993s (and older Porsches generally) and warranties
Discussion
Another question, I'm afraid!
As I understand it from my reading on here, the official Porsche warranty is available on any car up to 9 years old. Is that correct?
If so, Porsche presumably now won't cover any car pre-1997. In effect, if you have a 993 or earlier, you can't get a Porsche warranty. Or have I missed something?
If that is the case, is there a decent third party warranty available to cover a 993?
(I've done a quick search of old threads but to no avail. Apologies if I'm re-treading old ground. As a moderator on the S2000 owners club board, I know how wearing it can be to the "old hands" to have answer the same questions over and over again.....)
As I understand it from my reading on here, the official Porsche warranty is available on any car up to 9 years old. Is that correct?
If so, Porsche presumably now won't cover any car pre-1997. In effect, if you have a 993 or earlier, you can't get a Porsche warranty. Or have I missed something?
If that is the case, is there a decent third party warranty available to cover a 993?
(I've done a quick search of old threads but to no avail. Apologies if I'm re-treading old ground. As a moderator on the S2000 owners club board, I know how wearing it can be to the "old hands" to have answer the same questions over and over again.....)
Look here on Page 9, it's clearly described:
www.porsche.com/filestore.aspx/default.pdf?pool=uk&type=download&id=approved-porscheapproved&lang=none&filetype=default
www.porsche.com/filestore.aspx/default.pdf?pool=uk&type=download&id=approved-porscheapproved&lang=none&filetype=default
silver993tt said:
Look here on Page 9, it's clearly described:
That just seems to confirm what I thought - that the warranty is available on any car from 1 to 9 years old with a total mileage of less than 125,000 miles.
So, the original question stands.
I'll wait for Henry to drag himself away from all those punters who are dying to thrust money into his sweaty paws and see whether he can help
I dodn't think a warranty is worth it for the 993. They were pretty well built cars. If you are an astute buyer and buy the right car, it is unlikely that anything major wil go wrong. The things likely to fail would most likely be deemed 'wear & tear' items in warranties anyway.
Just my 0.02 - though I am less risk averse than most.
Just my 0.02 - though I am less risk averse than most.
johnfm said:
If you are an astute buyer and buy the right car, it is unlikely that anything major wil go wrong.
That's a BIG if, especially when you're a technical numpty of the magnitude I manage! If/when I buy, I shall of course have it inspected - I guess that goes some way towards satisfying yourself that it's a good 'un.
(Just spent a couple of hours trawling the archives looking at RMS threads, having also been mooting buying an older 996 rather than a 993. My head is spinning from all the technical stuff, and the apparent disagreement as to (a) the frequency and (b) the severity of the problem, but the prospect of a serious problem of that sort on car outside OPC warranty max age makes me seriously question the wisdom of a 97/98 996....)
As a 993 owner, I've been following your posts on this subject for some time and I'm beginning to wonder whether you should be looking for a Porsche - especially one that's about ten years old. You don't appear to be prepared to take any risk in buying - which is understandable if the cost of ownership is a serious factor in your decision-making.
By and large, it seems to me that for many of us the Porsche is bought for special outings, for the fun of driving and to get away from the mundane world of the commuting/shopping/family car. It's an extravagance and we hope to rub along without meeting any seriously big bills. Most of us are probably lucky in that we shopped carefully in the first place and the bills are manageable, but every so often something goes wrong and we have to shell out. As these are Porsches, the cost is certainly going to be higher than if we run a Mondeo, but that's factored into our thinking. I do less than 5K miles a year in mine, I keep it immaculate and it gets all the usual servicing, tyres etc when needed, plus the occasional 'treat', like having the windscreen re-sealed, a new battery and a strut brace fitted. So far, the bills have been under £2K per annum: I'm having new springs/dampers and a small RMS leak dealt with later this year, which will keep it at at least that figure.
You'll be lucky to get away with much less than that if you run a 993 and keep it properly, but if you buy with a proper inspection and - as Henry keeps telling us - on condition, you've every prospect of peace of mind: they're very well put together! But don't expect to get the same peace of mind as if you were buying a new Honda Civic. Life's not like that. Good hunting!
