WRC vs F1 - Which needs more skill/courage ?
Discussion
I was watching some of the in-car footage from the Rally Finland the other day, and some of it seemed genuinely scary. It got me thinking - which out of F1 / Rallying needs the biggest cajones?
(in terms of drivers needing "A lack of imagination" )
I had a chat with a mate who was a bit of an ace karter back in the day, ,and he reckoned that F1 needed more skill do due racecraft ,fitness ,etc but my point is more towards the physical courage needed to do it .
I do realise that if you think about consequence in any form of motorsport you are screwed, but in rallying the consequences just seem that bit more obvious, IE scenery (or lack of it!) flashing by a few feet from your side window at crazy speeds.
Which one do you think needs the most courage to get the most out of the car?
(Apologies if this is not phrased too well - too much wine)
(in terms of drivers needing "A lack of imagination" )
I had a chat with a mate who was a bit of an ace karter back in the day, ,and he reckoned that F1 needed more skill do due racecraft ,fitness ,etc but my point is more towards the physical courage needed to do it .
I do realise that if you think about consequence in any form of motorsport you are screwed, but in rallying the consequences just seem that bit more obvious, IE scenery (or lack of it!) flashing by a few feet from your side window at crazy speeds.
Which one do you think needs the most courage to get the most out of the car?
(Apologies if this is not phrased too well - too much wine)
I would imagine that F1 is a more 'physical' sport, but WRC requires more marbles. IMO, of course.
Then again, surely it's swings and roundabouts. Different sports that require different skill sets. I would say that, to compare them like-for-like on raw driver skill, the WRC driver would be "better" than the F1 driver.
Then again, surely it's swings and roundabouts. Different sports that require different skill sets. I would say that, to compare them like-for-like on raw driver skill, the WRC driver would be "better" than the F1 driver.
This Side Down said:
I would imagine that F1 is a more 'physical' sport, but WRC requires more marbles. IMO, of course.
Then again, surely it's swings and roundabouts. Different sports that require different skill sets. I would say that, to compare them like-for-like on raw driver skill, the WRC driver would be "better" than the F1 driver.
I concur. I may be entirely wrong, but I would hazard a guess that an F1 driver would do better if thrown in a WRC car than the opposite..Then again, surely it's swings and roundabouts. Different sports that require different skill sets. I would say that, to compare them like-for-like on raw driver skill, the WRC driver would be "better" than the F1 driver.
Papoo said:
This Side Down said:
I would imagine that F1 is a more 'physical' sport, but WRC requires more marbles. IMO, of course.
Then again, surely it's swings and roundabouts. Different sports that require different skill sets. I would say that, to compare them like-for-like on raw driver skill, the WRC driver would be "better" than the F1 driver.
I concur. I may be entirely wrong, but I would hazard a guess that an F1 driver would do better if thrown in a WRC car than the opposite..Then again, surely it's swings and roundabouts. Different sports that require different skill sets. I would say that, to compare them like-for-like on raw driver skill, the WRC driver would be "better" than the F1 driver.
Modern WRC stars who have had a spin in an F1 car have been extremly close to the pace of the factory driver yet when F1 drivers have sat in a proper car they are usually way off the pace and it ends up in a ball of snot.
If you can pedal a car then you can pedal a car but when we are talking world class standard then the marker is relative. I would imagine steeping out of an environment where you have 120mph with trees two feet from the doors, blind crests, rock faces, ditches, mud / gravel / snow / tarmac, log piles and fresh air drops to contend with, along with having to decipher the information being fed to you via the intercom, then pounding round a relatively sanitised race circuit, where there is only one perfect line and not comparatively not that many variables, then it is a little easier to adapt.
I wonder why so many of this generation, and this seasons, F1 drivers are now trying their hand to rallying in their spare time?
Skill levels?
