How much is a 993 engine rebuild "worth"?
Discussion
I'm curious, how much do 993 enthusiasts think an engine rebuild is "worth" when selling on? 993 engines are known to soldier on pretty well, but for the purposes of this example assume its say a manual 2wd carrera (i.e. the one to have) on 130k miles worth it's current form say about £25k (seems about right) with no obvious probs and in overall good nick. how much extra would you pay if you were looking to buy:
1) the same car with a top end rebuild to standard 272bhp
2) the same car with a rebuild but taken 310bhp
3) the same car with a rebuild but taken to 350bhp
4) the same car with a rebuild but taken to 380bhp
For the purposes of this example assume the work is done by someone very reputable (e.g. Ninemeister, the examples above being their standard, 9m+1, 9m+2 and 9m+3 rebuild packages for a NVR as best I understand). Note I've deliberately not included the prices of the above options as I don't want to skew people thoughts.
Before anyone asks, my engine is fine (I hope!) but I am currently toying with various options should the worst ever happen or more likely that I lose self control and go on a spending spree
1) the same car with a top end rebuild to standard 272bhp
2) the same car with a rebuild but taken 310bhp
3) the same car with a rebuild but taken to 350bhp
4) the same car with a rebuild but taken to 380bhp
For the purposes of this example assume the work is done by someone very reputable (e.g. Ninemeister, the examples above being their standard, 9m+1, 9m+2 and 9m+3 rebuild packages for a NVR as best I understand). Note I've deliberately not included the prices of the above options as I don't want to skew people thoughts.
Before anyone asks, my engine is fine (I hope!) but I am currently toying with various options should the worst ever happen or more likely that I lose self control and go on a spending spree
Unless there is something wrong with the engine, I'd leave it.
Certainly wouldn't be messing around with increasing peformance, that would put many buyers off - 'originality' is key.
If you are going to spend money, pre-sale, get it serviced, MOT'd, first class valet, deal with any niggling issues, and have all the paperwork nicely prepared. Then place a carefully worded ad with some excellent pictures and price it sensibly - simple
Certainly wouldn't be messing around with increasing peformance, that would put many buyers off - 'originality' is key.
If you are going to spend money, pre-sale, get it serviced, MOT'd, first class valet, deal with any niggling issues, and have all the paperwork nicely prepared. Then place a carefully worded ad with some excellent pictures and price it sensibly - simple
Orangecurry said:
The 993 engine needs a turbo to get to the 3) and 4) levels of output.
After corresponding with 9m, they seem to think differently 
Any reason why I should not believe them? I've found some posts on PH and rennlist where people appear rather pleased and have got their 350bhp....admittedly have not heard of anyone talking about the 380 option they've had, but given it's eye wateringly expensive, I'm not surprised.Orangecurry said:
Get a Wayne remap for a few hundred quid and get a *real* 305bhp out of your existing engine.
Anything else is madness.
That's also an option that I'm aware of Anything else is madness.
I do know of a couple of 993RS engines that are (as far as I know) genuine 350bhp - without turbo.
There are also a number of 'players' in the market who claim very big dyno numbers that seem only to be replicated on their own dyno's.
I think if I were getting some work done I would get an independent and reliable test done somewhere, get the work done, and then retested on the same independent dyno. The company doing the work would need to financially guarantee their claimed power increase.
There are also a number of 'players' in the market who claim very big dyno numbers that seem only to be replicated on their own dyno's.
I think if I were getting some work done I would get an independent and reliable test done somewhere, get the work done, and then retested on the same independent dyno. The company doing the work would need to financially guarantee their claimed power increase.
Interesting. Assuming the numbers in my OP are achievable, I'd still be interested in what people would pay (or not be interested in at all) for those options.
Once again, I am not selling my car or planning to in the near future and the engine hasn't exploded yet (autobahn tomorrow though to Stuttgart
), I'm just trying to to find out what the average 993 potential buyer might think is value for money
Once again, I am not selling my car or planning to in the near future and the engine hasn't exploded yet (autobahn tomorrow though to Stuttgart
), I'm just trying to to find out what the average 993 potential buyer might think is value for money Joe911 said:
I think if I were getting some work done I would get an independent and reliable test done somewhere, get the work done, and then retested on the same independent dyno. The company doing the work would need to financially guarantee their claimed power increase.
