328i sport: Project Ring shed the 3rd...
Discussion
Some of you may remember the previous two Ring sheds, 2008's 325i:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Never actually made it to the Ring in that car though (yet), as a change of circumstances altered the direction of the project. Then I finally got out there last year in an M3:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
This year I've been able to do a bit more planning, so knew what I wanted from a Ring car. As daft as it may sound the M3 probably had too much power for a Ring novice like myself. I toyed with the idea of a 318is but figured that I'd want some grunt for the long uphill stretch on the back straight to keep things entertaining. I've had 11 different E36's over the last few years, but had never tried a 328i. On paper it should be perfect: with 120kgs less than an M3 it should turn in sharper, give the tyres and brakes and easier time, and cost a bit less to buy and run hopefully.
I found a reasonably cheap early sport with the all important LSD in the classifieds on here.
It already has the all important M50 inlet manifold conversion, but the rest was pretty standard with the original Bilstein sports shocks. It didn't handle brilliantly to start with though as some joker had fitted one correct M3 style eccentric bush and one standard bush on the front wishbones. Unfortunately at the time nowhere had any stock of Powerflex ones as they'd had a big fire at the factory, so I got some Floflex ones:
Also replaced the rear trailing arm bushes:
The front wishbone bushes were a dangerous waste of time as they were so loose they kept turning in the lolipops. Managed to get some Powerflex ones from Redish motorsport in the end to replace them.
Got some M3 3.0 litre front hubs, calipers, discs, pads and braided hoses all round for £100 from my friendly E36 M3 breakers: http://stores.shop.ebay.co.uk/CR-M-Tech-BMW-E36-an...
After bleeding the brakes loads of times the pedal was still long though, so swapped the master cylinder and servo for M3 ones too:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Never actually made it to the Ring in that car though (yet), as a change of circumstances altered the direction of the project. Then I finally got out there last year in an M3:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
This year I've been able to do a bit more planning, so knew what I wanted from a Ring car. As daft as it may sound the M3 probably had too much power for a Ring novice like myself. I toyed with the idea of a 318is but figured that I'd want some grunt for the long uphill stretch on the back straight to keep things entertaining. I've had 11 different E36's over the last few years, but had never tried a 328i. On paper it should be perfect: with 120kgs less than an M3 it should turn in sharper, give the tyres and brakes and easier time, and cost a bit less to buy and run hopefully.
I found a reasonably cheap early sport with the all important LSD in the classifieds on here.
It already has the all important M50 inlet manifold conversion, but the rest was pretty standard with the original Bilstein sports shocks. It didn't handle brilliantly to start with though as some joker had fitted one correct M3 style eccentric bush and one standard bush on the front wishbones. Unfortunately at the time nowhere had any stock of Powerflex ones as they'd had a big fire at the factory, so I got some Floflex ones:
Also replaced the rear trailing arm bushes:
The front wishbone bushes were a dangerous waste of time as they were so loose they kept turning in the lolipops. Managed to get some Powerflex ones from Redish motorsport in the end to replace them.
Got some M3 3.0 litre front hubs, calipers, discs, pads and braided hoses all round for £100 from my friendly E36 M3 breakers: http://stores.shop.ebay.co.uk/CR-M-Tech-BMW-E36-an...
After bleeding the brakes loads of times the pedal was still long though, so swapped the master cylinder and servo for M3 ones too:
Whilst I was at Chris's workshop fitting the M3 hubs (he's good like that, lets me use his 2 post lift to fit the parts I buy off him) I mentioned that I'd like to lower the gearing by fitting a higher diff ratio. As luck would have it he had a customer for a 328i (medium casing) LSD so did me good deal to swap the entire rear axle to one off an M3 EVO, and a 3.0 litre M3 proshaft to mate it up to the 328i gearbox. Not only did this give a useful 10% lower gearing (dropping from a 2.97 to 3.23 diff ratio) but I also gained stronger driveshafts and bigger rear brakes so it now runs M3 size brakes all round. Downside was it needed bleeding and the tracking setting up, again...
Next step was then some weight loss. Now it's easy to get carried away and end up with a noisy, rattly car that I wouldn't enjoy driving a long distance (like my M3 track car). I wanted to keep the heater, carpets, radio and glass windows this time. I removed all the trim and carpet from the boot:
That was the easy part, I then set about the cabin by removing the seats. Took the opportunity to give it a good hoover,
Then pulled the carpet up to removed the sound deadening, plastic vents and things the foam backing from off the carpets.
