Rules on Car Parking in a NCP Car Park?

[ajs5268]

Today after work I had to nip into town for a quick minute. I parked in the NCP Car Park, paid for my ticket for one hour (valid from 16.30hrs till 17.30hrs). Went over town to do what I had to. When I returned to my car at 17.10 hrs, I had a ticket on it.

Reason for issue of the ticket: NOT PARKED WITHIN WHITE LINE BOUNDARIES!!!!

The car park was nearly empty wen I returned, not as if there was fighting for spaces. My tyre was on the white line of the box.

I have searched to internet for law on this but cannot seem to find anything. Only thing I found is the "parking within 50cm of the kerb".

Anyone any ideas about this. Am very tempted to take this one to court and tak my chance.

Be very grateful for any info on this

[r-kid]

As I undersand it, its normal proccedure for not parking within designated space but never seen it enforced. NCP car parks usully post the rules up near the pay machines or the entrance. Best bet is to go back & check those.

Just avoid the same mistake.

[agent006]

Their carpark, their rules. I would imagine there's a "By entering you accept our terms" or similar sign up at the entrance.

[Allyc85]

I bet you wouldnt have been happy if someone had smacked their door against yours because there was barely any space to do so.

[Who me ?]

ajs5268 said:

Today after work I had to nip into town for a quick minute. I parked in the NCP Car Park, paid for my ticket for one hour (valid from 16.30hrs till 17.30hrs). Went over town to do what I had to. When I returned to my car at 17.10 hrs, I had a ticket on it.

Reason for issue of the ticket: NOT PARKED WITHIN WHITE LINE BOUNDARIES!!!!

The car park was nearly empty wen I returned, not as if there was fighting for spaces. My tyre was on the white line of the box.

I have searched to internet for law on this but cannot seem to find anything. Only thing I found is the "parking within 50cm of the kerb".

Anyone any ideas about this. Am very tempted to take this one to court and tak my chance.

Be very grateful for any info on this

Have a look in SP&L--- NCP and other parking & the law often on there

[ajs5268]

Allyc85 said:

I bet you wouldnt have been happy if someone had smacked their door against yours because there was barely any space to do so.

You need to bear in mind that this happened on a Monday night, no late night shopping that night. There is approx 500 car parking spaces, at the most 50 spaces were taken (Yes, the car park was all but empty).

If this had happened on a Saturday daytime and I had obstructed 2 spaces then I would understand why I got a ticket.

[Alex97]

ajs5268 said:

I have searched to internet for law on this but cannot seem to find anything. Only thing I found is the "parking within 50cm of the kerb".

There is no law which says you must park within the boundaries of a parking space, so stop looking. You broke the car park's own rules and regulations, so your only way out is to see whether these were clearly stated before you purchased the ticket. The chances are they were somewhere on the same board that states the hourly charges, so i'd just pay the fine and be more careful next time.

[Taita]

Also, I think the contract is with the driver. They can only get the RK from DVLA yes? So you could ignore it? I'm not sure though.

[Who me ?]

Alex97 said:

so i'd just pay the fine and be more careful next time.

It's NOT a fine - it's a (from info on SP&L) CIVIL penalty notice dressed up to look like a fine .
As I posted earlier -there's plenty more on SP & L on this .

[Gulzar]

Make a counter claim that there is a belt buckle scratch on the side of your car which was definately not there prior to parking in NCP carpark and could only have been left by the person placing ticket on windscreen cut a long story short, write to them, they write to you, yada yada, they'll give up .

If not it'll just get blown up and eventually get some publicity for being so ridiculously petty in what you say was a virtually empty carpark that they'll embarassingly give up.

I'll happilly always pay a fine if I rightly deserve it, but when it is this fking petty it just takes the piss and you quite rightly should take the piss back.

Edited by Gulzar on Saturday 8th November 02:09

[Sunim]

The bottom line is it is a civil matter not a criminal matter. They can only pull the Registered Keeper details from DVLA. But their contract is with the driver. They cannot persue the RK for the charge. They can only persue the driver for the charge. If you don't tell them you were driving,and the registered keeper does not tell them, they have no-body to chase for the charge.

And that is ignoring all the rest of the case that the charge is probably unreasonable and therefore unenforceable anyway. Or may be viewed by the court as a 'penalty charge' and therefore unenforceable in a civil contract.

My advice, Don't ever say or admit who was driving. Ignore everything they send to you except a court summons which would be sent by a court not them. In the unlikely event you get a court summons then seek help on pepipoo

Edited by Sunim on Sunday 16th November 10:41

[Who me ?]

Sunim said:

The bottom line is it is a civil matter not a criminal matter. They can only pull the Registered Keeper details from DVLA. But their contract is with the driver. They cannot persue the RK for the charge. They can only persue the driver for the charge. If you don't tell them you were driving,and the registered keeper does not tell them, they have no-body to chase for the charge.

And that is ignoring all the rest of the case that the charge is probably unreasonable and therefore unenforceable anyway. Or may be viewed by the court as a 'penalty charge' and therefore unenforceable in a civil contract.

My advice, Don't ever say or admit who was driving. Ignore everything they send to you except a court summons which would be sent by a court not them. In the unlikely event you get a court summons then seek help on pepipoo

Edited by Sunim on Sunday 16th November 10:41

And that is pretty much as posted many times on gENERAL gASSING/ Speed, Plod & the Law

[splitpin]

Sunim said:

The bottom line is it is a civil matter not a criminal matter. They can only pull the Registered Keeper details from DVLA. But their contract is with the driver. They cannot persue the RK for the charge. They can only persue the driver for the charge. If you don't tell them you were driving,and the registered keeper does not tell them, they have no-body to chase for the charge.

And that is ignoring all the rest of the case that the charge is probably unreasonable and therefore unenforceable anyway. Or may be viewed by the court as a 'penalty charge' and therefore unenforceable in a civil contract.

My advice, Don't ever say or admit who was driving. Ignore everything they send to you except a court summons which would be sent by a court not them. In the unlikely event you get a court summons then seek help on pepipoo

Edited by Sunim on Sunday 16th November 10:41

Sorry to resurrect something of an old thread, but I have only just read this.

Without going in to to much detail, I got a Penalty Charge Notice put on my car for it allegedly being parked in a way so as to cause an obstruction, an allegation which was false, therefore I refused to pay and told them to withdraw the allegation. They then said pay up (an increased charge) or we'll take you to court. I have continued to entirely dispute the allegation, invited them to prove it and have continued to tell them to withdraw the allegation. That was about a month ago and I have heard nothing since.

I assume they (they being one of those companies that are subcontracted to by the likes of B&Q etc - wasn't them/there by the way - in fact the retailer who owns the private land upon which the offence is alleged to have occurred has just been put into administration) got my (The Registered Keeper's) details from the DVLA and at no point have I told them who the driver at the time may or may not have been. The car parking is 'free'.

Whilst now realising that it looks like I should probably have entirely ignored their correspondence, does the advice given here hold good in this particular instance?

Thanks

[10 Pence Short]

splitpin said:

Sunim said:

The bottom line is it is a civil matter not a criminal matter. They can only pull the Registered Keeper details from DVLA. But their contract is with the driver. They cannot persue the RK for the charge. They can only persue the driver for the charge. If you don't tell them you were driving,and the registered keeper does not tell them, they have no-body to chase for the charge.

And that is ignoring all the rest of the case that the charge is probably unreasonable and therefore unenforceable anyway. Or may be viewed by the court as a 'penalty charge' and therefore unenforceable in a civil contract.

My advice, Don't ever say or admit who was driving. Ignore everything they send to you except a court summons which would be sent by a court not them. In the unlikely event you get a court summons then seek help on pepipoo

Edited by Sunim on Sunday 16th November 10:41

Sorry to resurrect something of an old thread, but I have only just read this.

Without going in to to much detail, I got a Penalty Charge Notice put on my car for it allegedly being parked in a way so as to cause an obstruction, an allegation which was false, therefore I refused to pay and told them to withdraw the allegation. They then said pay up (an increased charge) or we'll take you to court. I have continued to entirely dispute the allegation, invited them to prove it and have continued to tell them to withdraw the allegation. That was about a month ago and I have heard nothing since.

I assume they (they being one of those companies that are subcontracted to by the likes of B&Q etc - wasn't them/there by the way - in fact the retailer who owns the private land upon which the offence is alleged to have occurred has just been put into administration) got my (The Registered Keeper's) details from the DVLA and at no point have I told them who the driver at the time may or may not have been. The car parking is 'free'.

Whilst now realising that it looks like I should probably have entirely ignored their correspondence, does the advice given here hold good in this particular instance?

Thanks

As far as I'm aware breach of contract can only award for losses (and additional costs associated with taking action to recover those losses). If the car park is free, there are no losses therefore no basis for legal action to recover them, seeming they do not exist.

With regards to hiding the ID of the driver- this works unless there is an ANPR system logging photographs of every car leaving/entering the car park.

General, non ANPR CCTV records, even with DVR recording, are unlikely to be kept for more than a month or so. If you are going to dispute a ticket on private land it is better to leave it more than a month before you inform them.

[splitpin]

10 Pence Short said:

splitpin said:

Sunim said:

The bottom line is it is a civil matter not a criminal matter. They can only pull the Registered Keeper details from DVLA. But their contract is with the driver. They cannot persue the RK for the charge. They can only persue the driver for the charge. If you don't tell them you were driving,and the registered keeper does not tell them, they have no-body to chase for the charge.

And that is ignoring all the rest of the case that the charge is probably unreasonable and therefore unenforceable anyway. Or may be viewed by the court as a 'penalty charge' and therefore unenforceable in a civil contract.

My advice, Don't ever say or admit who was driving. Ignore everything they send to you except a court summons which would be sent by a court not them. In the unlikely event you get a court summons then seek help on pepipoo

Edited by Sunim on Sunday 16th November 10:41

Sorry to resurrect something of an old thread, but I have only just read this.

Without going in to to much detail, I got a Penalty Charge Notice put on my car for it allegedly being parked in a way so as to cause an obstruction, an allegation which was false, therefore I refused to pay and told them to withdraw the allegation. They then said pay up (an increased charge) or we'll take you to court. I have continued to entirely dispute the allegation, invited them to prove it and have continued to tell them to withdraw the allegation. That was about a month ago and I have heard nothing since.

I assume they (they being one of those companies that are subcontracted to by the likes of B&Q etc - wasn't them/there by the way - in fact the retailer who owns the private land upon which the offence is alleged to have occurred has just been put into administration) got my (The Registered Keeper's) details from the DVLA and at no point have I told them who the driver at the time may or may not have been. The car parking is 'free'.

Whilst now realising that it looks like I should probably have entirely ignored their correspondence, does the advice given here hold good in this particular instance?

Thanks

As far as I'm aware breach of contract can only award for losses (and additional costs associated with taking action to recover those losses). If the car park is free, there are no losses therefore no basis for legal action to recover them, seeming they do not exist.

With regards to hiding the ID of the driver- this works unless there is an ANPR system logging photographs of every car leaving/entering the car park.

General, non ANPR CCTV records, even with DVR recording, are unlikely to be kept for more than a month or so. If you are going to dispute a ticket on private land it is better to leave it more than a month before you inform them.

The reason I 'told' them to prove it i.e. provide photographic evidence of the car allegedly committing the offence was for them to 'shoot themselves in the foot'. The allegation is wholly false and if they have what they think is photographic evidence, that will prove what I have told them; that the car was not parked in a way so as to cause an obstruction. So as such in this particular instance, it doesn't actually matter if they have proof of the subject vehicle entering that car park (that's what car parks are for) or the person that was driving it; surely it is reasonable for them to have to prove the allegation, if not they could falsely accuse anyone of anything (as they have in this instance), presumably just to make money under false pretences.

[anonymous-user]

Next time you park in an NCP carpark, be sure to take some lubricant so that you'll be ready come payment time. Couldn't believe the prices they charged me in Southampton

My own fault for not reading the signs and doing the maths though, I suppose.

[KingDave]

Hello to all PHers. This is my first post.

If your "ticket" had the word "NOTICE" on it, then you didn't necessarily have to pay it.

When you sign this document, your signature is accepting the terms offered on the notice.
All notices are subject to notice and discussion, as the law has to offer remedy within itself.
NCP is nothing more than a privately owned corporation looking to make maximum profits.
The carpark was empty you say? Sounds like profits were low that day.

With ANYTHING in life, if a person/company is asking you to pay money you "owe" them, they are obliged to show proof of your debt upon request.

Was your "ticket" the original or a copy/carbon? I bet it wasn't the original.
If money changes hands in any way, it is called a security transaction, and certain rules must be obeyed. One of these rules it that you are entitled to have the ORIGINAL copy of the "ticket" to be able to process it on your financial books.

I am not a lawyer, nor am I giving legal advice.
All discussion welcome.
Peace