996TT to MKII GT3

[sapltagain]

Well, despite some nah sayers when i asked for advice a couple of months ago, I did the swap. 03 TT for 03 GT3. Don't want to get into the debate about which is better, so I'll just list my findings:

1. Comfort: Not up to the TT, but not bad at all. Managed 4 hours of traffic jams to Bedford on Thursday then a track evening and two and a half hours back and managed to walk out of it without looking like an old man - bum was a bit numb though!!! (it's not my daily driver)

2. B roads: No where near as bad as i had been lead to beleive, does jump around a bit but I actually find it more engaging.

3. Noise: no contest.

4. CD player: mmmmmmmmmm does jump a bit!!!!!

5. Bucket Seats: Best invention ever for the track. The TT was like a full on abs work out.

6. Track: I'm not very good and sure there are those in a TT that can go quicker, but i find it far more enjoyable, especially when the back end gives way. Even my spin at Bedford was a bit of a hoot (although i bet the guy in the Evo i was following was laughing his head off).

7. Colour: (I know there are loads to choose from): Well, it's speed yellow which i actually like, the wife wont go out in it though (). BUT who the hell specs yellow leather on the sun visors and air vents!!!!!!! Might have to get these changed.

All in all I love it. I had considered a GT3 before the TT but had been slightly scared off by horror stories of bad ride quality. Wish I had not listened as it cost me a few quid to change.

So that's my story. Both great cars, but if you are thinking about a GT3, don't be put off go and drive one yourself.

[AlexHancock]

Ditto! I doubt you'll get bored. Enjoy.

[S1XXR]

sapltagain said:

So that's my story. Both great cars, but if you are thinking about a GT3, don't be put off go and drive one yourself.

Sound advice. Enjoy the car.

[supermono]

I guess not being your daily driver you won't find the lack of guts in the midrange too much of a pain, but my fear when I tried one was that when passing cars in s/c A roads I'd find progress too tiring -- ie having to go down to 3rd at 50mph to get any sort of acceleration wheras the tt will lazily squirt off in 4th.

Also on m-ways, I like the way from even as little as 90mph the car goes off like a scalded cat in 6th gear (3krpm), the GT3 would have to be put into 4th.

I know it's not what the GT3's designed for but in the real world that kind of work represents a lot of my journeying.

SM

[johnny senna]

supermono said:

I guess not being your daily driver you won't find the lack of guts in the midrange too much of a pain, but my fear when I tried one was that when passing cars in s/c A roads I'd find progress too tiring -- ie having to go down to 3rd at 50mph to get any sort of acceleration wheras the tt will lazily squirt off in 4th.

Also on m-ways, I like the way from even as little as 90mph the car goes off like a scalded cat in 6th gear (3krpm), the GT3 would have to be put into 4th.

I know it's not what the GT3's designed for but in the real world that kind of work represents a lot of my journeying.

SM

Oh come on, why not just get an SL 55 AMG and let its auto box and torque do all the work for you? Some of us like revving the flat 6 and changing gears.

[rob_j]

Well I was gonna say that's why so many Turbo Tip's get sold.....better still if changing gear is so much effort get a chauffuer

[kayc]

johnny senna said:

supermono said:

I guess not being your daily driver you won't find the lack of guts in the midrange too much of a pain, but my fear when I tried one was that when passing cars in s/c A roads I'd find progress too tiring -- ie having to go down to 3rd at 50mph to get any sort of acceleration wheras the tt will lazily squirt off in 4th.

Also on m-ways, I like the way from even as little as 90mph the car goes off like a scalded cat in 6th gear (3krpm), the GT3 would have to be put into 4th.

I know it's not what the GT3's designed for but in the real world that kind of work represents a lot of my journeying.

SM

Oh come on, why not just get an SL 55 AMG and let its auto box and torque do all the work for you? Some of us like revving the flat 6 and changing gears.

Coz an SL55 dont go round corners...

[johnny senna]

kayc said:

johnny senna said:

supermono said:

I guess not being your daily driver you won't find the lack of guts in the midrange too much of a pain, but my fear when I tried one was that when passing cars in s/c A roads I'd find progress too tiring -- ie having to go down to 3rd at 50mph to get any sort of acceleration wheras the tt will lazily squirt off in 4th.