IMVHO, in order:
Rally
Motorcycle GP (2-stroke years) i.e. YZR500's / NS500's / NSR500's / Suzuki XR's
Endurance racers (1960 - 1972 & 1982 - 1992) i.e. GT40's / 904's / P3's / P4's / 917's / 512's / Matras / 956 / 962 / C9
F1 1970 - 1992
Motorcycle GP (4-stroke years) RC211V's etc
F1 1992 - present
IMVHO, in order:
Rally
Motorcycle GP (2-stroke years) i.e. YZR500's / NS500's / NSR500's / Suzuki XR's
Endurance racers (1960 - 1972 & 1982 - 1992) i.e. GT40's / 904's / P3's / P4's / 917's / 512's / Matras / 956 / 962 / C9
F1 1970 - 1992
Motorcycle GP (4-stroke years) RC211V's etc
F1 1992 - present
Regarding balls, I think anyone in top level motorsport of any chapter needs an unquestionable belief of self invincibility to succeed.
Rally drivers doing 120mph through the snow past trees may look more impressive than f1 boys pootling round their nice safe fat run-offs circuits, but they are both amused by the ridiculous thought they might crash.
regarding skill, not so much more-or less as optimised; I do think the lairy F1 drivers like hamilton and alonso would make the best rally drivers though, but thats not to say a good rally driver would make a good f1 driver- dancing an f1 car on the ragged edge of sanity is still millimeters and milliseconds.
Rally drivers doing 120mph through the snow past trees may look more impressive than f1 boys pootling round their nice safe fat run-offs circuits, but they are both amused by the ridiculous thought they might crash.
regarding skill, not so much more-or less as optimised; I do think the lairy F1 drivers like hamilton and alonso would make the best rally drivers though, but thats not to say a good rally driver would make a good f1 driver- dancing an f1 car on the ragged edge of sanity is still millimeters and milliseconds.
F1 have the money and time to manage the speed of the cars.
WRC let cars drive at trees and take 70+ foot leaps inexcess of 120mph.
F1 is a more controlled race format, with limits and boundarys.
WRC works on the principal of getting from A-B as quick as possible.
Big balls to both. However hitting a Norweigan pine at 70+mph, WRC.......
WRC let cars drive at trees and take 70+ foot leaps inexcess of 120mph.
F1 is a more controlled race format, with limits and boundarys.
WRC works on the principal of getting from A-B as quick as possible.
Big balls to both. However hitting a Norweigan pine at 70+mph, WRC.......
I was looking at the dragons in the pic and hoping wales....
As to the skill, while it takes a huge ammount of skill to thread a car through trees etc on loose surfaces, in F1 you get moving obstacles in the form of other cars so the skills you need are hugely different from that respect.
As to the skill, while it takes a huge ammount of skill to thread a car through trees etc on loose surfaces, in F1 you get moving obstacles in the form of other cars so the skills you need are hugely different from that respect.
Different skills needed for each, but overall I would put the top rally drivers above the top F1 drivers for skill.
As for courage/cajones, again I would put WRC drivers above F1, but for cajones you should check out some hillclimb footage, I am thinking Doune in particular, the guys taking big V8s and even a V10 up there have cajones so big I don't know how they manage to sit down.
As for courage/cajones, again I would put WRC drivers above F1, but for cajones you should check out some hillclimb footage, I am thinking Doune in particular, the guys taking big V8s and even a V10 up there have cajones so big I don't know how they manage to sit down.
Personally, the thought of plunging off a cliff at 100kph in a hatch-back car makes my testicles shrink, more than the thought of spearing off into catch-fencing at 200kph in an F1 car.
Having said that, I think drivers from both categories have similarly robust sets of marbles. Kimi Raikkonen did quite well in the Rally of Finland (3rd in Group N until he crashed), and four-times Australian rally champion Neal Bates was impressed by Timo Glock's test drive of his works Toyota Corolla S2000. If given the chance, F1 drivers would give WRC drivers plenty of worries in identical machinery.