Things were a bit soggy in there, probably from a leaking sunroof, so there was a bit of surface rust:
I'll probably get the sunroof panel welded in as I never use it in any of my cars. Took the rear 1/4 cards off and the seat up to remove the sound deadening and insulation:
Took the big foam panel off the underside of the bonnet too, and ended up with a 5 series bootfull of stuff to take to the tip. 33kgs removed so far:
Then put it back together, with some Sabelt 4 point harnesses bolted into the standard seat belt mounting points:
I've kept the standard seat belts for road use, but the harnesses will hold us in a bit better for round the track.
With that bit stripped out it's a little noisier inside, but no worse than say a standard E30. Helps the car feel a little more "raw". Next on the list of jobs to do is to lower the car, not sure weather to get some Eibach lowering springs or go the coilover route.
Next step was then some weight loss. Now it's easy to get carried away and end up with a noisy, rattly car that I wouldn't enjoy driving a long distance (like my M3 track car). I wanted to keep the heater, carpets, radio and glass windows this time. I removed all the trim and carpet from the boot:
That was the easy part, I then set about the cabin by removing the seats. Took the opportunity to give it a good hoover,
Then pulled the carpet up to removed the sound deadening, plastic vents and things the foam backing from off the carpets.
Things were a bit soggy in there, probably from a leaking sunroof, so there was a bit of surface rust:
I'll probably get the sunroof panel welded in as I never use it in any of my cars. Took the rear 1/4 cards off and the seat up to remove the sound deadening and insulation:
Took the big foam panel off the underside of the bonnet too, and ended up with a 5 series bootfull of stuff to take to the tip. 33kgs removed so far:
Then put it back together, with some Sabelt 4 point harnesses bolted into the standard seat belt mounting points:
I've kept the standard seat belts for road use, but the harnesses will hold us in a bit better for round the track.
With that bit stripped out it's a little noisier inside, but no worse than say a standard E30. Helps the car feel a little more "raw". Next on the list of jobs to do is to lower the car, not sure weather to get some Eibach lowering springs or go the coilover route.
jamiebae said:
So what's happened to the 325i then? I was talking about it with a friend earlier today actually!
The 325i is still here, now fitted with the engine from the black M3 and goes like stink! It would be too fast for me around the Ring, until I get to know the place better, and bloomin uncomfortable on the way there and back. Would love to take it around one day though. The 328i is my "fast road and light track duty" car, and also have the 540i for long distance wafting and towing the white one.Well I'll be keeping an eye on this one too 
I keep thinking I'd like an E36 as a daily driver, I think I'll get rid of the Astra because I can't justify having a £6k+ daily driver when I'll probably drive the Mazda all summer, a 6 pot 3 series sounds like a perfect replacement at under £2k for a really good one.
I keep thinking I'd like an E36 as a daily driver, I think I'll get rid of the Astra because I can't justify having a £6k+ daily driver when I'll probably drive the Mazda all summer, a 6 pot 3 series sounds like a perfect replacement at under £2k for a really good one.
ScottishSamurai said:
As much as I love track projects like this. I hope you leave some standard cars that I can buy and insure by the time i'm 21+ 
My history with E36's isn't great:1/ green 325tds - sold
2/ black 320i - scrapped
3/ grey/white 325i - stripped out track slag
4/ red 325i - scrapped
5/ green 325td - still got, left standard and is now for sale
6/ black 325i - scrapped
7/ burgundy 325i - scrapped
8/ white 318i - scrapped
9/ black M3 - scrapped (but donated it's running gear to the track slag)
10/ silver 328i - semi stripped track car
11/ silver 318is - saved from being scrapped, just waiting for a couple of panels
Truth is though a lot of these cars suffer from rust and are very cheap to buy and are worth more in bits. Only the best will survive.
Hey, i love following your threads, it's like following the energiser bunny sometimes
i can't even get motivated to wash my cars half the time let alone strip and sort them.
You mention the 540 as a tow car but i see you put a for sale ad up, do you not get on with it? I love my e34 and will be looking for a touring towards the end of the year depending on whats about.
Good luck with all your projects it keeps us all entertained.
i can't even get motivated to wash my cars half the time let alone strip and sort them. You mention the 540 as a tow car but i see you put a for sale ad up, do you not get on with it? I love my e34 and will be looking for a touring towards the end of the year depending on whats about.
Good luck with all your projects it keeps us all entertained.
sprouting said:
Hey, i love following your threads, it's like following the energiser bunny sometimes i can't even get motivated to wash my cars half the time let alone strip and sort them.
You mention the 540 as a tow car but i see you put a for sale ad up, do you not get on with it? I love my e34 and will be looking for a touring towards the end of the year depending on whats about.
Good luck with all your projects it keeps us all entertained.
