bleeping speculators!!!
Discussion
porkernut said:
I counted no less than 12 997TT's advertised in the Sunday Times, every one for overs!
That is twelve genuine owners who could have had their cars earlier
!!!
That is twelve genuine owners who could have had their cars earlier
!!!But if you are patient they will be going for "unders" in a few months no doubt
Just look what happened to AMV8s!The thing is, so many people are onto this now (as in, so many speculators, not to mention the public generally aware of the practice) its not as easy as it once was...
As mentioned, look at all the AMV8's for sale, they were at a premium but not selling, so then they need to drop the price to sell, and stop making money...
Theres always going to be someone who tries to make a quick buck, but i think with interest rates going up, theres going to be a lot who get stung!
As mentioned, look at all the AMV8's for sale, they were at a premium but not selling, so then they need to drop the price to sell, and stop making money...
Theres always going to be someone who tries to make a quick buck, but i think with interest rates going up, theres going to be a lot who get stung!
wrn said:
J111 said:
dazren said:
Looks like porsche's £10k deposit and vetting system is pretty crap then.
Huh ? No suggestion of any such thing at JCT600
Are you sure? £10k deposit on GT3s and Turbos is a UK-wide Porsche policy - which all dealers are obliged to enforce.
Yes, I was there. He's had one previous car from them, which may help, although it was 'only' a Boxster.
What's the problem? While I'm not in the market for a 997T, what's the issue with someone making some cash on a resale? Many people think nothing of ponying up the extra cash if they can get something *tomorrow*. That's the way things work in a free economy...
If a genuine prospective "enthusiast" owner had been so keen for one, they should have stumped up some readies to secure one, and lets face it, at 100K a car, dropping 10K for a deposit really shouldn't have been very difficult. It's not like these opportunists are denying the schoolkids their milk...
If a genuine prospective "enthusiast" owner had been so keen for one, they should have stumped up some readies to secure one, and lets face it, at 100K a car, dropping 10K for a deposit really shouldn't have been very difficult. It's not like these opportunists are denying the schoolkids their milk...
Unfortunately have to agree...
Seen a few delivered 997TTs for sale for a 10-15k premium. I have never bought a new car (currently a 997 and three M3s before that) purely for the fact that when I've made a decision to buy a car I really could not imagine then having to wait another 12-18 months before actually getting it. I've been lucky and always managed to get my exact spec by buying ex-demos or 'nearly-new' (ie. less than 5k on the clock).
If I tomorrow decided that I wanted a 997TT and found my perfect spec from a 'speculator' then would I pay a 10k premium - Yes I would!! I may be a mug for doing so but hey, another 10% on the price of the car doesn't seem so bad when the alternative is to wait for 18 months for a new one.
I see 'speculators' as providing a 'win/win' service for some people. They'll never see that 10k again but then again, how much is an extra year of Porsche ownership worth....
Seen a few delivered 997TTs for sale for a 10-15k premium. I have never bought a new car (currently a 997 and three M3s before that) purely for the fact that when I've made a decision to buy a car I really could not imagine then having to wait another 12-18 months before actually getting it. I've been lucky and always managed to get my exact spec by buying ex-demos or 'nearly-new' (ie. less than 5k on the clock).
If I tomorrow decided that I wanted a 997TT and found my perfect spec from a 'speculator' then would I pay a 10k premium - Yes I would!! I may be a mug for doing so but hey, another 10% on the price of the car doesn't seem so bad when the alternative is to wait for 18 months for a new one.
I see 'speculators' as providing a 'win/win' service for some people. They'll never see that 10k again but then again, how much is an extra year of Porsche ownership worth....
Sorry guys I respect your opinion, but simply can't agree with the last two posts,whilst I am sure your motivation is pure perolhead. Elsewhere the whole, "I must have it now" whilst it is new & I will get noticed whilst impressing the neighbours sh*t drives me mad 
. It's the latest model. I must have the latest flat screen TV, I must have the most fashionable phone etc etc etc....I WANT IT NOW!!!
