Scored bores 997.1 (maybe) - head in the sand approach?
Discussion
Guys,
Is there any advice for people who don't know for sure they have scored bores and since the car runs perfectly well they would just like to continue driving and enjoying the car until more obvious symptoms appear.
I appreciate this may be a slightly naive approach but the car does run perfectly so far, its out of warranty and I don't just want to throw a load of cash at the engine immediately if its maintainable for a while until its far more obvious (if ever). Getting a Boroscope is obviously a first step but since the car is on 70k if there are issues they have probably been there a while with no obvious effect.
So far my only reason to think I may have a problem is a little extra soot on the left side exhaust pipes, I topped up the oil a week or so ago by maybe 1/2 a quart and I plan on watching oil consumption.
(A google search may suggest extra oil being burned in bank 6?? )
For what its worth, an OPC healthcheck this week only suggested new discs/pads and apart from that they gave a full bill of health.
I guess another question is, will bore scored engines actually fail after so long, or will I just burn more and more oil over time and just have a power loss if unresolved?
Like I said, i've no real evidence, and Im fully prepared to look at a Hartech rebuild if ever needed, but I'm just wondering how to best manage the maintenance going forwards, and just really enjoy the car until that time!
expert replies welcome !
Is there any advice for people who don't know for sure they have scored bores and since the car runs perfectly well they would just like to continue driving and enjoying the car until more obvious symptoms appear.
I appreciate this may be a slightly naive approach but the car does run perfectly so far, its out of warranty and I don't just want to throw a load of cash at the engine immediately if its maintainable for a while until its far more obvious (if ever). Getting a Boroscope is obviously a first step but since the car is on 70k if there are issues they have probably been there a while with no obvious effect.
So far my only reason to think I may have a problem is a little extra soot on the left side exhaust pipes, I topped up the oil a week or so ago by maybe 1/2 a quart and I plan on watching oil consumption.
(A google search may suggest extra oil being burned in bank 6?? )
For what its worth, an OPC healthcheck this week only suggested new discs/pads and apart from that they gave a full bill of health.
I guess another question is, will bore scored engines actually fail after so long, or will I just burn more and more oil over time and just have a power loss if unresolved?
Like I said, i've no real evidence, and Im fully prepared to look at a Hartech rebuild if ever needed, but I'm just wondering how to best manage the maintenance going forwards, and just really enjoy the car until that time!
expert replies welcome !
A boroscope is the obvious approach as you say. If you elect not to do anything then it is likely that if you do have scored bores, the oil consumption will increase as the gap between the piston and liner increases and in addition, a tapping sound will probably be heard as the piston slaps against the liner.
If it was me I would want to know.
If it was me I would want to know.
The longer you leave it the worse the problem could become. For example if you catch it early you may only need a hone and new rings, but leave it longer and you might need a re-sleeve and a piston. Leave it even longer and you might start getting problems in other cylinders.
The issue here is when do you know you really have a problem? Boroscopes don't really give you a detailed enough view from those that I have seen, the picture they give is quite low resolution. If the bore looks lightly marked and you have done 70k miles does that mean you have an issue or is this just normal wear and tear? No one can tell you I don't think. I'd like to hear from someone who had light scoring in cylinder 6 who then checked say, cylinder one for a comparison (never heard this done but it might tell you something?).
If you go to Hartech remember they are very good and very helpful but they are also in business to make money. If they tell you after seeing light scoring that you need a rebuild then you need to weigh up all the options yourself. Even the cheapest solution is likely to cost well over 4k after VAT.
One engine expert once told me, "if it ain't broke"......so if its not using oil where is the problem? Enjoy it until you have a real problem and stop worrying?
The issue here is when do you know you really have a problem? Boroscopes don't really give you a detailed enough view from those that I have seen, the picture they give is quite low resolution. If the bore looks lightly marked and you have done 70k miles does that mean you have an issue or is this just normal wear and tear? No one can tell you I don't think. I'd like to hear from someone who had light scoring in cylinder 6 who then checked say, cylinder one for a comparison (never heard this done but it might tell you something?).
If you go to Hartech remember they are very good and very helpful but they are also in business to make money. If they tell you after seeing light scoring that you need a rebuild then you need to weigh up all the options yourself. Even the cheapest solution is likely to cost well over 4k after VAT.
