New Boxster Test Drive - Disappointed.
Discussion
Hi Chaps,
Had a test drive in the 981 today, car was an 'S' with PDK and the Sports Chrono options etc
So, the good; the car is very refined interior wise and looks gorgeous. No denying it IS a looker and moves the game on massively from the last car in that department. The nav treatment is awesome and the digital oil temp gauge is looooong overdue.
However, I felt a bit awkward when the salesman asked me for my verdict because hand-on-heart I was left a bit nonplussed. When I first drove a Porsche 4 or 5 years ago it was an experience; so different from anything I'd driven before, it was apparent as soon as I took the wheel. I was used to fast Audi's (had a tuned '57 plate S3 and spent a lot of time in RS's etc), and as such the steering feel and communication was quite simply a revelation before even learning to explore the abilities of the chassis.
The GF was quizzing me as I drove round today which kinda forced me to think hard about why I wasn't getting that special feeling a Porsche should give. Sadly, and despite a lot of press commentary to the contrary I think Porsche really have screwed up by moving away from hydraulic steering. I can only explain it in the following way: had I been able to close my eyes I could not have told you I was driving a Porsche. It could have been any of the big German marques work. The opposite is true of the Porsches I have driven before including my own humble 987 S. They are so distinct and communicative (cliche I know). The DFI engine didn't produce any characterful noise until the top end of the range either.
The wider track meant the car felt more planted but this only served to remove more of the character for me. It didn't talk to me. I'm sure PDK exacerbated the problem a little but still... I drove my favourite roads and my usual speeds with half the effort and half the satisfaction (maybe a little harsh, but you get my point).
I'm genuinely a bit gutted as I was intending to get into the new Cayman when it comes along but my experience doesn't bode well.
I've enjoyed my Cayman so much, I feel like a kid in the park who's just watched a bully stab his football.
Had a test drive in the 981 today, car was an 'S' with PDK and the Sports Chrono options etc
So, the good; the car is very refined interior wise and looks gorgeous. No denying it IS a looker and moves the game on massively from the last car in that department. The nav treatment is awesome and the digital oil temp gauge is looooong overdue.
However, I felt a bit awkward when the salesman asked me for my verdict because hand-on-heart I was left a bit nonplussed. When I first drove a Porsche 4 or 5 years ago it was an experience; so different from anything I'd driven before, it was apparent as soon as I took the wheel. I was used to fast Audi's (had a tuned '57 plate S3 and spent a lot of time in RS's etc), and as such the steering feel and communication was quite simply a revelation before even learning to explore the abilities of the chassis.
The GF was quizzing me as I drove round today which kinda forced me to think hard about why I wasn't getting that special feeling a Porsche should give. Sadly, and despite a lot of press commentary to the contrary I think Porsche really have screwed up by moving away from hydraulic steering. I can only explain it in the following way: had I been able to close my eyes I could not have told you I was driving a Porsche. It could have been any of the big German marques work. The opposite is true of the Porsches I have driven before including my own humble 987 S. They are so distinct and communicative (cliche I know). The DFI engine didn't produce any characterful noise until the top end of the range either.
The wider track meant the car felt more planted but this only served to remove more of the character for me. It didn't talk to me. I'm sure PDK exacerbated the problem a little but still... I drove my favourite roads and my usual speeds with half the effort and half the satisfaction (maybe a little harsh, but you get my point).
I'm genuinely a bit gutted as I was intending to get into the new Cayman when it comes along but my experience doesn't bode well.
I've enjoyed my Cayman so much, I feel like a kid in the park who's just watched a bully stab his football.
Edited by DoubleSix on Saturday 5th May 21:54
Well, convertibles aren't really my thing so I didn't have any real intention of writing a cheque, and the dealer was well aware of this. He and I both knew it was just an opportunity to give me some insight into what the new Cayman is going to feel like.
Sadly, I think its given me a little too much insight into where Porsche as a whole are headed.
Sadly, I think its given me a little too much insight into where Porsche as a whole are headed.
Personally I think all modern cars are becoming a detached driving experience (I was moaning about a test drive in a E9x M3 vs. my old E46 M3 over in GG eariler in the week - scuppered my plan of attack for next car purchase).
I'm beginning to think that it's all about reference points - when you first start to drive performance cars that becomes your reference point.
