997 Turbo what a let down......
Discussion
Not in the general sense so don't panic I've not gone mad 
Today I have wasted close to 5 hours of my life (and my Wifes) and well over 220 miles, on a supposedly as new 2006 997 Turbo off the Autotrader website. P**sed off is an understatement. I arrived at the Traders set up, up Yorkshire way (don't think it appropriate to name them as they are claiming to be selling on behalf of a customer), to be greeted by the sales man who promptly handed me the keys to the Black 997 Turbo and said go for a drive take your time! Trust worthy to say the least and to be honest I'm glad he did, I'm also glad he declined to come with me as I probably wouldn't of given it much if he was sat next to me, which uncovered the main reason I wouldn't buy it so at least I had some luck!
SO what was wrong? After a 5 minute walk around the car and a 10 minute drive this is what I found:
1/ very stiff into 1st gear and to a certain point 2nd (sure he struggled to get it in gear when he pulled it out initially)
2/ not as 'shiny' or well looked after as I'd imagined it would be but that wasn't a major issue really
3/ few stone chips to front end
4/ brake judder / warped n/s/f disc
5/ lots of tyre noise
6/ lots of slack on top of hand brake before it engaged
7/ Clutch slipping its brains out!
And that's as far as I got before tuning round, taking it back and walking away in sheer disappointment. The car should have only covered 19k miles, yet it was showing 20500 when I arrived which annoyed me. They weren't prepared to budge of the price as I'd spent a week chatting to them on the phone, being assured it was 'like new' and 'perfect' (£49k 2006 56 Black on Black Manual, Chrono etc). They were claiming to be selling it for a customer yet when I think about it they mentioned 'oh we'll put a warranty on it for you' probably 3 or 4 times which sounds fishy to me.
Oh well, keep looking surely 20k miles Porsche 997 Turbos should still be like new makes me wonder how many have had their mileage trimmed a few times.....
Today I have wasted close to 5 hours of my life (and my Wifes) and well over 220 miles, on a supposedly as new 2006 997 Turbo off the Autotrader website. P**sed off is an understatement. I arrived at the Traders set up, up Yorkshire way (don't think it appropriate to name them as they are claiming to be selling on behalf of a customer), to be greeted by the sales man who promptly handed me the keys to the Black 997 Turbo and said go for a drive take your time! Trust worthy to say the least and to be honest I'm glad he did, I'm also glad he declined to come with me as I probably wouldn't of given it much if he was sat next to me, which uncovered the main reason I wouldn't buy it so at least I had some luck!
SO what was wrong? After a 5 minute walk around the car and a 10 minute drive this is what I found:
1/ very stiff into 1st gear and to a certain point 2nd (sure he struggled to get it in gear when he pulled it out initially)
2/ not as 'shiny' or well looked after as I'd imagined it would be but that wasn't a major issue really
3/ few stone chips to front end
4/ brake judder / warped n/s/f disc
5/ lots of tyre noise
6/ lots of slack on top of hand brake before it engaged
7/ Clutch slipping its brains out!
And that's as far as I got before tuning round, taking it back and walking away in sheer disappointment. The car should have only covered 19k miles, yet it was showing 20500 when I arrived which annoyed me. They weren't prepared to budge of the price as I'd spent a week chatting to them on the phone, being assured it was 'like new' and 'perfect' (£49k 2006 56 Black on Black Manual, Chrono etc). They were claiming to be selling it for a customer yet when I think about it they mentioned 'oh we'll put a warranty on it for you' probably 3 or 4 times which sounds fishy to me.
Oh well, keep looking surely 20k miles Porsche 997 Turbos should still be like new makes me wonder how many have had their mileage trimmed a few times.....
More miles than you want, but I'd bet on this one being a decent example:
http://www.dealer.ferrari.com/stratstone/mancheste...
http://www.dealer.ferrari.com/stratstone/mancheste...
Selling on behalf of a customer: "he just threw me the keys and said go for it, take as much time as you like". And you wonder why I come down as hard as I do on sale or return when buying and selling relatively normal Porsches, (of which a 997 turbo is).
I bet the owner of the car would be thrilled to know how much care is being taken of his valuable asset.
