to back flyaways.

Not sure tbh - haven't done my homework well enough to know.

IIRC all the teams use push-rod suspension apart from RB who use a pull system with different angles for the components thus precluding this type of design.

[Jungles]

It's not really the angles. It's the location of the gearbox. In the RB5, the gearbox is some 15cm lower than the other teams' thanks to the pull-rod system.

But no, that doesn't really make the double-decker diffuser impossible. It just makes for a heck of a lot of work, because RB5's rear crash structure was designed for a diffuser of uniform height. They can remake it to accommodate a double-decker diffuser with its high centre section, but it means a lot of work and the need to pass another crash test due to redesign.

[FNG]

Asterix said:

stephen300o said:

Asterix said:

burnt said:

stephen300o said:

Brilliant news, Brawn, Williams and Toyota now have a chance to get in the championship.

Well for one race anyway. All teams will have this design come Sepang

Except RedBull if their suspension set up doesn't allow it!

Would that be Toro Rosso too?, I suppose different engine = different gearbox = different rear suspension ?

Not sure everyone will catch up till europe with all the back to back flyaways.

Not sure tbh - haven't done my homework well enough to know.

Just an educated guess, but as they're using pullrods and therefore relocating the springs, dampers and ARB down low instead of over the gearbox like everyone else, the primary benefits are lower CofG and a tighter bodywork package above the gearbox, so smoother / neater airflow.

The gearbox casing will be designed specifically for the suspension mounts and clearances for coilovers and roll bars, plus rear bodywork is now too tight, so they have a big job ahead to redevelop compared to everyone else who are doubtless cranking up the second windtunnel as I type, if they haven't already.

Pullrods are unfashionable but the only major disadvantage I can think of is lack of access for adjustment or replacement. Which is less and less important these days as aero is king, and mechanical grip somewhat more incidental.

Newey likely thought the lack of access to adjust was worth the very neat rear end aero and lower centre of gravity, and now he's well and truly on the back foot.

I bet he's also very very annoyed at missing the same interpretation as Brawn, Williams and Toyota cos if he had thought of it and perceived it as a viable and legal solution, there's no way he could have justified pullrods.