One engine expert once told me, "if it ain't broke"......so if its not using oil where is the problem? Enjoy it until you have a real problem and stop worrying?
Have a read of the information on Hartech's site. Plenty of documentation to wade through.
If you had no idea about these things, you'd be carrying on until anything untoward occurred. You can make a conscious decision to do that, it's your car.
Look at the possible causes and try to reduce those conditions happening.
What year/model/gearbox is it?
If you had no idea about these things, you'd be carrying on until anything untoward occurred. You can make a conscious decision to do that, it's your car.
Look at the possible causes and try to reduce those conditions happening.
What year/model/gearbox is it?
So, what if you've not got any smoke? I'm assuming the focus is the "tapping" as contributing factor...... only asking as I've heard 996s and 997s with a bit of light tapping...... but not seen any smoke at all.
Is there an inherent tapping sound with the car anyway under normal engine operation? ie a characteristic of the car?
Is there an inherent tapping sound with the car anyway under normal engine operation? ie a characteristic of the car?
Slackster said:
Guys,
Is there any advice for people who don't know for sure they have scored bores and since the car runs perfectly well they would just like to continue driving and enjoying the car until more obvious symptoms appear.
I appreciate this may be a slightly naive approach but the car does run perfectly so far, its out of warranty and I don't just want to throw a load of cash at the engine immediately if its maintainable for a while until its far more obvious (if ever). Getting a Boroscope is obviously a first step but since the car is on 70k if there are issues they have probably been there a while with no obvious effect.
So far my only reason to think I may have a problem is a little extra soot on the left side exhaust pipes, I topped up the oil a week or so ago by maybe 1/2 a quart and I plan on watching oil consumption.
(A google search may suggest extra oil being burned in bank 6?? )
For what its worth, an OPC healthcheck this week only suggested new discs/pads and apart from that they gave a full bill of health.
I guess another question is, will bore scored engines actually fail after so long, or will I just burn more and more oil over time and just have a power loss if unresolved?
Like I said, i've no real evidence, and Im fully prepared to look at a Hartech rebuild if ever needed, but I'm just wondering how to best manage the maintenance going forwards, and just really enjoy the car until that time!
expert replies welcome !
Car is running perfectly fine? With 70K miles? Horrors!Is there any advice for people who don't know for sure they have scored bores and since the car runs perfectly well they would just like to continue driving and enjoying the car until more obvious symptoms appear.
I appreciate this may be a slightly naive approach but the car does run perfectly so far, its out of warranty and I don't just want to throw a load of cash at the engine immediately if its maintainable for a while until its far more obvious (if ever). Getting a Boroscope is obviously a first step but since the car is on 70k if there are issues they have probably been there a while with no obvious effect.
So far my only reason to think I may have a problem is a little extra soot on the left side exhaust pipes, I topped up the oil a week or so ago by maybe 1/2 a quart and I plan on watching oil consumption.
(A google search may suggest extra oil being burned in bank 6?? )
For what its worth, an OPC healthcheck this week only suggested new discs/pads and apart from that they gave a full bill of health.
I guess another question is, will bore scored engines actually fail after so long, or will I just burn more and more oil over time and just have a power loss if unresolved?
Like I said, i've no real evidence, and Im fully prepared to look at a Hartech rebuild if ever needed, but I'm just wondering how to best manage the maintenance going forwards, and just really enjoy the car until that time!
expert replies welcome !
Geesh. Get off line and go for a drive.
Remember there are two converters between the bad old scored bores and the exhaust outlets. Any bit of soot or other mild coloration there is more an indication of what is going on in the converters not the cylinders.
Really, I can't say this loud enough. No symptoms. (Phantom/imagined sooting of the exhaust outlets is not a symptom.) No CEL. No problem other than all this bore scoring talk has the owners of 997 models jumping out of their skins like the owners of older 996's do when someone walks up behind and says "IMS!".
Just keep doing what you've been doing. It has worked for 70K miles. Otherwise save your money. If (a big if) anything serious comes up (and the odds are very high it won't be bore scoring) then you have some money set aside to tap to get the car repaired and back on the road. If nothing major happens then you have a nice start towards your next car.
Gassing Station | Porsche General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff