Silverstone 24Hr fuel prices

[AlvinTaff]

Has anyone seen the fuel prices for the 24Hr race. Normally we run on standard pump fuel (V-Power) which has been cost £1 a litre + VAT. The fuel prices for the 24Hr race are £1.72 + VAT. Thats changed our fuel bill from £3500 to £6020. How do teams afford to run this fuel, especially the top running GT cars. Surely there must be another fuel

[Britcar David]

Wow, £1+VAT for V-Power, let me know where you can get that from, that'll save me a fortune on my road and race cars!

With the developments at Silverstone there is nowhere for us to put a seperate temporary fuel station as we've had in the past and there is far too much risk and logistical nightmare of 80 teams trying to transport and store 24hrs plus qualifying, warmup and testing of fuel individually so our only option was to go with a single supplier who could satisfy the MSA as to the safety of transportation and storage and could provide enough of a suitable range of fuels to satisfy the requirements of the competitors.

Anglo American Oli have offered us the best solution, alot of teams in our pitlane already use their product and they have the history, expertise and equipment to manage the fuel for every team.

And besides at the price quoted it's cheaper than the last 24hr in 2008 when it was about £1.97 per litre as we had to cover the cost of installing the fuel station.

If anyone would like to discuss please feel free to contact me in the office on 01252 834377

David

[MMC Andy]

AlvinTaff said:

Thats changed our fuel bill from £3500 to £6020.

Really, 2980 litres in (maximum / being generous) 32 hours of testing / qually & race in a Production Honda?

As David points out, 24 Hour regulars are celebrating the reduction in cost!

[Graham]

I'd have said just over 2quid a litre for race fuel supplied at the circuit was a reasonable deal..

when normal pump fuel never mind v power or 99 octane is 1.21 at my local tescos..

I only get it to about 3.6k inc vat for the fuel we'd expect to use on our 5 ltr v8 !!! at britcar prices. how the heck do you use 2 litres a minute in a civic !!! i think you must have a hole inthe tank

its not that significant against a 10 grand tyre bill

[RogueMotorsport]

Britcar David said:

Wow, £1+VAT for V-Power, let me know where you can get that from, that'll save me a fortune on my road and race cars!

£1.00+vat = £1.175. That's about what it costs in the Midlands...?

AlvinTaff said:

The fuel prices for the 24Hr race are £1.72 + VAT.

Britcar David said:

And besides at the price quoted it's cheaper than the last 24hr in 2008 when it was about £1.97 per litre as we had to cover the cost of installing the fuel station.

Wasn't it £1.97 including VAT in 2008? If the quoted price of £1.72 + VAT is correct then the price this year is 5p a litre more expensive.

David, please can you confirm both the price and specification on the fuel that will be available.

[Britcar David]

V Power is about £1.25 where I live.

You might be right about the 1.97 including VAT for the 24hrs in 2008, I must admit I just looked at the price and didn't check the Vat inclusive or exclusive arrangements. Assuming it was inclusive then yes then this years fuel at £1.72 is 5p more expensive than it was in 2008.

I apologise I should have got my VATS straight before I posted. However in AngloAmericans defence the price of regular pump fuel has gone up almost 9p according to the AA over a similar period.

As for the specification, you can run any fuel (petrol or diesel) Sunoco/Anglo American produce which conforms to the MSA Pump Fuel definition.

[teamHOLDENracing]

David - I think the question was 'what spec is the fuel which costs £1.78 + VAT a litre' ? EDited to say: £1.72 even!

Edited by teamHOLDENracing on Wednesday 14th July 15:11

[Britcar David]

I have no idea, that'd be a question for Anders at AAO. He is setting the prices and knows the specs though I suspect if this is the cheapest it'll be their 99 octane stuff.

[AlvinTaff]

Maths: £1/litre +VAT is £1.175 incl VAT.

The £1.72 is 99 to 99.5 Octane. I know this fuel will be exactly that octane and will be cleaner than pump fuel, but we are used to running on pump fuel and for us that is a huge increase in price. I understand Davids point about the fuel station, but it is possible to allow teams to use their own fuel and should be their responsibility to transport it correctly and safely.

We are running 2 cars so yes we will be using 3000 litres

Please don't see this as a direct dig at Britcar. Its a general moan that I'm sure a few other people have about the Monopoly on the fuel.