By and large, it seems to me that for many of us the Porsche is bought for special outings, for the fun of driving and to get away from the mundane world of the commuting/shopping/family car. It's an extravagance and we hope to rub along without meeting any seriously big bills. Most of us are probably lucky in that we shopped carefully in the first place and the bills are manageable, but every so often something goes wrong and we have to shell out. As these are Porsches, the cost is certainly going to be higher than if we run a Mondeo, but that's factored into our thinking. I do less than 5K miles a year in mine, I keep it immaculate and it gets all the usual servicing, tyres etc when needed, plus the occasional 'treat', like having the windscreen re-sealed, a new battery and a strut brace fitted. So far, the bills have been under £2K per annum: I'm having new springs/dampers and a small RMS leak dealt with later this year, which will keep it at at least that figure.
You'll be lucky to get away with much less than that if you run a 993 and keep it properly, but if you buy with a proper inspection and - as Henry keeps telling us - on condition, you've every prospect of peace of mind: they're very well put together! But don't expect to get the same peace of mind as if you were buying a new Honda Civic. Life's not like that. Good hunting!
kent993 said:
As a 993 owner, I've been following your posts on this subject for some time and I'm beginning to wonder whether you should be looking for a Porsche - especially one that's about ten years old. You don't appear to be prepared to take any risk in buying - which is understandable if the cost of ownership is a serious factor in your decision-making.
But don't expect to get the same peace of mind as if you were buying a new Honda Civic. Life's not like that. Good hunting!
I'm under no illusions about the potential costs of running a 10 year old car. It's not that I'm not prepared to take any risks in buying - that's unrealistic when looking at a car of that age - just that I'm trying to minimise the scope for unpleasant surprises down the line.
If they happen, they happen. I'll deal with them.
I suppose the need to take a different view of ownership is all the more pronounced since I'm coming from a car bought from new with a three year warranty that has a reputation for being pretty bulletproof. I understand and accept that 993 ownership would be a different proposition to the S2000.
So, bear with me if it seems like I'm dithering and not prepared to take a risk. I'm inherently cautious by nature, but particularly when looking to throw down £25K on a car that I've aspired to owning for as long as I've had any interest in cars!
Lurking LLB
If you have 'only' £25k to spend, I think you'll get a much better 993 than 996.
If you are astute and fortunate, you will a 993 where the previous owner has taken care of any niggly faults (door check straps for example) and it may already have had the dampers replaced 9i.e. if the car has been lowered).
Look for a car that already has been modified (if thats what you are after), as though we all say the cars are brilliant, everybody want to upgrade brakes, suspension and exhaust! Thats about £2-3k if you do it. Buy one already done - save the money and the hassle.
I think surj was selling his 993 a while back and I bet there are others here on PH.
Look at as many as you can - they are all a little bit different and condition can vary hugely - especially the littel things like the condition inside the engine bay etc.
Good luck
If you have 'only' £25k to spend, I think you'll get a much better 993 than 996.
If you are astute and fortunate, you will a 993 where the previous owner has taken care of any niggly faults (door check straps for example) and it may already have had the dampers replaced 9i.e. if the car has been lowered).
Look for a car that already has been modified (if thats what you are after), as though we all say the cars are brilliant, everybody want to upgrade brakes, suspension and exhaust! Thats about £2-3k if you do it. Buy one already done - save the money and the hassle.
I think surj was selling his 993 a while back and I bet there are others here on PH.
Look at as many as you can - they are all a little bit different and condition can vary hugely - especially the littel things like the condition inside the engine bay etc.
Good luck
johnfm said:
Lurking LLB
If you have 'only' £25k to spend, I think you'll get a much better 993 than 996.
I'm inclined to agree. I much prefer the look of the 993 to the 996. I really only started to consider the latter because SWMBO prefers them, and to some extent I'm reliant on her goodwill to make the Porsche acquisition progress!
(No LLB here - Oxford has an idiosyncratic system whereby it only awards BAs, even for those reading law!