I never understood why the generation above me were so fixated still on the 993...but I can now see that their reference point was that model...whereas my reference/starting point was the 996. Any detachment that occurs after your reference point takes away enjoyment.
Not sure if any of that makes sense !
I'm beginning to think that it's all about reference points - when you first start to drive performance cars that becomes your reference point.
I never understood why the generation above me were so fixated still on the 993...but I can now see that their reference point was that model...whereas my reference/starting point was the 996. Any detachment that occurs after your reference point takes away enjoyment.
Not sure if any of that makes sense !
SonnyM said:
DoubleSix said:
Hi Chaps,
Had a test drive in the 981 today, car was an 'S' with PDK and the Sports Chrono options etc
...
Was the car Red and your GF blonde by any chance?Had a test drive in the 981 today, car was an 'S' with PDK and the Sports Chrono options etc
...
Edited by DoubleSix on Saturday 5th May 21:54
Car was lime gold, GF is a red head.... It's a shame, but I think you're right. The move to elec steering is apparently driven by the need to offer self-parking systems and even lighter steering. It's part of the same crap as the over-badging of the 991 series. It's a bit like how MP3s are rubbish compared to vinyl or tape (ask any sound engineer - most of the detail is left out, but people don't know any better). There are more people who want to drive a flashy badge and to go quick without needing to try and they'll love the 991. Those of us who liked the interactivity, the challenge and the over-engineering are not a significant group of people for VW's bean counters, who are winning the battle internally, as I predicted they would. Noble maybe?
tommy1973s said:
Those of us who liked the interactivity, the challenge and the over-engineering are not a significant group of people for VW's bean counters, who are winning the battle internally, as I predicted they would. Noble maybe?
Surely the only way to get that is to buy an early 911, a classic car or dare I say it, something that is not well made.How can there be any challenge to driving a modern car, in other than size, possibly?
Also, personally I really doubt I would choose a car on the strength of a test drive. I really feel that to get to know a car well, especially modern cars which are all just so capable, one has to own that car for a period of time.
SonnyM said:
Was the car Red and your GF blonde by any chance?
Were you at Mid-Sussex yesterday waiting for some work to be done on your RS60? The other RS60 there was mine. I test drove the red one with my wife. Is it us you were thinking of?Will post thoughts of 981 from a computer later (on iPhone). We haven't cancelled our deposit.
steve singh said:
Personally I think all modern cars are becoming a detached driving experience (I was moaning about a test drive in a E9x M3 vs. my old E46 M3 over in GG eariler in the week - scuppered my plan of attack for next car purchase).
I'm beginning to think that it's all about reference points - when you first start to drive performance cars that becomes your reference point.
I never understood why the generation above me were so fixated still on the 993...but I can now see that their reference point was that model...whereas my reference/starting point was the 996. Any detachment that occurs after your reference point takes away enjoyment.
Not sure if any of that makes sense !
This makes perfect sense to me...I have been in exactly same position as you...owned the e46 m3 - and the e9x just felt fake!I'm beginning to think that it's all about reference points - when you first start to drive performance cars that becomes your reference point.
I never understood why the generation above me were so fixated still on the 993...but I can now see that their reference point was that model...whereas my reference/starting point was the 996. Any detachment that occurs after your reference point takes away enjoyment.
Not sure if any of that makes sense !
Moving onto pork...my reference point was the 996 and hence I don't feel the attachment to the older models, however good they may be!
I guess times move on and will continue to do so as newer models are introduced.
One day people may be saying pork aren't made how they used to be (and be referring to a 991!).
steve singh said:
Personally I think all modern cars are becoming a detached driving experience (I was moaning about a test drive in a E9x M3 vs. my old E46 M3 over in GG eariler in the week - scuppered my plan of attack for next car purchase).
I'm beginning to think that it's all about reference points - when you first start to drive performance cars that becomes your reference point.
I never understood why the generation above me were so fixated still on the 993...but I can now see that their reference point was that model...whereas my reference/starting point was the 996. Any detachment that occurs after your reference point takes away enjoyment.
Not sure if any of that makes sense !
+ 1 I'm beginning to think that it's all about reference points - when you first start to drive performance cars that becomes your reference point.
I never understood why the generation above me were so fixated still on the 993...but I can now see that their reference point was that model...whereas my reference/starting point was the 996. Any detachment that occurs after your reference point takes away enjoyment.