Me I'm happy to wait & enjoy something else & buy the same car when it is still just as good to drive, but costs list or less. Top end cars loose a packet without paying some individual "overs" for first ownership just because it is the current it car!But if that is how you want to spend your money that is fine by me, but I would rather the list was shorter for all & the speculators would bog off.
The speculator market is like the queue at roadworks, the ones that push in at the front delay the ones at the back!
. It's the latest model. I must have the latest flat screen TV, I must have the most fashionable phone etc etc etc....I WANT IT NOW!!! Me I'm happy to wait & enjoy something else & buy the same car when it is still just as good to drive, but costs list or less. Top end cars loose a packet without paying some individual "overs" for first ownership just because it is the current it car!But if that is how you want to spend your money that is fine by me, but I would rather the list was shorter for all & the speculators would bog off.
The speculator market is like the queue at roadworks, the ones that push in at the front delay the ones at the back!
porkernut said:
Sorry guys I respect your opinion, but simply can't agree with the last two posts,whilst I am sure your motivation is pure perolhead. Elsewhere the whole, "I must have it now" whilst it is new & I will get noticed whilst impressing the neighbours sh*t drives me mad . It's the latest model. I must have the latest flat screen TV, I must have the most fashionable phone etc etc etc....I WANT IT NOW!!!
Me I'm happy to wait & enjoy something else & buy the same car when it is still just as good to drive, but costs list or less. Top end cars loose a packet without paying some individual "overs" for first ownership just because it is the current it car!But if that is how you want to spend your money that is fine by me, but I would rather the list was shorter for all & the speculators would bog off.
The speculator market is like the queue at roadworks, the ones that push in at the front delay the ones at the back!
. It's the latest model. I must have the latest flat screen TV, I must have the most fashionable phone etc etc etc....I WANT IT NOW!!! Me I'm happy to wait & enjoy something else & buy the same car when it is still just as good to drive, but costs list or less. Top end cars loose a packet without paying some individual "overs" for first ownership just because it is the current it car!But if that is how you want to spend your money that is fine by me, but I would rather the list was shorter for all & the speculators would bog off.
The speculator market is like the queue at roadworks, the ones that push in at the front delay the ones at the back!
I'm like you in that I would never pay over the odds for a car BUT than again I am a patient person and will wait for prices to settle. However.... I have no problems in people speculating. Reward for risk is what enterprise is all about and so if they make profits good for them and if they don't... well good for me. It's all swings and roundabouts!!!
Exactly.
One comment though - this thing about speculators being a pain because they take away cars from 'true owners' is a bit much... Ultimately the cars held by speculators go to Porsche lovers anyway and ones that are willing to pay over the odds for them.. Makes them sound like 'true owners' to me.. Just because they don't want to wait and are willing to pay over the odds I don't think makes them the 'enemy'.
And let's be honest here - if there weren't speculators out there then people willing to pay extra would still get their hands on cars earlier. Ferrari are notorious for allowing 'VIPs' to jump the queue and I'm sure Porsche is no different. The right cheque will put you ahead of those willing to wait every time.
One comment though - this thing about speculators being a pain because they take away cars from 'true owners' is a bit much... Ultimately the cars held by speculators go to Porsche lovers anyway and ones that are willing to pay over the odds for them.. Makes them sound like 'true owners' to me.. Just because they don't want to wait and are willing to pay over the odds I don't think makes them the 'enemy'.
And let's be honest here - if there weren't speculators out there then people willing to pay extra would still get their hands on cars earlier. Ferrari are notorious for allowing 'VIPs' to jump the queue and I'm sure Porsche is no different. The right cheque will put you ahead of those willing to wait every time.
Speculators had to order their car just like everyone else, so if you want to get your car early, order early!
There would be an easy way to nip the speculator problem in the bud. Porsche could just stock up the first six month's production of vehicles, and release them all at once. Instant elimination of the excess demand from which speculators make their money.
