Planning a trip to the alps

[ThisInJapanese]

Looking for some insights in terms of driving distance / times and if I'm missing anything in the *rough* plan below and if there is a way to plan it using Google maps and get around the fact that it shows all the roads as closed at the moment. These are fiddly to put together now, as you can’t do a multi-stop route in Google Maps and say that you’re leaving in July. If you do it for tomorrow, the roads are closed, so it won’t route correctly. :

Day 1
London to Metz (Can stop in Reims if we think Metz is too far)

Day 2
Metz to Munich (Reference - https://autobahnspeedhunter.com/)
https://goo.gl/maps/9ZtNkNLHgj7YCQU26

Day 3
Phase 1 - https://goo.gl/maps/1iym3Q3VPgLfa3QJA
Phase 2 - https://goo.gl/maps/vvkHTi9gmTrC1FJE9

Day 4
Highlight – All the passes
To Stelvio: https://goo.gl/maps/1qypFBcdK9X8bm3AA (2 hours 30)
Stevio to San Carlo: https://goo.gl/maps/kQsm6E6N6fmCR5fz7 (45 mins)
San Carlo to Livigno: https://goo.gl/maps/xKbw2CJhzDQ7zgo4A (35 mins)
Livigno to Zernez: https://goo.gl/maps/xq9XEwU2vxKT8byC6 (40 mins)
Zernez to Albula Pass https://goo.gl/maps/KEN6KUs5DfJg3wML6 (30 Mins)
Albula Pass to Quinto https://goo.gl/maps/zFaRQaKhNmDXHGD56 (2 hours)

Day 5
Highlight – More Passes
Quinto to Gotthard Pass: https://goo.gl/maps/fiYN4h46zsemHw14A (26 mins)
Gotthard Pass to Susten Pass: https://goo.gl/maps/v6LJ1q4atcT1LGGa9 (54 mins)
Susten to Grimsel Pass: https://goo.gl/maps/vT5M9Y4Rwuk1DzTaA (58 mins)
Grimsel to Nufenen Pass: https://goo.gl/maps/qPzGu7G4fe4DntDb8 (37 mins)
This next part is a loop covering some already driven roads, but it sort of makes sense; it can be removed if needs be
Nufenen Pass to Realp: https://goo.gl/maps/ueEsWo9xWA6eE9pa9 (50 mins). You can go back over the Gotthard Pass here, but this route takes a different road which looks very scenic)
Realp to Innertkirchen which takes in Furka Pass, and then set our sat navs to Besancon of which there are multiple routes.

Day 6
Then it’s a full day of driving back home

Edited by ThisInJapanese on Monday 3rd April 11:39

[RedWhiteMonkey]

You might want to edit the first one to more generic address as a starting point.

[torqueofthedevil]

Driving in France is easy - you can cover miles so much more effortlessly than the uk so will be able to go further. Reims is nothing from London but it’s a great place to stop, Epernay is even nicer.

I’ve done some Swiss passes - one or two is probably enough - I think the number you have would be pretty tedious.

[ThisInJapanese]

RedWhiteMonkey said:

You might want to edit the first one to more generic address as a starting point.

Thanks, missed that one

[mr pg]

Day 1
London to Reims is easy, as is Metz. We normally go quite a bit on from there.
Day 3
By the time you reach the Grossglockner it will be busy. You may also want include the limb that takes you to the glacier, and you need to factor in time for drinks breaks/lunch/photo stops.
Day 4
That's going to be a long day trying to fit all that in. As above you need to add time for stopages. Passes can be disappointingly slow when busy.
Day 5
As above it's a lot in one day. Your route takes you through the Gotthard tunnel rather than one of the passes which wouldn't be my option.
You don't appear to be doing all of the Nufenen? My preference is east to west. Again, factor in stops.
This July we're staying on Lake Lucerne and then Andermatt via the Gotthard, Nufenen, Grimsell, Susten.

Paul.

[Killboy]

You day 5 is the best of the alps, and most of that can be done in a loop/figure of 8.

I'd say that the alps is generally slower than expected. You do not do mileage very quickly there, and there are loads of things that cause delays/pause.

This is all personal preference - but I was a big Alps fan, but I've somewhat cooled on it and have found myself wanting to steer clear of the Swiss and enjoying the Italian and French alternatives more. If you can, route yourself through the Vosges area - much better driving than the swiss alps. Stay a night in Colmar if you can.

[ThisInJapanese]

mr pg said:

Day 1
London to Reims is easy, as is Metz. We normally go quite a bit on from there.
Day 3
By the time you reach the Grossglockner it will be busy. You may also want include the limb that takes you to the glacier, and you need to factor in time for drinks breaks/lunch/photo stops.
Day 4
That's going to be a long day trying to fit all that in. As above you need to add time for stopages. Passes can be disappointingly slow when busy.
Day 5
As above it's a lot in one day. Your route takes you through the Gotthard tunnel rather than one of the passes which wouldn't be my option.
You don't appear to be doing all of the Nufenen? My preference is east to west. Again, factor in stops.
This July we're staying on Lake Lucerne and then Andermatt via the Gotthard, Nufenen, Grimsell, Susten.

Paul.

Thanks, will have a look again with your notes in mind

[ThisInJapanese]

Killboy said:

You day 5 is the best of the alps, and most of that can be done in a loop/figure of 8.

