Metzger, can someone explain?

[Sukh13]

Im fairly new to Porsche and was just wondering if someone could explain what the fuss about merzger engines is?

[PigFilth]

Mezger, not Metzger or Merzger

[nsm3]

Troll sat alone on his seat of stone and munched and mumbled a bare old bone....

[J-P]

It's Porsche's motorsport engine. Designed by Hans Mezger. Hugely reliable, made of a big lump of iron, revs outrageously high, sounds absolutely glorious! Available only in GTx cars (and some Turbos?). Try googling Mezger for more info.

Cheers

J-P

[nsm3]

J-P said:

Hugely reliable.......

Not always it would seem?

Taken from the front page article about the GT3 RS;

"Like many 997s, ours has suffered leaks from the oil seals between the engine and gearbox. The rear main seal has been replaced four times, (twice for the first owner, and twice for us) and the front main seal once. There was also a leak from the seal between the two halves of the crankcase, so the engine was removed, split, rebuilt and refitted - thankfully all under warranty".

[Sukh13]

So is it a "normal" engine with upgraded parts or a totally different engine?

And for the troll comment, if you don't want to discuss don't say anything, it is a genuine question. When you google it nothing really comes up except other boards asking specifically about models that had it. There is no wiki or anything.

And google throws a fit on both spellings?

[RSGulp]

Sukh13 said:

When you google it nothing really comes up except other boards asking specifically about models that had it. There is no wiki or anything.

And google throws a fit on both spellings?

If you google Hans Mezger on www.google.de you'll find the German wiki page. Use Babelfish to (roughly) translate and a lot of the background to Hans Mezger and his connection with Porsche is there.

[J-P]

nsm3 said:

Not always it would seem?

Taken from the front page article about the GT3 RS;

"Like many 997s, ours has suffered leaks from the oil seals between the engine and gearbox. The rear main seal has been replaced four times, (twice for the first owner, and twice for us) and the front main seal once. There was also a leak from the seal between the two halves of the crankcase, so the engine was removed, split, rebuilt and refitted - thankfully all under warranty".

I thought the Mezger engine design was completely different to the standard 997 engines as it's based on the old air cooled engine but re-engineered to be water-cooled? Also unreliable engines don't make for successful racers and I was under the impression that the GT3 is a very successful race car. Still I guess any engine can go wrong?

[Phooey]

This will be a good book once released http://www.amazon.co.uk/Porsche-Me-Hans-Mezger/dp/...

[shotokan]

Go drive a GT3 and understand/enjoy the 'fuss'...lol

Legend of an engine & by far the best I've ever owned (in my 996 GT3.1)

Too hardcore for some though...

[nsm3]

J-P said:

I thought the Mezger engine design was completely different to the standard 997 engines as it's based on the old air cooled engine but re-engineered to be water-cooled? Also unreliable engines don't make for successful racers and I was under the impression that the GT3 is a very successful race car. Still I guess any engine can go wrong?

I have seen a gen 1 RS advert that openly claimed a new engine install at 14k miles, which cost......wait for it.....£52k !!!

Thankfully mine is just shy of 9k miles and hasn't shed its oil yet - however, without a Porsche warranty, I wouldn't keep this particular car - the risk exceeds the depths of my pockets.

[J-P]

nsm3 said:

J-P said:

I thought the Mezger engine design was completely different to the standard 997 engines as it's based on the old air cooled engine but re-engineered to be water-cooled? Also unreliable engines don't make for successful racers and I was under the impression that the GT3 is a very successful race car. Still I guess any engine can go wrong?

I have seen a gen 1 RS advert that openly claimed a new engine install at 14k miles, which cost......wait for it.....£52k !!!

Thankfully mine is just shy of 9k miles and hasn't shed its oil yet - however, without a Porsche warranty, I wouldn't keep this particular car - the risk exceeds the depths of my pockets.

Holy crap £52k!!!! That's an outrageous number - glad my car has a 3 year warranty. That's getting renewed for as long as possible!

[mollytherocker]

The so called Mezger engine is derived from the 1998 GT1 engine he designed for racing. It is totally different to the water cooled engine designed for the 996 & Box.



I believe that the block is based on the 964 and even has a 964 part number? Can someone confirm?

Indeed, the Mezger design goes back much further doesnt it?

MTR

[Phooey]

nsm3 said:

I have seen a gen 1 RS advert that openly claimed a new engine install at 14k miles, which cost......wait for it.....£52k !!!

I remember that advert. I think he got his 5 and 2 the wrong way around

[graemel]

Very interesting. Was he envolved in the Porsche 962 ?. Basically a 3.2 Carrera engine with water cooled cylinder heads. 800bhp whoopi doo and very reliable.

[J-P]

mollytherocker said:

The so called Mezger engine is derived from the 1998 GT1 engine he designed for racing.

I believe that the block is based on the 964 and even has a 964 part number? Can someone confirm?

Indeed, the Mezger design goes back much further doesnt it?

MTR

That's my understanding

[J-P]

graemel said:

Very interesting. Was he envolved in the Porsche 962 ?. Basically a 3.2 Carrera engine with water cooled cylinder heads. 800bhp whoopi doo and very reliable.

Probably! He was definitely part of the 917 project!

[nsm3]

Phooey said:

I remember that advert. I think he got his 5 and 2 the wrong way around

My initial reaction but I'm not so sure - remember Hammond on Top Gear saying the GT3 engine looked like a washing machine, which is a shame as it costs £40k - that was 8 odd years ago?

The original engines had 964 stampings, but the later ones have caught up with the model ref.

[mollytherocker]

Found this;

Hans Mezger joined Porsche in 1956 and within a few years was responsible for the design of both the early 1960s F1 engine and subsequently led the design of the six cylinder 911 engine. In 1965 he became head of the new race design office under the charismatic Ferdinand Piëch. Mezger led the development of all the iconic race prototypes of the 1960s, climaxing in the unforgettable 917 program. He was a principal contributor to all sixteen of Porsche’s victories in the famed Le Mans 24 Hours. When the McLaren-TAG F1 team came to Porsche for a turbo engine in the 1980s, he led the design and development that resulted in three consecutive F1 constructors’ titles.

So I guess, the term Mezger engine means any with a block that is an evolution of the original 2.0? The 993 would be the last air cooled one, then it was used again for the GT3/2/T.

MTR

Edited by mollytherocker on Thursday 25th August 23:14

[J-P]

mollytherocker said:

Found this;

Hans Mezger joined Porsche in 1956 and within a few years was responsible for the design of both the early 1960s F1 engine and subsequently led the design of the six cylinder 911 engine. In 1965 he became head of the new race design office under the charismatic Ferdinand Piëch. Mezger led the development of all the iconic race prototypes of the 1960s, climaxing in the unforgettable 917 program. He was a principal contributor to all sixteen of Porsche’s victories in the famed Le Mans 24 Hours. When the McLaren-TAG F1 team came to Porsche for a turbo engine in the 1980s, he led the design and development that resulted in three consecutive F1 constructors’ titles.

So I guess, the term Mezger engine means that the block is an evolution of the original 2.0?

MTR

Jesus. I knew it had been around a while but had no idea it harks back to the 60's!