Who's owned both 997.1 Turbo & 997.1 C2S?
Discussion
Hi there
Not planning on changing yet just curious. At the moment I've got 997.1 C2S with aerokit, ceramics, sports chrono, PSE and X51 add-ons. The car is a real 1420kg (weighed) and dynoed at 378BHP. I absolutely love the car, instant throttle response and the handling is great with quite a raw, precise and light feeling to it, if I change I shall do so next year or probably just keep it until the engine explodes as according to the Internet it will at some point, lol. Car is on PSS and the ceramics are sublime and on track days it goes very well but could do with more front camber, a set of RSS arms would sort that but could pose warranty issues.
I test drove a turbo before I got mine, it was a 997.1 tiptronic with chrono, steel brakes etc. For me it was great with unbelievable mid-range power but I found the throttle/engine response was not that off the manual and it did not feel quite as raw/light as my car.
But I've been thinking about a Turbo as maybe next car, they seem superb value as in 50-55k gets a very nice car. I am thinking manual, ceramics and chrono. Any other must haves that improve the drive and help keep weight down?
Anyway my questions is to those who have owned both how would you say they compare when it comes to handling, grip and well throttle response and does the engine like to be revved like in the Carrera S? Even better those who have driven both on track, how did they compare?
Those who know the specs what does the 997.1 turbo weigh? What can one expect from a remap and any other basic breathing mods which effect power in a positive way?
Not planning on changing yet just curious. At the moment I've got 997.1 C2S with aerokit, ceramics, sports chrono, PSE and X51 add-ons. The car is a real 1420kg (weighed) and dynoed at 378BHP. I absolutely love the car, instant throttle response and the handling is great with quite a raw, precise and light feeling to it, if I change I shall do so next year or probably just keep it until the engine explodes as according to the Internet it will at some point, lol. Car is on PSS and the ceramics are sublime and on track days it goes very well but could do with more front camber, a set of RSS arms would sort that but could pose warranty issues.
I test drove a turbo before I got mine, it was a 997.1 tiptronic with chrono, steel brakes etc. For me it was great with unbelievable mid-range power but I found the throttle/engine response was not that off the manual and it did not feel quite as raw/light as my car.
But I've been thinking about a Turbo as maybe next car, they seem superb value as in 50-55k gets a very nice car. I am thinking manual, ceramics and chrono. Any other must haves that improve the drive and help keep weight down?
Anyway my questions is to those who have owned both how would you say they compare when it comes to handling, grip and well throttle response and does the engine like to be revved like in the Carrera S? Even better those who have driven both on track, how did they compare?
Those who know the specs what does the 997.1 turbo weigh? What can one expect from a remap and any other basic breathing mods which effect power in a positive way?
I've driven, not owned, a Carrera S and they are a nice car. Great steering feel, sufficient power for the road but the Turbo with a mild remap is pure bonkers. Sure, the throttle response is never going to be as sharp in a Turbo car, but believe me, this will be the last thing you think of when you're at the helm. You learn to drive around the tiniest bit of lag, and then are blown away with the torque which wants to chew up the tarmac and spit it out the back.
I own a manual Turbo with a stage 1 DMS map (with Sport Chrono), Capristo exhaust, BMC panel filter and carbon airbox and really crave the power. The PCCBs are awesome (as you've already experienced) and I can't think of a more complete point-to-point weapon on the road. We live in a country where it seems to rain for half the year, the Turbo revels in this.
My Turbo eats Gallardos/F430s/all Astons/M-cars etc and only costs a pittance to service every couple of years.
Being a supercar bargain at the moment is also a bonus.
Edit - I've driven my car on the Nurburgring and the only car which went past was a GT3RS 4.0 on semi-slicks. With all due respect, a C2S or any other 911 model wouldn't know which way a Turbo had gone if it rained!
The Turbo doesn't need to be revved to make it work either, sure it's smooth to the redline, but so much power and torque is available from 1500RPM, you rarely find yourself in a wrong gear.
I own a manual Turbo with a stage 1 DMS map (with Sport Chrono), Capristo exhaust, BMC panel filter and carbon airbox and really crave the power. The PCCBs are awesome (as you've already experienced) and I can't think of a more complete point-to-point weapon on the road. We live in a country where it seems to rain for half the year, the Turbo revels in this.
My Turbo eats Gallardos/F430s/all Astons/M-cars etc and only costs a pittance to service every couple of years.
Being a supercar bargain at the moment is also a bonus.
Edit - I've driven my car on the Nurburgring and the only car which went past was a GT3RS 4.0 on semi-slicks. With all due respect, a C2S or any other 911 model wouldn't know which way a Turbo had gone if it rained!
The Turbo doesn't need to be revved to make it work either, sure it's smooth to the redline, but so much power and torque is available from 1500RPM, you rarely find yourself in a wrong gear.
Edited by Martian O on Tuesday 3rd April 00:18
Hi there
Thanks guys interesting feedback. I have to say though I don't have this issue in the wet, I find the C2S is very capable in the wet and can be driven very very quickly, its just about overcoming the fears and knowing what to do when things go wrong. I've owned an EVO X previously which was 4WD with torque transfer and just about every other bit of voodoo magic to aid traction and I find I can easily make progress just as quick in the wet now in the C2S, but it has taken and I repeat taken a lot of time to learn how to drive the car to do so, wheras in the EVO it was just easy in comparison. The biggest issue with the C2S I find is in more greasy conditions or when the front tyres are cold, as then understeer is very much present, very safe but can really hinder progress. As such the fronts really need heat in them and greasy roads are a no go, this is where for me I found 4WD works much better and is far more controllable when all 4 wheels are lit up.
I love the rawness and connected feeling I get from my C2S, think its options help a bit as I drove about 4 of them before going for my car as mine just blew them away on test drive, which I think was down to the specification and no doubt because its a good one.
I just wonder if with a Turbo I'd loose a bit of feel, rawness and maybe the extra weight would make itself felt. I'd also love a GT3 as I think it is more me, but I also love the thought of a Turbo, they seem a better buy or should I say bargain and one thing for sure with 500+ ponies straight lines and slip roads will be fun.
Just trying to get an extended test drive in a 997.1 Turbo is not easy, Porsche only want to do extended drives in new cars and though I'd love a new Turbo S for a day my bank manager would not.
Thanks guys interesting feedback. I have to say though I don't have this issue in the wet, I find the C2S is very capable in the wet and can be driven very very quickly, its just about overcoming the fears and knowing what to do when things go wrong. I've owned an EVO X previously which was 4WD with torque transfer and just about every other bit of voodoo magic to aid traction and I find I can easily make progress just as quick in the wet now in the C2S, but it has taken and I repeat taken a lot of time to learn how to drive the car to do so, wheras in the EVO it was just easy in comparison. The biggest issue with the C2S I find is in more greasy conditions or when the front tyres are cold, as then understeer is very much present, very safe but can really hinder progress. As such the fronts really need heat in them and greasy roads are a no go, this is where for me I found 4WD works much better and is far more controllable when all 4 wheels are lit up.
I love the rawness and connected feeling I get from my C2S, think its options help a bit as I drove about 4 of them before going for my car as mine just blew them away on test drive, which I think was down to the specification and no doubt because its a good one.
I just wonder if with a Turbo I'd loose a bit of feel, rawness and maybe the extra weight would make itself felt. I'd also love a GT3 as I think it is more me, but I also love the thought of a Turbo, they seem a better buy or should I say bargain and one thing for sure with 500+ ponies straight lines and slip roads will be fun.
Just trying to get an extended test drive in a 997.1 Turbo is not easy, Porsche only want to do extended drives in new cars and though I'd love a new Turbo S for a day my bank manager would not.
Gibbo I completely agree with you, I too have a similar spec to you (no aero/X51 kit) and I love the lightness and raw feeling it provides. And my biggest bug bear is the rubbish understeer, yes you can drive around it, but it does slow down progress some what.
I agree it is a lovely car in the wet too, it really does come alive...
I had a go in a 996T on track and was left a little underwhelmed, yes the power was good, but the soft suspension, soft brakes and weight really dulled the car some what. I am sure the 997t on PASM/PCCBs would address these issues, but it is still a heavy car.
I am looking at replacement/hanging-on options too, candidates are a 997t or an R8. I have issues with the 'blingyness' of the R8, and like you I need to drive the 97t to make my mind up. I do feel that if I can sort out the front end traction issues and get a PSE I will be a happy camper and mine will be a keeper too, until it blows up.
Let me know what you think after you have a go in a 97t...
Any chance you going to Bedford on the 10th April?
I agree it is a lovely car in the wet too, it really does come alive...
I had a go in a 996T on track and was left a little underwhelmed, yes the power was good, but the soft suspension, soft brakes and weight really dulled the car some what. I am sure the 997t on PASM/PCCBs would address these issues, but it is still a heavy car.
I am looking at replacement/hanging-on options too, candidates are a 997t or an R8. I have issues with the 'blingyness' of the R8, and like you I need to drive the 97t to make my mind up. I do feel that if I can sort out the front end traction issues and get a PSE I will be a happy camper and mine will be a keeper too, until it blows up.
Let me know what you think after you have a go in a 97t...
Any chance you going to Bedford on the 10th April?
Owned both,the carrera s is a better car IMO.
Turbo very comfortable,but aside from the sheer speed of it I thought it was the worst Porsche I have owned.
There is turbo lag,and it felt unsatisfactory driving over my favourite roads,it feels like the car is driving you,not you driving the car.as a supercar experience it fails miserably ,rubbish noise .brilliant car for chugging up and down motorways but I would take a base carrera over it day,as many road testers have commented.
Turbo very comfortable,but aside from the sheer speed of it I thought it was the worst Porsche I have owned.
There is turbo lag,and it felt unsatisfactory driving over my favourite roads,it feels like the car is driving you,not you driving the car.as a supercar experience it fails miserably ,rubbish noise .brilliant car for chugging up and down motorways but I would take a base carrera over it day,as many road testers have commented.
This might sound a bit strange but if its "rawness" and "throttle response" that grabs you then you probably would not like the 997 Turbo S. I owned one for around 18months and while they are laugh out loud FAST, I eventually grew a bit tired of the driving experience which is a bit "sit back and hold on". They are almost like an arcade game. Don't get me wrong, they are one special car, but......
Anyway, I moved on from there and now have a 997.1 Turbo in manual and it's somehow more of an "event" to drive and somehow more involving but still with 90% of the pace of the Turbo S. I also had a C2S a few years ago but can't remember enough about it to make a sensible comparison. From what I remember of the C2S the 997.1 Turbo is in another league altogether.
Anyway, I moved on from there and now have a 997.1 Turbo in manual and it's somehow more of an "event" to drive and somehow more involving but still with 90% of the pace of the Turbo S. I also had a C2S a few years ago but can't remember enough about it to make a sensible comparison. From what I remember of the C2S the 997.1 Turbo is in another league altogether.
Martian O said:
The Turbo really is the consumate all rounder. Annihilate pretty much everything on the road, rock up to a track day and do the same. Drive 400 miles home from the 'Ring in comfort averaging 28MPG at a steady 85MPH. What's not to like? (OK, fit a fruity exhaust!)
+1 Excellent all rounder and very quick. Did ok at SPA the other week. But the GT3RS is something else!Weight 1585 kilo / 3494.3 lbs
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