What's a 4WD porker like on snow?
Discussion
I'm off skiing in the alps in January with some friends, and can either head down there in the family Espace or the 993tt. Was hoping to benefit from others' experiences of driving a 4WD porker in the snow and ice before deciding, though obviously going in the 993 would be more fun! I know the 4WD is an advantage, but those wide tyres will tend to skim on hard snow rather than cut into it I suspect.
You guys got any feedback?
You guys got any feedback?
Nel,
If you are running 18" wheels you may be in trouble.
Most or all resorts can ban you from coming up the mountain unless you have snow chains.
You can get chains to fit 18" tyres, but i would not recommend it on standard width ones, as you may well scrape the inside of your wheel arches !!
That's if you can get your arms around the wheels to fit them in the 1st place !!
Porsche recommend running a narrower width tyre, if chains are to be used.
G.
If you are running 18" wheels you may be in trouble.
Most or all resorts can ban you from coming up the mountain unless you have snow chains.
You can get chains to fit 18" tyres, but i would not recommend it on standard width ones, as you may well scrape the inside of your wheel arches !!
That's if you can get your arms around the wheels to fit them in the 1st place !!
Porsche recommend running a narrower width tyre, if chains are to be used.
G.
My C4S had the same rubber down as your TT (225/40 and 285/30) and that was next to useless in the snow.
Does anyone remember an ad on tv a while ago asking "how does the snowplough driver get to work" and then you see him driving a beetle?
The key is rear engined, rear drive, and SKINNY tyres.
I suggest you buy four space savers and stick them on your TT
VS
Does anyone remember an ad on tv a while ago asking "how does the snowplough driver get to work" and then you see him driving a beetle?
The key is rear engined, rear drive, and SKINNY tyres.
I suggest you buy four space savers and stick them on your TT
VS
On summer tyres i would think forget it , the roads up to most resorts can be ok but if there is fresh snow on the day you arrive or depart the resort you will be in trouble .
And on departure day Le Plod will pull you out of the traffic and make you wait until all the other skiers leaving the resort have gone if they see any slippy side ways stuff going on (i know this from experience)
And on departure day Le Plod will pull you out of the traffic and make you wait until all the other skiers leaving the resort have gone if they see any slippy side ways stuff going on (i know this from experience)
Alright guys, I get the message. Given that I'm not going to invest in snow tyres because they are unlikely to see much use, the porker will just have to stay in the garage. Now if I could just adapt some 2CV wheels to the Porsche hubs that might be a cheap yet terrifying solution.....
Thanks for confirming my suspicions - very boring Espace and chains it is then!
Thanks for confirming my suspicions - very boring Espace and chains it is then!
I'm driving down in my 2wd 993... I've put winter tyres on it but I don't have chains...
Are chains necessary if you've got the right tyres? I saw a 993 cruising up the main street in Arosa last year and the road was covered with hard packed snow and ice. It was on winter tyres and didn't have any problems. The only vehicles I saw in Switzerland on chains were coaches and snowploughs, etc.
BTW I've been told that winter rubber is pretty useful in the UK over winter anyway as you get more grip in cold conditions: i.e. they are not just for snow. Is this just tyre-man marketing or true??
Are chains necessary if you've got the right tyres? I saw a 993 cruising up the main street in Arosa last year and the road was covered with hard packed snow and ice. It was on winter tyres and didn't have any problems. The only vehicles I saw in Switzerland on chains were coaches and snowploughs, etc.
BTW I've been told that winter rubber is pretty useful in the UK over winter anyway as you get more grip in cold conditions: i.e. they are not just for snow. Is this just tyre-man marketing or true??
cyberface said:
BTW I've been told that winter rubber is pretty useful in the UK over winter anyway as you get more grip in cold conditions: i.e. they are not just for snow. Is this just tyre-man marketing or true??
Its the law here in Sweden to fit winter tyres between 1st Dec an 1st April it makes sence even if we dont get a lot of snow down here in Malmo .
They are much better in wet conditions than summer tyres and in the snow and ice they are great .