I'd say that the alps is generally slower than expected. You do not do mileage very quickly there, and there are loads of things that cause delays/pause.

This is all personal preference - but I was a big Alps fan, but I've somewhat cooled on it and have found myself wanting to steer clear of the Swiss and enjoying the Italian and French alternatives more. If you can, route yourself through the Vosges area - much better driving than the swiss alps. Stay a night in Colmar if you can.

Do you have any details about the alternatives?

[dcb]

ThisInJapanese said:

Day 2
Metz to Munich (Reference - https://autobahnspeedhunter.com/)
https://goo.gl/maps/9ZtNkNLHgj7YCQU26

Oh dear.

It's worth mentioning that German drivers are just about the best in Europe.
The Finns give them a close run. Safe, fast, good lane discipline, good observation,
good situational awareness. It's a mostly a delight to drive in Germany.

The Brits tend to be about the worst drivers in Europe. Some posters
think the Belgians are worse, but even at 2nd worst, it's not a good place to drive.
Poor to non-existent lane discipline, poor observation and poor situational awareness
are standard.

Many Germans have the opinion that most Brits drive like Americans and children,
i.e. slowly and badly. If it's your first time driving in Germany, try not to add the hearsay.

[Killboy]

ThisInJapanese said:

Do you have any details about the alternatives?

This is Colmar to near Metz - could reverse it: https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/route/6333195...



And then here is a loop around Colmar : pt1 - https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/route/6328933...
pt2 - https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/route/6329006...

[Killboy]

For some pics and an idea of what it all has to offer, I've got a ride report on ADV rider from last year - here: https://www.advrider.com/f/threads/euro-boogie-10-...

[plenty]

The Stelvio is basically a series of second-gear switchbacks so not much of a driving road, but it does has amazing views from the top. Best approached from the west not east as in your route.

On your way there or back, do not miss Timmelsjoch and Jaufenpass which are just north of Bolzano.

The N10 which straddles the Lux-Germany border follows the Moselle River and is a fabulous, flowing drive ending in Trier which is a nice overnight stop with a picturesque old town. It works particularly well if travelling via the Vosges as per above posts.

[ChocolateFrog]

Distances don't seem to onerous.

Used to do Yorkshire to the Alps a couple of times a year in one go.

[ChocolateFrog]

dcb said:

Oh dear.

It's worth mentioning that German drivers are just about the best in Europe.
The Finns give them a close run. Safe, fast, good lane discipline, good observation,
good situational awareness. It's a mostly a delight to drive in Germany.

The Brits tend to be about the worst drivers in Europe. Some posters
think the Belgians are worse, but even at 2nd worst, it's not a good place to drive.
Poor to non-existent lane discipline, poor observation and poor situational awareness
are standard.

Many Germans have the opinion that most Brits drive like Americans and children,
i.e. slowly and badly. If it's your first time driving in Germany, try not to add the hearsay.

Find it hard to believe that someone that says that has ever driven in Europe.

Yeah we're behind the Scandinavians and the Germans but ahead of everyone else. Leagues ahead of the likes of Belgium (the worst in Western Europe) and Italy not to mention all of Southern and Eastern Europe.

Totally laughable suggestion.

[ThisInJapanese]

plenty said:

The Stelvio is basically a series of second-gear switchbacks so not much of a driving road, but it does has amazing views from the top. Best approached from the west not east as in your route.

On your way there or back, do not miss Timmelsjoch and Jaufenpass which are just north of Bolzano.

The N10 which straddles the Lux-Germany border follows the Moselle River and is a fabulous, flowing drive ending in Trier which is a nice overnight stop with a picturesque old town. It works particularly well if travelling via the Vosges as per above posts.

Thanks, I'll look at that when I get my head back in planning mode.

[ThisInJapanese]

Killboy said:

This is Colmar to near Metz - could reverse it: https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/route/6333195...



And then here is a loop around Colmar : pt1 - https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/route/6328933...
pt2 - https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/route/6329006...

Brilliant! Thank you.

[ThisInJapanese]

So we've booked our crossings, and whilst watching the Giro d'Italia I noticed that some of the mountain roads were impassable. Looking more into our routes, lots of the roads are still closed with no planned opening, or *might* open the day before we get there.

There is an option to reschedule, but there is also an option to replan. What's the driving like in South of France, to the west of the Alps?

[plenty]

ThisInJapanese said:

There is an option to reschedule, but there is also an option to replan. What's the driving like in South of France, to the west of the Alps?

Excellent, arguably better than your original route and less trafficked. However it's harder to research the routes.

Start with looking at Route Napoleon and go from there.

[gazza5]

I'm driving the french alpine route in June - not much help to you though, but the weatehr has been appalling the last few weeks, and doesn't look like its getting much better - Monaco is approx 21c , but has also been wet.

Doing this https://www.tomtom.com/en_gb/routes/details/france...

Wont be driving to monaco, just going to go by train.

Plan to do Route Napoleon, although after the alps not sure if we will want to or not. We have accomodation booked in Grenoble, but if monaco is nice weather can see us spending a bit longer there then using motorway to grenoble.

[ThisInJapanese]

Yeah, weather looks awful. We've pushed the trip back by two weeks in a hope that it improves and some of the passes open.