Cayman R with Remus Titanium Exhaust
Discussion
Just a bit of feedback for anyone interested. My lad had this exhaust fitted recently and it looks nice with blue tips now after it's got some heat through it and it sounds really nice over the stock one, especially when giving it the beans. There's is slightly more drone from inside the cabin around the 2-3K mark, but it is not loud by any means.
Anyway to the performance testing, not scientific by any means but empirical evidence nonetheless. We also run a gen2 Cayman S pdk with sports plus etc in the family, the R is manual and has all the light weight trimmings too ie no air con etc.. Before getting the new exhaust fitted we carried out a few runs between the two (straight line) for off the mark and pull from 2nd gear. before new exhaust there really was nothing in it. probably the bit extra power and light weight offset by the difference in gear change speed between manual and pdk. In any event they were pretty much neck and neck.
After the new exhaust there is a clear difference, both from start and pull from second through all gears. We did a few runs and the R pulled a couple of car lengths in all cases before silly speeds.
Anyway, probably enough evidence to say the new exhaust does also seem to add a little more power/performance.
Anyway to the performance testing, not scientific by any means but empirical evidence nonetheless. We also run a gen2 Cayman S pdk with sports plus etc in the family, the R is manual and has all the light weight trimmings too ie no air con etc.. Before getting the new exhaust fitted we carried out a few runs between the two (straight line) for off the mark and pull from 2nd gear. before new exhaust there really was nothing in it. probably the bit extra power and light weight offset by the difference in gear change speed between manual and pdk. In any event they were pretty much neck and neck.
After the new exhaust there is a clear difference, both from start and pull from second through all gears. We did a few runs and the R pulled a couple of car lengths in all cases before silly speeds.
Anyway, probably enough evidence to say the new exhaust does also seem to add a little more power/performance.
mrdemon said:
I would very much like to see it, must be the only one in the Uk.
Been thinking about one for a while.
Where are you based ?
We are in Gerrards Cross. Funny enough it's the car on the Design911 website videoBeen thinking about one for a while.
Where are you based ?
http://www.design911.co.uk/fu/pt63_1379_-cma81-cmo...
m030 said:
The HP gains for just changing the exhaust on a 987.2 are minimal as both the primary and secondary cats are inside the manifolds and not in the left and right exhaust boxes.
So you are not deleting any cats by changing just the back boxes.
The secondary cats are in the exhaust, removed on the Remus and other cat-back systems. Primary cats are found in the headers, where the secondary cats are found just before the back-box. Heat shielding is applied to the stock exhaust around them, this is not necessary on secondary catless exhaust systems.So you are not deleting any cats by changing just the back boxes.
Edited by m030 on Monday 4th March 19:45
Edited by OldBob on Tuesday 5th March 09:43
You are wrong.
On the 987.2, there are NO cats inside the exhaust boxes.
Both the primary and secondary cats are inside the manifolds.
The 987.1 has the primary cat inside the manifold and the secondary in the exhaust.
The original 987.2 exhaust boxes might look as if there is a cat in the round part, but there is nothing inside.
Hence why there is a lot of confusion, even among exhaust manufacturers.
On the 987.2, there are NO cats inside the exhaust boxes.
Both the primary and secondary cats are inside the manifolds.
The 987.1 has the primary cat inside the manifold and the secondary in the exhaust.
The original 987.2 exhaust boxes might look as if there is a cat in the round part, but there is nothing inside.
Hence why there is a lot of confusion, even among exhaust manufacturers.
m030 said:
You are wrong.
On the 987.2, there are NO cats inside the exhaust boxes.
Both the primary and secondary cats are inside the manifolds.
The 987.1 has the primary cat inside the manifold and the secondary in the exhaust.
The original 987.2 exhaust boxes might look as if there is a cat in the round part, but there is nothing inside.
Hence why there is a lot of confusion, even among exhaust manufacturers.
+1On the 987.2, there are NO cats inside the exhaust boxes.
Both the primary and secondary cats are inside the manifolds.
The 987.1 has the primary cat inside the manifold and the secondary in the exhaust.
The original 987.2 exhaust boxes might look as if there is a cat in the round part, but there is nothing inside.
Hence why there is a lot of confusion, even among exhaust manufacturers.
m030 said:
You are wrong.
On the 987.2, there are NO cats inside the exhaust boxes.
Both the primary and secondary cats are inside the manifolds.
The 987.1 has the primary cat inside the manifold and the secondary in the exhaust.
The original 987.2 exhaust boxes might look as if there is a cat in the round part, but there is nothing inside.
Hence why there is a lot of confusion, even among exhaust manufacturers.
Is this the case? What are your sources?On the 987.2, there are NO cats inside the exhaust boxes.
Both the primary and secondary cats are inside the manifolds.
The 987.1 has the primary cat inside the manifold and the secondary in the exhaust.
The original 987.2 exhaust boxes might look as if there is a cat in the round part, but there is nothing inside.
Hence why there is a lot of confusion, even among exhaust manufacturers.