Having said that, I think drivers from both categories have similarly robust sets of marbles. Kimi Raikkonen did quite well in the Rally of Finland (3rd in Group N until he crashed), and four-times Australian rally champion Neal Bates was impressed by Timo Glock's test drive of his works Toyota Corolla S2000. If given the chance, F1 drivers would give WRC drivers plenty of worries in identical machinery.
GravelBen said:
Interesting vid.Q: How often to drivers make mistakes on Pikes Peak?
A: Only once
As has been mentioned they both have the skills, but it has to be WRC for me.....just looks so much more exciting! WRC drivers have to adapt a lot more to the different road conditions then their F1 counterparts who run around the same tarmac for 60+ laps.
WRC just looks like more fun, which is why F1 drivers might be interested in doing it.
WRC just looks like more fun, which is why F1 drivers might be interested in doing it.
IMO I would say Rally Drivers. I have been fortunate enough to do both Racing and Rallying, albeit not F1 and WRC, but I would say at a high enough level to appreciate the differences.
I found in rallying that you require more natural car control/ability to do well than is required in Racing, especially if its dry using Slicks.
My experience with Rallying, is you only look at the road, not the tree’s, big drops etc, same with Hillclimbing [ Doune in particular ], if you did, you’d stop
Racing is much more controlled, you know exactly where your going, and not many nasty things to hit.
However, where racing scores over rallying, is especially if you are actually “racing” another competitor who is at a similar pace to you, is that you need to concentrate hard whilst driving at race speeds how to overtake etc, this is a big buzz, so I would say that to be a supreme racer, you also need a high level of intelligence.
Throw in some rain at a race, and anyone who has done well in rallying will literally drive around the outside of most race drivers, same goes for the first lap or so, where most Racing drivers need time to warm up, where as in rallying your have to be strait “on it” from the start.
As has been said here, Rally drivers will do better strait off given a swap between F1 and WRC, only needing time to get used to the downforce effect.
Skill then, Rally drivers any day, courage, both the same.
I found in rallying that you require more natural car control/ability to do well than is required in Racing, especially if its dry using Slicks.
My experience with Rallying, is you only look at the road, not the tree’s, big drops etc, same with Hillclimbing [ Doune in particular ], if you did, you’d stop
Racing is much more controlled, you know exactly where your going, and not many nasty things to hit.
However, where racing scores over rallying, is especially if you are actually “racing” another competitor who is at a similar pace to you, is that you need to concentrate hard whilst driving at race speeds how to overtake etc, this is a big buzz, so I would say that to be a supreme racer, you also need a high level of intelligence.
Throw in some rain at a race, and anyone who has done well in rallying will literally drive around the outside of most race drivers, same goes for the first lap or so, where most Racing drivers need time to warm up, where as in rallying your have to be strait “on it” from the start.
As has been said here, Rally drivers will do better strait off given a swap between F1 and WRC, only needing time to get used to the downforce effect.
Skill then, Rally drivers any day, courage, both the same.
I've always thought rally drivers were incredible, to throw a car into an 80 mph drift on a loose surface barely the width of your car and to place it so precisely that it sets you up for the next corner/sequence of corners takes incredible skill.
We've all seen the consequences of getting it wrong too, at almost every event someone can be seen barrel rolling their car multiple times because the margins are so small. In F1 you have a wide track and sufficient run off areas, enclosed by water filled barriers, in rallying you have scenery/spectators, I know which I'd rather have.
We've all seen the consequences of getting it wrong too, at almost every event someone can be seen barrel rolling their car multiple times because the margins are so small. In F1 you have a wide track and sufficient run off areas, enclosed by water filled barriers, in rallying you have scenery/spectators, I know which I'd rather have.
Got to agree with the majority so far. The speeds in F1 and unbelievable and the precision astounding. But, you only need to watch the in car footage from somewhere like Corsica or Finalnd to see who requires the bigger cajones. As for skill, hard to say as in many ways they're not that comparable. Certainly, it seems rally drivers perform better in F1 than vice versa.
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