964 Turbo 1 bar spring ftitted but ...
Discussion
Hi Guys,
It would be great if someone could help me..
I have a 964 3.3 Turbo. I know this is
not a track day car and probably never will be but I like the looks/ performance and am thus prepared to spend more money on it , which I know I will never
get back - its something I just can t explain.
Anyway, I had a 1 bar spring fitted - the technitian tells me that in
some cases you also need to chip the car and some cases you dont. Is this True? The computer management system still reads 0.7 max. Is this because the system is
only programmed to go to a max of 0.7 and not 1 - or is this becuase its not
working? How can I test it apart from having it tested on a machine? The car certainly feels stronger but then again there was a leakage in the wastegate which was also fixed.
My second question relates to the suspension. I had the H&R 964 Turbo springs fitted lowered to 30mm. The car handles better but still far from perfect. I am looking into fitting the Turbo 3.3 S, the 3.6 or 3.6 S suspension - any comments on the above from owners or drivers on this would be of great help.
I also fitted Pagid Black break pads, 5.1
Brack fluid and metal brakefluid pips which seems to have improved the braking. Does anyone have experience and know if it is worthwhile to improve ventilation to the brakes by adding air vents to the bumper?
Sorry for the long winded questions but I would really appreciate any feedback from someone how has experience with the above as I dont want to sart spending more money on the wrong adjustments!!
Best,
Alex
>> Edited by turbomania on Tuesday 5th July 13:51
It would be great if someone could help me..
I have a 964 3.3 Turbo. I know this is
not a track day car and probably never will be but I like the looks/ performance and am thus prepared to spend more money on it , which I know I will never
get back - its something I just can t explain.
Anyway, I had a 1 bar spring fitted - the technitian tells me that in
some cases you also need to chip the car and some cases you dont. Is this True? The computer management system still reads 0.7 max. Is this because the system is
only programmed to go to a max of 0.7 and not 1 - or is this becuase its not
working? How can I test it apart from having it tested on a machine? The car certainly feels stronger but then again there was a leakage in the wastegate which was also fixed.
My second question relates to the suspension. I had the H&R 964 Turbo springs fitted lowered to 30mm. The car handles better but still far from perfect. I am looking into fitting the Turbo 3.3 S, the 3.6 or 3.6 S suspension - any comments on the above from owners or drivers on this would be of great help.
I also fitted Pagid Black break pads, 5.1
Brack fluid and metal brakefluid pips which seems to have improved the braking. Does anyone have experience and know if it is worthwhile to improve ventilation to the brakes by adding air vents to the bumper?
Sorry for the long winded questions but I would really appreciate any feedback from someone how has experience with the above as I dont want to sart spending more money on the wrong adjustments!!
Best,
Alex
>> Edited by turbomania on Tuesday 5th July 13:51
The turbo 2 does not have an ecu, it runs with K-Jet fuel injection which is basically mechanical with a bit of electrickery bolted on to control emissions.
The gauge in the car is independent to the engine electrics, your technician is correct in that it only reads up to 0.7bar, supposedly to stop customers worrying if they got 0.8 one day and only 0.7 the day after. To check your boost level you will have to fit a temporary gauge to the intercooler outlet for the wastegate pipe.
Go for a full H&R or similar handling kit, suits most and is good for occasional track use.
Brake cooling is only necessary for track driving unless you drive like a complete loon on the roads.
The gauge in the car is independent to the engine electrics, your technician is correct in that it only reads up to 0.7bar, supposedly to stop customers worrying if they got 0.8 one day and only 0.7 the day after. To check your boost level you will have to fit a temporary gauge to the intercooler outlet for the wastegate pipe.
Go for a full H&R or similar handling kit, suits most and is good for occasional track use.
Brake cooling is only necessary for track driving unless you drive like a complete loon on the roads.
ninemeister said:
The turbo 2 does not have an ecu, it runs with K-Jet fuel injection which is basically mechanical with a bit of electrickery bolted on to control emissions.
Is there not then a risk that when running a higher boost the engine runs lean, or can the mechanical system cope with this through the air-flow meter?