Agreed. And even then the only thing you reliably know is what sort of ballpark power increase your car has seen, NOT headline peak power figures.Mario149 said:
Interesting. Assuming the numbers in my OP are achievable, I'd still be interested in what people would pay (or not be interested in at all) for those options.
Once again, I am not selling my car or planning to in the near future and the engine hasn't exploded yet (autobahn tomorrow though to Stuttgart ), I'm just trying to to find out what the average 993 potential buyer might think is value for money
Greater than 310bhp and you have to ditch the stock intake to use wilder cams and then go motec too. LOTS of money for 330bhp.Once again, I am not selling my car or planning to in the near future and the engine hasn't exploded yet (autobahn tomorrow though to Stuttgart
), I'm just trying to to find out what the average 993 potential buyer might think is value for money 350bhp ? Surely you're into a whole different ballgame in terms of longevity and durability ? As I understand it, even porsche created a detuned version of the RSR engine for longer endurance racing. Speaks volumes.
If you start doing anything beyond a basic but effective Wayne remap then IMO, you will lose a shedload of cash come selling time.
Mario149 said:
I'm just trying to to find out what the average 993 potential buyer might think is value for money
Not interested in any kind of power upgrade at all. It's fast enough as it is and does the job. If I wanted something fast I'd buy a 996 or Impreza.I might pay a grand extra for a recent top end rebuild.
jackal said:
Mario149 said:
Interesting. Assuming the numbers in my OP are achievable, I'd still be interested in what people would pay (or not be interested in at all) for those options.
Once again, I am not selling my car or planning to in the near future and the engine hasn't exploded yet (autobahn tomorrow though to Stuttgart ), I'm just trying to to find out what the average 993 potential buyer might think is value for money
Greater than 310bhp and you have to ditch the stock intake to use wilder cams and then go motec too. LOTS of money for 330bhp.Once again, I am not selling my car or planning to in the near future and the engine hasn't exploded yet (autobahn tomorrow though to Stuttgart
), I'm just trying to to find out what the average 993 potential buyer might think is value for money 350bhp ? Surely you're into a whole different ballgame in terms of longevity and durability ? As I understand it, even porsche created a detuned version of the RSR engine for longer endurance racing. Speaks volumes.
If you start doing anything beyond a basic but effective Wayne remap then IMO, you will lose a shedload of cash come selling time.
Like I said though, this is off topic and should probably be in a separate thread.
993kimbo said:
Not interested in any kind of power upgrade at all. It's fast enough as it is and does the job. If I wanted something fast I'd buy a 996 or Impreza.
I might pay a grand extra for a recent top end rebuild.
Interesting, for me on the basis that my car is a long term proposition whatever, I like the idea of someone taking the last air cooled engine to the next level or 2 in a way that Porsche might have considered - my understanding is that they were stymied by impending emissions legislation. The idea of a NA 993 with 997.1 Carrera S power ( without negatively impacting everyday drivability) and retaining the air cooled character really appeals to me and is a no brainer (if one ignores the cost for a minute I might pay a grand extra for a recent top end rebuild.
). I will say that I may be swayed by the fact that my car is a somewhat leggy Cab that I use as a daily and keep on the street and as such isn't my P&J in the typical sense that others on here would classify their's as.Edited by Mario149 on Wednesday 9th July 20:50
Dont worry about the link M, that conversion is well documented on the web. My own personal sentiments still stand though and the cost is £££. Last count, their basic ~320bhp was around £10,000 using a good donor engine and £20,000 using a poor donor engine so that gives you some idea what their stage 2 will cost.
jackal said:
Dont worry about the link M, that conversion is well documented on the web. My own personal sentiments still stand though and the cost is £££. Last count, their basic ~320bhp was around £10,000 using a good donor engine and £20,000 using a poor donor engine so that gives you some idea what their stage 2 will cost.
Interesting, I was quoted significantly less than the £20k-worst-case-for-a-stage-1 as a guide price for stage 2 (350bhp) excluding removing/refitting when I fired them an email the other day with info on my car. Still lots of money but a fair bit more stuff than the stage 1 which is cams, 100 cell cats and live remap from what I've googled.Edited by Mario149 on Wednesday 9th July 21:12
Edited to remove exact quote as I don't want to skew people's answers if there going to answer my original question!
Edited by Mario149 on Wednesday 9th July 21:13
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