) >> Edited by Lurking Lawyer on Sunday 12th February 11:17
>> Edited by Lurking Lawyer on Sunday 12th February 11:17
Lurking Lawyer,
I tend to agree with Kent993's sentiments. I think you're in for a shock going from a new car under warranty to a ten year old sports car. Also, if you are not mechanically minded then you will find youself at the garage / dealer for every squeak, rattle, creak or smell. I always consider that you should be handy with the spanners if you are going to run an older car. There really is no warranty that you can buy that is going to give you the peace of mind that your current vehicle / package offers.
I'm not trying to put you of the idea but I could easily see how it could turn into an expensive and bitter experience if you are not prepared.
Finally, we (mostly)all agree that vinyl sounds better than CDs or MP3s, similarly a cylinder mower gives a better cut than a Flymo. However, very few of us have the time to get out our old vinyl or to get the blades balanced or sharpened on the cylinder mower. (Can you see where I'm going with this?) so we stick with the convenience of CDs and hover mowers.
pp
ps I think you guys are great especially Judge John Deed. He used to have a Boxter didn't he?
I tend to agree with Kent993's sentiments. I think you're in for a shock going from a new car under warranty to a ten year old sports car. Also, if you are not mechanically minded then you will find youself at the garage / dealer for every squeak, rattle, creak or smell. I always consider that you should be handy with the spanners if you are going to run an older car. There really is no warranty that you can buy that is going to give you the peace of mind that your current vehicle / package offers.
I'm not trying to put you of the idea but I could easily see how it could turn into an expensive and bitter experience if you are not prepared.
Finally, we (mostly)all agree that vinyl sounds better than CDs or MP3s, similarly a cylinder mower gives a better cut than a Flymo. However, very few of us have the time to get out our old vinyl or to get the blades balanced or sharpened on the cylinder mower. (Can you see where I'm going with this?) so we stick with the convenience of CDs and hover mowers.
pp
ps I think you guys are great especially Judge John Deed. He used to have a Boxter didn't he?
Pickled Piper said:
I tend to agree with Kent993's sentiments. I think you're in for a shock going from a new car under warranty to a ten year old sports car.
If I was comparing like with like and expecting a similar kind of ownership experience, I'd tend to agree with you. I'm not.
I'm not even suggesting that I won't be happy unless it has a warranty. To be perfectly honest, most of what I've read about after-market warranties leads me to believe that I'd be better sticking the equivalent cost in the bank and leaving it to earn interest until such time as it might be needed to remedy a problem.
I asked the question in my original post simply I didn't know what the position was on obtaining warranties after 9 years when the Porsche warranty falls away, and whether there is any concensus on whether they are considered worthwhile. It was largely prompted by seemingly every other thread relating to 996s and RMS issues saying "GET A WARRANTY!".....
I'd be foolish to expect a 10 year old car to run flawlessly and give me no trouble at all, and I'm not. I think I have a feel from reading on here about the likely issues and the running costs. If no-one ever took a step into the unknown, life would become very boring very quickly.
Pickled Piper said:
ps I think you guys are great especially Judge John Deed. He used to have a Boxter didn't he?
Indeed he did, in earlier series. He must have had a payrise as he seems to be running a 996 cab in the series that finished on Friday!
Sorry for the delay, currently in Thailand.
Warranties are something of a minefield. See www.911virgin.com/warranty.htm
With us it`s £400 a year and that covers you up to the value of the vehicle each claim with an unlimited number of claims each year. There is however a catch, isn`t there always, and that is the fact the waranty is designed to cover the sudden mecanical failure of a component not general wear & tear / end of life. The difference is quite easy whe you know your cars and given a main dealer waranty on newer cars will set you back anything from £700 to £1,200 per year it shouldn`t come as too much of a shock to know you`re still going to have to spend money keeping the car on the road. In fairness no waranty is generally designed to cover wear & tear or end of life. If you take your 997 back with a slipping clutch and the friction plate has worn down it`s going to be your bill I`m afraid and then you`ll have to learn how to co-ordinate you left and right feet.