Got another E36 project to start soon too, got a nice clean 1998 318is coupe for the Mrs to replace her old td. Only it had been started to be stripped so needs and interior, bonnet and front panel (in Titan silver if anyone has them?!) When things get a bit more serious with the 328i I'll be fitting the 318 with the seats and door cards from the 328. i can't even get motivated to wash my cars half the time let alone strip and sort them. You mention the 540 as a tow car but i see you put a for sale ad up, do you not get on with it? I love my e34 and will be looking for a touring towards the end of the year depending on whats about.
Good luck with all your projects it keeps us all entertained.
The 540i is a great car, brilliant at storming effortlessly up and down the motorway and tows the track car like it's not even there. Thing is I'm toying with the idea of getting another Transit to replace it.
Made it out to the Nurburgring last week, unfortunately a few days before I was due to leave there was still a few inches of snow on the ground. Luckily my tame M3 breaker's had just got in an EVO with a set of replica motorsport rims complete with winter tyres for just £225. There's a bit of vibration at speed and under heavy braking due to the large tread blocks, but they seemed to hold up for the 4 laps I did on them. Even if they did squeal a bit.
The place was pretty much deserted, on one lap we didn't even see another car. Watched some GT cars testing the following day:
Went exploring down some lanes to find some nice places to watch the track action:
I wouldn't have gone down here on R888's
The 328i performed really well for what it is. The lower gearing definitely helped on the track, I was hitting an indicated 130mph on the approach to Schwedenkreuz - the same as I was in the M3 last year. Up some of the longer uphill drags from Bergwerk to Steilstrecke it was bogging down a little bit in 4th as under 4500rpm there's not as much torque with the M50 manifold fitted. I'm thinking a remap may help cure this flat spot.
For the next trip I want to get some coilovers, and remove a bit more weight from the car.
The place was pretty much deserted, on one lap we didn't even see another car. Watched some GT cars testing the following day:
Went exploring down some lanes to find some nice places to watch the track action:
I wouldn't have gone down here on R888's
The 328i performed really well for what it is. The lower gearing definitely helped on the track, I was hitting an indicated 130mph on the approach to Schwedenkreuz - the same as I was in the M3 last year. Up some of the longer uphill drags from Bergwerk to Steilstrecke it was bogging down a little bit in 4th as under 4500rpm there's not as much torque with the M50 manifold fitted. I'm thinking a remap may help cure this flat spot.
For the next trip I want to get some coilovers, and remove a bit more weight from the car.
Do you not worry about having harnesses and no roll cage?
I would always be worried about rolling it and not being able to duck down if anything serious happened.
In my 205 track car until I had my roll cage fitted I was paranoid about drivng round in a tin foil car in buckets and harnesses without any rollover protection, though a 205 is a little less sturdy the BMW I would imagine!
I would always be worried about rolling it and not being able to duck down if anything serious happened.
In my 205 track car until I had my roll cage fitted I was paranoid about drivng round in a tin foil car in buckets and harnesses without any rollover protection, though a 205 is a little less sturdy the BMW I would imagine!
This might be a stupid question, but how are the new wheels better than the standard sport/bbs ones?
Also, has it already been lowered a little, or is it just the photos, as I thought it looked quite low on the rear?
And finally, has the stripping out made much difference to the performance so far?
Also, has it already been lowered a little, or is it just the photos, as I thought it looked quite low on the rear?
And finally, has the stripping out made much difference to the performance so far?
mondayo said:
This might be a stupid question, but how are the new wheels better than the standard sport/bbs ones?
Didn't think they were, they're not meant to be anyway. The only reason I got them was due to the winter tyres being on them, now I'm back home they go in the shed until next winter and the BBS will go back on for the summer.mondayo said:
Also, has it already been lowered a little, or is it just the photos, as I thought it looked quite low on the rear?
It's still on the standard sport suspension, which is a few mm lower than standard. I think in those pictures I've still got a tool box and big box of spares in the boot, I left then in the carpark for my laps.mondayo said:
And finally, has the stripping out made much difference to the performance so far?
There's a bit of extra noise from the exhaust coming through the boot which probably makes it feel a bit quicker than it is. Other than that it's probably hard to tell as it's the same difference as 2/3rds of a tank of fuel. I just work on the principle that every little will help, especially on the long uphill stretches and gives the brakes and tyres an easier time.benny.c said:
Bloody hell Rich, you really are Mr E36 
Hope to see the M3 up at Oulton soon.
Just the 4 E36's in the household for now - soon to be down to 3 when I get the 318is on the road for the Mrs and get rid of her diesel.Hope to see the M3 up at Oulton soon.
Got some braided oil lines being made for the M3 after an leak at Anglesea a couple of weeks ago. We'll have to get our cars on track together sometime this year, keep me posted if you book anything.
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