I get 1 bar of boost from my 3.6 turbo, but as stated earlier the gauge won't show above 0.7.
You cannot chip the car at all, not sure what the technician was thinking of.
Suspension "not quite perfect", is it ever on a rear wheel drive turbo? They'll always be real handful. Look nice though!
You cannot chip the car at all, not sure what the technician was thinking of.
Suspension "not quite perfect", is it ever on a rear wheel drive turbo? They'll always be real handful. Look nice though!
Having run a 3.3 Turbo 2 at 1 bar for nearly ten years including numerous rolling road runs where the operators couldn't get traction in any gear and ran the intake temperature way up high over several attempts (not ninemeister obviously 
), dragstrip runs at the pod, track days, sprint testing and 30,000 miles of 'enjoyable' road driving to boot, there has never been any sign of any fuelling problem, or any other problem that might be associated with boosted boost. Just impressive performance.
For sure these cars can't be chipped as others have explained, but they benefit from appropriate exhaust and intake mods. Regarding suspension, this was a bit of a mare. Since the car was trying hard to do wheelies on emergency starts, it needed something less compliant at the back that suited the car in tuned form. The best combination for my personal taste, arrived at by trial and error involving buying kit, fitting it and then selling it on second hand when it didn't work as well as hoped, has RUF stuff at the rear and TechArt kit at the front. No wheelies now and front end grip is still tolerable, but you do have to be careful when ramping over discarded cigarette filters.
Never got to fettling the brakes with pagid pads or anything else - ditching well over 150 kg tuned them by default.
), dragstrip runs at the pod, track days, sprint testing and 30,000 miles of 'enjoyable' road driving to boot, there has never been any sign of any fuelling problem, or any other problem that might be associated with boosted boost. Just impressive performance. For sure these cars can't be chipped as others have explained, but they benefit from appropriate exhaust and intake mods. Regarding suspension, this was a bit of a mare. Since the car was trying hard to do wheelies on emergency starts, it needed something less compliant at the back that suited the car in tuned form. The best combination for my personal taste, arrived at by trial and error involving buying kit, fitting it and then selling it on second hand when it didn't work as well as hoped, has RUF stuff at the rear and TechArt kit at the front. No wheelies now and front end grip is still tolerable, but you do have to be careful when ramping over discarded cigarette filters.
Never got to fettling the brakes with pagid pads or anything else - ditching well over 150 kg tuned them by default.
You can change the fueling by turning a screw in the metering head. CIS based cars have a fixed A/F curve. For a turbo this presented a bit of a problem as fuel requirements alter with boost presure. Here they used the warmup regulator to add extra fuel when on boost to help stop the car going lean.
An optimised A/F curve will, at best, look like a Nike swoosh, i.e. very lean at very low rpm, then quite rich (as boost comes on), then leaning out as the boost builds.
At 1 bar you should be running with a Co2 reading of about 3% which will be rich at low rpm, but makes sure you have enough fuel at the top end.
Some people modify the warm regulator to provide more fuel when on boost, such that you can lean out the bottom part of the rpm range.
With no fueling hardware 400bhp is the limit, after that you'll need to add an ECU to drive an extra injector or something similar (Motec is the more expensive alternative).
I would also get your mech to unplug your lambda control, as it normally causes more issues than it is worth...
Suspension wise I went for Roock progressive which is great for fast road but a bit soft for track work.
An optimised A/F curve will, at best, look like a Nike swoosh, i.e. very lean at very low rpm, then quite rich (as boost comes on), then leaning out as the boost builds.
At 1 bar you should be running with a Co2 reading of about 3% which will be rich at low rpm, but makes sure you have enough fuel at the top end.
Some people modify the warm regulator to provide more fuel when on boost, such that you can lean out the bottom part of the rpm range.
With no fueling hardware 400bhp is the limit, after that you'll need to add an ECU to drive an extra injector or something similar (Motec is the more expensive alternative).
I would also get your mech to unplug your lambda control, as it normally causes more issues than it is worth...
Suspension wise I went for Roock progressive which is great for fast road but a bit soft for track work.
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