If, say a cambelt that was "in service" snapped that would be an easier call providing it wasn`t caused by a tensioner bearing that had been getting noisier over a few weeks finally deciding enough was enough.
Hope that helps and once again sorry for the delay.
Henry
Warranties are something of a minefield. See www.911virgin.com/warranty.htm
With us it`s £400 a year and that covers you up to the value of the vehicle each claim with an unlimited number of claims each year. There is however a catch, isn`t there always, and that is the fact the waranty is designed to cover the sudden mecanical failure of a component not general wear & tear / end of life. The difference is quite easy whe you know your cars and given a main dealer waranty on newer cars will set you back anything from £700 to £1,200 per year it shouldn`t come as too much of a shock to know you`re still going to have to spend money keeping the car on the road. In fairness no waranty is generally designed to cover wear & tear or end of life. If you take your 997 back with a slipping clutch and the friction plate has worn down it`s going to be your bill I`m afraid and then you`ll have to learn how to co-ordinate you left and right feet.
If, say a cambelt that was "in service" snapped that would be an easier call providing it wasn`t caused by a tensioner bearing that had been getting noisier over a few weeks finally deciding enough was enough.
Hope that helps and once again sorry for the delay.
Henry
Henry-F said:
Hope that helps and once again sorry for the delay.
Indeed it does - thank you, Henry. And no apology required!
I realise that pretty much no warranty is going to cover fair wear and tear - I'm not looking for a way of avoiding the usual running costs, just considering whether there is one of guarding against unforeseen major component failure. I'm comfortable with the projected "normal" costs of servicing and consumables.
I'm reassured that the 993 appears from my various reading on here to be pretty mechanically reliable with no major foibles (wiring loom excepted).
Another option (and one that'll keep the misus happy!) is to buy a '98 , or if you can stretch to it , a '99 996 , then get it on an opc warranty and run it for a year or two to (hopefully) find whether you've got a good un. If it's letting you down , shift it before the warranty runs out. It seems to me that the apparent achilles heel on the 996 is the crank seal (rms) , but there's loads of em out there that do not have this problem . I think one would be much more likely to log onto a website such as PH if their seal has failed , rather than bothering to tell everyone if it works ok in their particular 996 , so its getting perhaps too much negative publicity. mine's got 48k on the clock but no sign of it needing a replacement seal yet .. and it's just been thru it's opc check. (and renewal of warranty!)
Agree with other 993 owners
Insurance pointless if you find the right car. And if you're thinking about such an irrational emotional purchase in actuarial terms then maybe you should be buying an ISA. Seriously you won't enjoy the car when you've got it if you're agonising so much beforehand
Budget 2k per year for running/ consumables and a 2k float for 'nasties'
That's what I do rather than insure and on <10k mileage a year I'm always in 'profit'
Saabs VWs and other so called quality cars I've had - are another matter - I was always in 'profit' buying a warranty
An Oxford educated lawyer - you should find the dosh for a 993 down the back of the settee
This is one decision where technical advice/inspection is invaluable but at some point you just have to jump....
and the water's fine
Insurance pointless if you find the right car. And if you're thinking about such an irrational emotional purchase in actuarial terms then maybe you should be buying an ISA. Seriously you won't enjoy the car when you've got it if you're agonising so much beforehand
Budget 2k per year for running/ consumables and a 2k float for 'nasties'
That's what I do rather than insure and on <10k mileage a year I'm always in 'profit'
Saabs VWs and other so called quality cars I've had - are another matter - I was always in 'profit' buying a warranty
An Oxford educated lawyer - you should find the dosh for a 993 down the back of the settee
This is one decision where technical advice/inspection is invaluable but at some point you just have to jump....
and the water's fine
oddman said:
Agree with other 993 owners
Insurance pointless if you find the right car. And if you're thinking about such an irrational emotional purchase in actuarial terms then maybe you should be buying an ISA. Seriously you won't enjoy the car when you've got it if you're agonising so much beforehand
pp
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