There would be an easy way to nip the speculator problem in the bud. Porsche could just stock up the first six month's production of vehicles, and release them all at once. Instant elimination of the excess demand from which speculators make their money.
x15 jeb said:
Exactly.
One comment though - this thing about speculators being a pain because they take away cars from 'true owners' is a bit much... Ultimately the cars held by speculators go to Porsche lovers anyway and ones that are willing to pay over the odds for them.. Makes them sound like 'true owners' to me.. Just because they don't want to wait and are willing to pay over the odds I don't think makes them the 'enemy'.
And let's be honest here - if there weren't speculators out there then people willing to pay extra would still get their hands on cars earlier. Ferrari are notorious for allowing 'VIPs' to jump the queue and I'm sure Porsche is no different. The right cheque will put you ahead of those willing to wait every time.
One comment though - this thing about speculators being a pain because they take away cars from 'true owners' is a bit much... Ultimately the cars held by speculators go to Porsche lovers anyway and ones that are willing to pay over the odds for them.. Makes them sound like 'true owners' to me.. Just because they don't want to wait and are willing to pay over the odds I don't think makes them the 'enemy'.
And let's be honest here - if there weren't speculators out there then people willing to pay extra would still get their hands on cars earlier. Ferrari are notorious for allowing 'VIPs' to jump the queue and I'm sure Porsche is no different. The right cheque will put you ahead of those willing to wait every time.
Where did you get "Ferrari are notorious for allowing VIPs to jump the queue" from?
430 Spider said:
x15 jeb said:
Exactly.
One comment though - this thing about speculators being a pain because they take away cars from 'true owners' is a bit much... Ultimately the cars held by speculators go to Porsche lovers anyway and ones that are willing to pay over the odds for them.. Makes them sound like 'true owners' to me.. Just because they don't want to wait and are willing to pay over the odds I don't think makes them the 'enemy'.
And let's be honest here - if there weren't speculators out there then people willing to pay extra would still get their hands on cars earlier. Ferrari are notorious for allowing 'VIPs' to jump the queue and I'm sure Porsche is no different. The right cheque will put you ahead of those willing to wait every time.
One comment though - this thing about speculators being a pain because they take away cars from 'true owners' is a bit much... Ultimately the cars held by speculators go to Porsche lovers anyway and ones that are willing to pay over the odds for them.. Makes them sound like 'true owners' to me.. Just because they don't want to wait and are willing to pay over the odds I don't think makes them the 'enemy'.
And let's be honest here - if there weren't speculators out there then people willing to pay extra would still get their hands on cars earlier. Ferrari are notorious for allowing 'VIPs' to jump the queue and I'm sure Porsche is no different. The right cheque will put you ahead of those willing to wait every time.
Where did you get "Ferrari are notorious for allowing VIPs to jump the queue" from?
Its partly true, but like everything else its down to who you know, and haow much is in the brown envolope............
I've had three personal friends who have experienced this.
One ended up cancelling their order as he kept being pushed back/messed around. Be realistic, how do you think the likes of JKAY and all the other 'celebs, VIPS, etc' seem to get their hands on cars earlier than the mere mortals. Great PR and publicity for Ferrari. The waiting list is messed around with on a daily basis to accommodate regulars and Ferrari's 'friends'...
Simple fact is, if you've got a big enough cheque and the right profile/friends, you will get a Ferrari quicker than the rest either through a speculator or official list. Fact of life - money/connections speak.
One ended up cancelling their order as he kept being pushed back/messed around. Be realistic, how do you think the likes of JKAY and all the other 'celebs, VIPS, etc' seem to get their hands on cars earlier than the mere mortals. Great PR and publicity for Ferrari. The waiting list is messed around with on a daily basis to accommodate regulars and Ferrari's 'friends'...
Simple fact is, if you've got a big enough cheque and the right profile/friends, you will get a Ferrari quicker than the rest either through a speculator or official list. Fact of life - money/connections speak.
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