I'm running a stock exhaust with Fabspeed catless headers; would be interesting to know if i have been running without a catalytic converter. (/skeptical)
Just so you know, i realise they are not in the back box. I would assume they are between the box and the manifold in the connecting pipe, since there is the characteristic bulge and associated heat shielding
Edited by Wyzim on Tuesday 5th March 17:34
HokumPokum said:
m030 said:
You are wrong.
On the 987.2, there are NO cats inside the exhaust boxes.
Both the primary and secondary cats are inside the manifolds.
The 987.1 has the primary cat inside the manifold and the secondary in the exhaust.
The original 987.2 exhaust boxes might look as if there is a cat in the round part, but there is nothing inside.
Hence why there is a lot of confusion, even among exhaust manufacturers.
+1On the 987.2, there are NO cats inside the exhaust boxes.
Both the primary and secondary cats are inside the manifolds.
The 987.1 has the primary cat inside the manifold and the secondary in the exhaust.
The original 987.2 exhaust boxes might look as if there is a cat in the round part, but there is nothing inside.
Hence why there is a lot of confusion, even among exhaust manufacturers.
However Milltek exhaust here as an example:
http://www.millteksport.com/product.news.read.cfm?...
Would appear to add an extra catalytic converter in the rear silencer
Hmmmm
Wyzim said:
I'm running a stock exhaust with Fabspeed catless headers; would be interesting to know if i have been running without a catalytic converter.
I can only answer your question if you tell me if your car is a 987.1 or 987.2.This because , and as you can read above, the exhaust systems between the 2 gens are competely different.
m030 said:
OldBob said:
Hmm would be nice to know for sure. Hmmmm
Now that you have a new exhaust, cut open your original 987.2 exhaust and see for yourself ! Hmmmm
Maybe me finding another source might be easier
It actually doesn't matter, it definitely seems to make a difference over stock, as per OP.
Other sources, on net advertising the zorst granted, do also suggest some power increase, although I've seen no Dyno data. Might just be the much increased diameter helping flow or whatever, or maybe just an expensive white elephant
either way the lads happyEdited by OldBob on Tuesday 5th March 18:51
OldBob said:
It actually doesn't matter.....
I'm glad your happy and don't get me wrong, it's a good exhaust.What bothers me, is that a lot of exhaust manufacturers like Fabspeed , Agency Power and others make you believe that -on a 987.2- you are deleting the secondary cats by installing their back boxes.
When these so called "exhaust experts" don't even know the location of the 2nd cats, it comes clear how little R&D they do for a new exhaust.
m030 said:
I'm glad your happy and don't get me wrong, it's a good exhaust.
What bothers me, is that a lot of exhaust manufacturers like Fabspeed , Agency Power and others make you believe that -on a 987.2- you are deleting the secondary cats by installing their back boxes.
When these so called "exhaust experts" don't even know the location of the 2nd cats, it comes clear how little R&D they do for a new exhaust.
Yes that is a bit naughty as they all claim to do so. Even quoting:What bothers me, is that a lot of exhaust manufacturers like Fabspeed , Agency Power and others make you believe that -on a 987.2- you are deleting the secondary cats by installing their back boxes.
When these so called "exhaust experts" don't even know the location of the 2nd cats, it comes clear how little R&D they do for a new exhaust.
"Fabspeed’s Ver. 2, two-can system for the 987 Cayman/Boxster replaces the heavy stock exhaust and secondary catalytic converters with a more pronounced exotic car sound."
"Eliminates 2nd set of unnecessary catalytic converters. Each and every new 987 Boxster and Cayman comes with 4 cats. The 2nd set is eliminated for reduced backpressure and better exhaust flow and much improved sportscar sound."
"REMUS is really one of the most popular options for these cars as it remains civil but gives that exotic wail the Cayman deserves. It does delete the secondary cats, but that does not throw a CEL, and you retain the primary cats. Unless they compare OEM schematics versus your aftermarket exhaust, you will pass sniff tests. Secondary cats are there for cold start up emission controls".
Shouldn't be allowed really
So do the stock headers on a Gen2 have the two cats in the one header?
OldBob said:
Shouldn't be allowed really
True, it almost sounds like a scam.OldBob said:
So do the stock headers on a Gen2 have the two cats in the one header?
Yes, 100% sure !!! Just look at the shape of a 987.2 manifold and how they are welded together . You can see the location of the primary and secondary cat in each manifold with the "after" lambda sensor in between.
OldBob said:
So do the stock headers on a Gen2 have the two cats in the one header?
Yes, 100% sure !!! Just look at the shape of a 987.2 manifold and how they are welded together . You can see the location of the primary and secondary cat in each manifold with the "after" lambda sensor in between.
So sorry to be a pain but you reckon this bloke is talking rubbish from 1:29 minutes when he talks through the 987.2 Cayman exhaust on the car.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upyN09yXddY
Do you have any links to diagrams or pictures that show the two cats on the headers that I can use?
Do you think US might be different?
Thx
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