In terms of the mechanicals most sale or return cars are merely advertised for you to come along and perform the role of quality control officer. If you're happy the bloke gets his money, if there's a problem the car goes back to the owner and the guy isn't out of pocket.
Good luck with your search.
Henry
I bet the owner of the car would be thrilled to know how much care is being taken of his valuable asset.
In terms of the mechanicals most sale or return cars are merely advertised for you to come along and perform the role of quality control officer. If you're happy the bloke gets his money, if there's a problem the car goes back to the owner and the guy isn't out of pocket.
Good luck with your search.
Henry
Edited by Henry-F on Wednesday 22 February 18:46
If the car had the short shift kit fitted the box can be stiff until the oil has warmed up
Tyre noise is high in the Turbo ( Mitchlin pilot )
OPC spray the front on most cars they sell, must admit my car has over 46K and only a couple of chips
My car drives as new, but has not been abused, the description you give of a twenty thousander sounds like a car that has not been cherished.
Tyre noise is high in the Turbo ( Mitchlin pilot )
OPC spray the front on most cars they sell, must admit my car has over 46K and only a couple of chips
My car drives as new, but has not been abused, the description you give of a twenty thousander sounds like a car that has not been cherished.
I was just expecting a lot better for only 20500 miles that's all. Especially when the sales man I had been communicating with for over a week claimed to have popped home in it a couple of times and it drove like a new one! So new Porsche's now come with warped front discs, dodgy hand brakes and slipping clutches! Er no, I'm not expecting a 'brand new' 997 when its at half the cost of a new one and it is 5 years old, but I can say fairly that I'm expecting more than what I viewed today. I want some ones pride a joy, not some joy ridden toy that has been completely abused.
The search continues, I cant believe I'm struggling to buy a 50k car in today's climate I thought there would be a fair few to choose from.
I too would be a bit miffed if my car was just been handed out to people out of the blue, although I like to think I have an honest face!
I hear what you say on the short shift, I'm mechanically minded and able though and this was a little bit more than waiting for the oil temp to thin the gear oil down
The search continues, I cant believe I'm struggling to buy a 50k car in today's climate I thought there would be a fair few to choose from.
I too would be a bit miffed if my car was just been handed out to people out of the blue, although I like to think I have an honest face!
I hear what you say on the short shift, I'm mechanically minded and able though and this was a little bit more than waiting for the oil temp to thin the gear oil down
I'd go one step further and say most of the 06/07 cars not in OPC network with less than 20k miles have covered more miles. Mines got 50k miles and I've thrashed it on may occasions were road conditions permit but when I get back in the car after driving a new OPC loan car with only hundreds of miles it still feels tight.
IMI A said:
I'd go one step further and say most of the 06/07 cars not in OPC network with less than 20k miles have covered more miles. Mines got 50k miles and I've thrashed it on may occasions were road conditions permit but when I get back in the car after driving a new OPC loan car with only hundreds of miles it still feels tight.
thed4ppa said:
Wouldn't be surprised. The more I think the more I convince myself that they knew it was a bit of a turkey. The way he mentioned warranty so many times just doesn't ring right to me if its on sale for a customer. Surely the warranty would be an optional addition at my expense?
I think on a 50K car you should get a decent warranty thrown in for a minimum of 3 months....
IMI A said:
I'd go one step further and say most of the 06/07 cars not in OPC network with less than 20k miles have covered more miles. Mines got 50k miles and I've thrashed it on may occasions were road conditions permit but when I get back in the car after driving a new OPC loan car with only hundreds of miles it still feels tight.
What makes you think all the cars in the OPC network have genuine mileage? Conversely what makes you think cars sourced elsewhere have been tampered with?Before you start spouting off rubbish like that have a little think about things:
Large organisation. Financed and run by people never seen at the coal face, a group buyer who never meets the end user, a salesman who never meets the owner of the car or has anything to do with the buying process, dealership managers who somehow have to hold everyone together, a workshop who resent the limitations put on them by the sales department, a sales department who see the workshop as their enemy, (and have very little control over things because they weren't the ones who bought the car in). Oh, and a parent company, themselves under the thumb of the mother company, who keep putting on a bit of pressure from time to time.
A buyer who will also have to look the end user in the face when he sells to them. Financed with their own hard earned money, or they sit next to the person who's money it is every day. Everyone in the organisation knowing each other and singing from the same hymn sheet with a genuine passion to deliver to the best of their ability.