Not sure if any of that makes sense !
Makes a lot of sense Steve.
Helicopter123 said:
Boxster has to satisfy a different market to the 911/Cayman.
Why not wait for the new Cayman or bag a 997 GTS?
I know what you're saying but all three have always shared their steering components and characteristics. Salesman said if I didn't like the steering on the Boxster then I'd hate the new 911 as it is even lighter in his opinion. Why not wait for the new Cayman or bag a 997 GTS?
Can't see them radically changing the steering for the Cayman release, hence my disappointment.
doozy said:
I've owned two 987.1 Caymans for over five years and i love them for all the reasons you mention.
The 987.2 was a little more refined / softer / quieter and i firmly believe the new one will be even more so.
So i'm going to stick with the original for the foreseeable future.
Yup, my conclusion also.The 987.2 was a little more refined / softer / quieter and i firmly believe the new one will be even more so.
So i'm going to stick with the original for the foreseeable future.
I was very curious to try the DFI engine as I'd heard a lot about it being less characterful in the 987.2 - It's always interesting to find theses things out for ones self.
My 987.1 (with PSE), burbles and growls and does a whole little act of it's own even at low revs, can't say the same for DFI.
DoubleSix said:
Helicopter123 said:
Boxster has to satisfy a different market to the 911/Cayman.
Why not wait for the new Cayman or bag a 997 GTS?
I know what you're saying but all three have always shared their steering components and characteristics. Salesman said if I didn't like the steering on the Boxster then I'd hate the new 911 as it is even lighter in his opinion. Why not wait for the new Cayman or bag a 997 GTS?
Can't see them radically changing the steering for the Cayman release, hence my disappointment.
Helicopter123 said:
DoubleSix said:
Helicopter123 said:
Boxster has to satisfy a different market to the 911/Cayman.
Why not wait for the new Cayman or bag a 997 GTS?
I know what you're saying but all three have always shared their steering components and characteristics. Salesman said if I didn't like the steering on the Boxster then I'd hate the new 911 as it is even lighter in his opinion. Why not wait for the new Cayman or bag a 997 GTS?
Can't see them radically changing the steering for the Cayman release, hence my disappointment.
It's just a shame they messed up the more crucial elements during the exercise. If I feel the need for a bump in power I reckon a GTS is exactly where I'll start looking, that or a GT3, but for now I feel I have no need to move on.
I drove the GTS hoping for a cut down GT3 , was disapointing.
It,s just a normal 911.
I found it unexciting.
Spyders def the best car to have fun in. It,s a great car for fun, feel etc, just a bit unusable all year round.
I even find the GT3 fustrating on my fav B roads, the gearing is way to long and at higher speeds I have to back off on the bumpy bits where the Spyder would ride them.
I don,t see how a RS would be even usable on bumpy b roads at speed.
Drive a Spyder, it will be the most fun you will have in a Porsche imo.
Ps. I would mod your Cayman for 345bhp, it transforms the car, would mean ditching you pse, but that's a good thing it weighs 3 tons s d offers no power gain.
It,s just a normal 911.
I found it unexciting.
Spyders def the best car to have fun in. It,s a great car for fun, feel etc, just a bit unusable all year round.
I even find the GT3 fustrating on my fav B roads, the gearing is way to long and at higher speeds I have to back off on the bumpy bits where the Spyder would ride them.
I don,t see how a RS would be even usable on bumpy b roads at speed.
Drive a Spyder, it will be the most fun you will have in a Porsche imo.
Ps. I would mod your Cayman for 345bhp, it transforms the car, would mean ditching you pse, but that's a good thing it weighs 3 tons s d offers no power gain.
Edited by mrdemon on Sunday 6th May 11:21
mrdemon said:
I drove the GTS hoping for a cut down GT3 , was disapointing.
It,s just a normal 911.
I found it unexciting.
Errr, you can't say that about a SPASM-equipped GTS w/PDK. but then you may not have tried one.It,s just a normal 911.
I found it unexciting.
Edited by mrdemon on Sunday 6th May 11:21
On a hoon it is epic: low, mean, connected and soooo quick!! Turn in is noticeably different to its C2S predecessor. It only requires the merest feathering of the brakes pre-corner to place sufficient weight over the turning wheels to dial out understeer completely. A lovely sensation.
As no doubt the Spyder is as well.
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