The time i got pulled over comeing out of Val Thorens i was in my old Maserati spider with winter tyres and the bastad power delivery caught me out
(they are a bit sudden)
Wide tyres are mayhem on the snow. Also the way the ice forms on the side streets means long strips of ice in the centre of lanes (snagging air dam) and tyres are often on the tarmac. Plus of course there are all the other drivers who are more likely to crash in to your car and all the tight parking you get in resorts. Basically don't recommend it no matter how James Bond a moment you may have.
) 
Marki said:
Its the law here in Sweden to fit winter tyres between 1st Dec an 1st April it makes sence even if we dont get a lot of snow down here in Malmo .
They are much better in wet conditions than summer tyres and in the snow and ice they are great .
IIRC your winter tyres are studded too, yes? My brother lives in Goteborg (no .. s sorry) and has two sets of wheels, of course...
Don said:
Its the law here in Sweden to fit winter tyres between 1st Dec an 1st April it makes sence even if we dont get a lot of snow down here in Malmo .
They are much better in wet conditions than summer tyres and in the snow and ice they are great .
IIRC your winter tyres are studded too, yes? My brother lives in Goteborg (no .. s sorry) and has two sets of wheels, of course...
Yep - when I lived in Norway I had a second set of wheels with studded snow tyres - similarly it was a legal requirement between certain dates. If you didn't have them and you were in an accident, it was your fault whatever the circumstances.
They were great to drive with. Even on sheet ice you could play at being Stig Blomquist, but it did mean that every year they had to repair twin troughs in the roads worn away by the studs. Shame that I live in Paris because I really can't justify equipping the porker with a spare set of rims and winter tyres - I'm sure that it would be a blast.
to add to this thread: I can now confirm that winter tyres work nicely in non-snow conditions, and the tyre guys weren't just bullshitting me with marketing crap...
Went out for a quick blast today, the roads were very cold and a bit slippery, but the porker felt very secure and stable, no loss of adhesion. Even an enthusiastic roundabout exit caused no drama other than the tread blocks squidging around. Braking performance good as well.
Maybe a placebo 'spent-the-money-so-must-be-good' effect but freezing summer tyres and roundabouts have been rather exciting in the past, so there must be some benefit
Went out for a quick blast today, the roads were very cold and a bit slippery, but the porker felt very secure and stable, no loss of adhesion. Even an enthusiastic roundabout exit caused no drama other than the tread blocks squidging around. Braking performance good as well.
Maybe a placebo 'spent-the-money-so-must-be-good' effect but freezing summer tyres and roundabouts have been rather exciting in the past, so there must be some benefit
OK made it down to Verbier in one piece.... however was a shockingly scary journey. Started snowing / sub zero temps just after Reims and there were accidents on the autoroutes past there. Very slow going as there was loads of fresh snow on the road.
In the alps themselves, again plenty of fresh snow and the car was very difficult to control. Going uphill was OK on a *very* light throttle, the winter tyres and the rear engined traction working fine. My cousin thought he'd get away with summers since his car is 4wd (he thought wrong, he was limited to around 3 mph up to the resort as there was no grip)...
Going downhill was frankly dangerous. The back would break away purely due to road camber and was hard to keep in a straight line. I thought I was going to stack it loads of times.
Funny thing was that we were overtaken by loads of people who were using similar winter tyres to mine. Must be the width then?? Perhaps I should have gone for narrower tyres all round.
In the alps themselves, again plenty of fresh snow and the car was very difficult to control. Going uphill was OK on a *very* light throttle, the winter tyres and the rear engined traction working fine. My cousin thought he'd get away with summers since his car is 4wd (he thought wrong, he was limited to around 3 mph up to the resort as there was no grip)...
Going downhill was frankly dangerous. The back would break away purely due to road camber and was hard to keep in a straight line. I thought I was going to stack it loads of times.
Funny thing was that we were overtaken by loads of people who were using similar winter tyres to mine. Must be the width then?? Perhaps I should have gone for narrower tyres all round.
Don said:
Its the law here in Sweden to fit winter tyres between 1st Dec an 1st April it makes sence even if we dont get a lot of snow down here in Malmo .
They are much better in wet conditions than summer tyres and in the snow and ice they are great .
IIRC your winter tyres are studded too, yes? My brother lives in Goteborg (no .. s sorry) and has two sets of wheels, of course...
You can have studed tyres but they are very noisy and in most parts not really needed , but on packed ice they are the business
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