With one of the above if you have a problem you can get straight through to the person at the very pointy end of the stick, though in fairness you should never need to because everyone else in the chain has both the ability and desire to see the right thing done. With the other you will get passed from department to department. If you post up your woes on an Internet forum someone might eventually furnish you with a fax number that used to belong to someone's secretary.
If only you knew............
Henry.
Edited by Henry-F on Wednesday 22 February 21:33
I have a busy family run business in the trade, just not buying and selling vehicles as such so I understand to the dot what you are describing Henry as it's exactly how we operate. And we do very well off the back of the failings of the main dealers who are realistically no more trust worthy than the independent.
I think there's good and bad inside and outside the main dealer networks, its just finding the good guys as tbh my experience of dealing with traders puts many in a dim light. All though by no means do I tarnish them all with that brush.
I think there's good and bad inside and outside the main dealer networks, its just finding the good guys as tbh my experience of dealing with traders puts many in a dim light. All though by no means do I tarnish them all with that brush.
Henry-F said:
IMI A said:
I'd go one step further and say most of the 06/07 cars not in OPC network with less than 20k miles have covered more miles. Mines got 50k miles and I've thrashed it on may occasions were road conditions permit but when I get back in the car after driving a new OPC loan car with only hundreds of miles it still feels tight.
What makes you think all the cars in the OPC network have genuine mileage? Conversely what makes you think cars sourced elsewhere have been tampered with?Before you start spouting off rubbish like that have a little think about things. Large organisation. Financed and run by people never seen at the coal face, a group buyer who never meets the end user, a salesman who never meets the owner of the car or has anything to do with the buying process, dealership managers who somehow have to hold everyone together, a workshop who resent the limitations put on them by the sales department, a sales department who see the workshop as their enemy, (and have very little control over things because they weren't the ones who bought the car in. Oh, and a parent company, themselves under the thumb of the mother company, who keep putting on a bit of pressure from time to time.
A buyer who will also have to look the end user in the face when he sells to them. Financed with your own hard earned money and with everyone in the organisation knowing each other and singing from the same hymn sheet with a genuine passion to deliver to the best of their ability.
With one of the above if you have a problem you can get straight through to the person at the very pointy end of the stick, though in fairness you should never need to because everyone else in the chain has both the ability and desire to see the right thing done. With the other you will get passed from department to department. If you post up your woes on an Internet forum someone might eventually furnish you with a fax number that used to belong to someone's secretary.
If only you knew............
Henry.
Having said that the 997 turbos and Ruf I've seen you sell over the last 12 months are amongst the nicest I've seen - not just blowing hot air up the proverbial - genuinely nice cars that id consider myself, Not looked at your other cars but I'm sure they are just as nice.
Well - the turbo does a few things that might not seem to be right. Shifting from 1 to 2 when cold and especially if you got a Sport Shifter (short shift) will be a bit hard. When you turn off the engine you will get that somewhat loud rumble - out of gear and stay on the clutch when you turn it off. Then you will get of course the odd rattle which you need to sort - I got mine with 6k miles and it was a bit of a rattle box. Almost all sorted... Just the rear few mirror got a vibration and then I got that vibration from the passenger side speaker almost sorted. Brakes - I got PCCB and they are good as new at 14k miles.
End of the day this is the best all round Supercar if you ask me. With 14k miles on the clock my turbo looks and drives as it just got out of the factory! You just need to find the right car... Go test drive a few low mile OPC and independent cars...
Just the rear few mirror got a vibration and then I got that vibration from the passenger side speaker almost sorted. Brakes - I got PCCB and they are good as new at 14k miles.End of the day this is the best all round Supercar if you ask me. With 14k miles on the clock my turbo looks and drives as it just got out of the factory! You just need to find the right car... Go test drive a few low mile OPC and independent cars...
Edited by mm450exc on Wednesday 22 February 21:53
Still stand by my comment about 06/07 cars with lowish mileage looking at many of the cars in the classifieds today. Lots and lots of average cars. To the OP if you want a nice car you're not going to nick it. Its a shame you missed a few of of Henry's turbos for £50k-£70k .
The turbo cab he had was virtually new!
The turbo cab he had was virtually new!
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