Edited by AlvinTaff on Wednesday 14th July 15:52

[Graham]

AlvinTaff said:

We are running 2 cars so yes we will be using 3000 litres

Ah that makes sense then.. I was trying to work out how you manage to use more fuel than a mosler !!

[Rude-boy]

AlvinTaff said:

Its a general moan that I'm sure a few other people have about the Monopoly on the fuel.

I'm sure you will appreciate that almost every long distance event requiring more than one fill up has only one go juice supplier.

[Britcar David]

Unfortunately the powers that be want more assurances than it being the responsibility of the competitor to transport and store all that fuel safely. Especially when members of the public are going to be wandering around.

[RogueMotorsport]

It's difficult to see how the costs stack up - in 2008 the cost for building and running a petrol station and the supply of fuel came to £1.97 / litre. In 2010 supply of fuel alone is £2.02 / litre. Theoretically at least this can be considered a net gain to the competitor since fuel prices have risen (quoting David) by 9p / litre over this time, but either the petrol station was very cheap or the new fuel is expensive.

The hidden cost in all of this is for those teams (like mine) now required to fit dry break fuelling systems. That adds around £4k to the project that neither the race organiser nor fuel supplier see.

We had a good idea of the costs before we entered (although IIRC fuel was quoted at a very reasonable £1.50 at Autosport - not mention of VAT on top) so it's something we're prepared to meet, and I'm not getting at anyone. It's just annoying to know that we're paying £2+ / litre when Silverstone has a BP petrol just metres from the garages selling fuel we could use for two thirds of the price. That would knock over £1000 off our running costs... Not to mention the Nectar points!

[Britcar David]

Unfortunately the Silverstone fuel station doesn't have the capacity to fill the grid for the race weekend.

The fuel to us in 2008 was alot cheaper as we got it direct from the supplier but we had to cover the cost of the fuel station which is what bumped the price up. The station was very expensive to install as correctly noted above.

For 2010 you are still getting the fuel delivered onsite (in fact to the back of your garage) but the fuel price is set by the supplier, we don't get involved in it. I presume some of the cost of the fuel from AAO is in their transport storage and delivery service whilst alot is in the creation of these special race fuel plus a little bit on top to keep the business ticking over.

As for the dry break kit, hopefully that will stop the fires we had in the refueling pits in 2008 by having a more secure system also I'd suggest going to someone like Think Automotive for the equipment as its alot cheaper than the prices quoted so I believe.

Nothing taken as a dig at Britcar, anything I can do to explain and make it all as transparent as possible I will do.

Edited by Britcar David on Wednesday 14th July 17:42

[RogueMotorsport]

Graham said:

I only get it to about 3.6k inc vat for the fuel we'd expect to use on our 5 ltr v8 !!! at britcar prices. how the heck do you use 2 litres a minute in a civic !!! i think you must have a hole inthe tank

Interestingly, that's the planning figure I have for our 3.5 litre V6. Hopefully testing will show we can revise that figure downwards!

[Graham]

RogueMotorsport said:

Graham said:

I only get it to about 3.6k inc vat for the fuel we'd expect to use on our 5 ltr v8 !!! at britcar prices. how the heck do you use 2 litres a minute in a civic !!! i think you must have a hole inthe tank

Interestingly, that's the planning figure I have for our 3.5 litre V6. Hopefully testing will show we can revise that figure downwards!

I'd hope you can revise it down quite a bit even the mosler wasn't using much more than a litre a minute, round the old silverstone GP circuit in 2008

[Ash 996 GT2]

The fuel is filtered, means cleaner.

Better for the car.

We use it and it makes a difference.

[obes]

As Ash says, we usually use Sunoco's R-SUR (99) and we've found it to be excellent.
I think it's £344.44 for a 200l drum delivered to the circuit.

We were doing some testing at Snett last week and I noticed the Sunoco super on the installed pump is £2.60/litre

[Ash 996 GT2]

obes said:

As Ash says, we usually use Sunoco's R-SUR (99) and we've found it to be excellent.
I think it's £344.44 for a 200l drum delivered to the circuit.

We were doing some testing at Snett last week and I noticed the Sunoco super on the installed pump is £2.60/litre

That was 100 Octane, we won't be doing that again.

[IanUAE]

Does anybody have the price of diesel that is being supplied for the event? Ared drums of fuel placed at the back of the garage and then you fill your dump churns yourself?