Also on m-ways, I like the way from even as little as 90mph the car goes off like a scalded cat in 6th gear (3krpm), the GT3 would have to be put into 4th.

I know it's not what the GT3's designed for but in the real world that kind of work represents a lot of my journeying.

SM

Oh come on, why not just get an SL 55 AMG and let its auto box and torque do all the work for you? Some of us like revving the flat 6 and changing gears.

Coz an SL55 dont go round corners...

I know, I was (kind of) joking. But if changing gears is such a hassle for Turbo owners, just get the tiptronic I say.

[supermono]

I'm quite happy to change gear. You've deliberately misunderstood my point (again). When I'm out on a fun drive the gearchanging is all part of the fun/control and that'd be where the GT3 would be comparable to the turbo, but when I'm on a 130mile trip including stretches of dull A road with slowsters and trucks, all the revving up and changing gear would be a pain in the arse. That's why the tt is king, because it just does everything, all the time, no matter what.

Possibly as I've said before, not on the racetrack in the hands of all you white hot racing drivers...

SM

[tertius]

sapltagain said:

6. Track: I'm not very good and sure there are those in a TT that can go quicker, but i find it far more enjoyable, especially when the back end gives way. Even my spin at Bedford was a bit of a hoot (although i bet the guy in the Evo i was following was laughing his head off).

Having been lucky enough to have a passenger ride in it at Bedford all I can say is that if you aren't very good, then I'm truly sh*te (which may well be true of course)

Gorgeous car - totally, totally awesome.

Thanks again for the ride.

[johnny senna]

supermono said:

I'm quite happy to change gear. You've deliberately misunderstood my point (again). When I'm out on a fun drive the gearchanging is all part of the fun/control and that'd be where the GT3 would be comparable to the turbo, but when I'm on a 130mile trip including stretches of dull A road with slowsters and trucks, all the revving up and changing gear would be a pain in the arse. That's why the tt is king, because it just does everything, all the time, no matter what.

Possibly as I've said before, not on the racetrack in the hands of all you white hot racing drivers...

SM

You make it sound like driving a GT3 is like a Honda S2000 or Reliant Robin or something else with no torque. They're not that bad.

[DanH]

johnny senna said:

supermono said:

I'm quite happy to change gear. You've deliberately misunderstood my point (again). When I'm out on a fun drive the gearchanging is all part of the fun/control and that'd be where the GT3 would be comparable to the turbo, but when I'm on a 130mile trip including stretches of dull A road with slowsters and trucks, all the revving up and changing gear would be a pain in the arse. That's why the tt is king, because it just does everything, all the time, no matter what.

Possibly as I've said before, not on the racetrack in the hands of all you white hot racing drivers...

SM

You make it sound like driving a GT3 is like a Honda S2000 or Reliant Robin or something else with no torque. They're not that bad.

Exactly... They've got enough, for me anyway.

[supermono]

Well looking at the graphs on the superchips site, it seems:

tt gt3
2000 275 260
2500 475 275
3000 540 270
3500 550 280
4000 550 300
4500 540 310
5000 525 310
5500 520 340
6000 500 340
6500 470 350
7000 - 360
7500 - 340
8000 - 320

So no surprise that it feels gutless. I suppose gearing helps though because it's got an extra 1500rpm to play with, but those figures really do demonstrate the real world difference. Almost half as much torque all the way through to 5k is a pretty hard defficiency to make up with gearing and weight.

SM

[Adam B]

if you don't mind me asking, what was the mileage of each and which way did money change hands? OPC?

[Neilpeel59]

sapltagain said:

Even my spin at Bedford was a bit of a hoot .

Too right it was. I was watching from the pit, and I must say it was pretty spectacular. Now if they made a GT3 with PSM I might be tempted

[supermono]

Neilpeel59 said:

Now if they made a GT3 with PSM I might be tempted

Quick! Run! Hide!

SM

[sapltagain]

The TT had 20k (I did 5 of these in six months) on the clock and the GT3 has 14. Did it through an independant and teh actual cost was flat, but ate a bit on depreciation on the TT.

[johnny senna]

supermono said:

Well looking at the graphs on the superchips site, it seems:

tt gt3
2000 275 260
2500 475 275
3000 540 270
3500 550 280
4000 550 300
4500 540 310
5000 525 310
5500 520 340
6000 500 340
6500 470 350
7000 - 360
7500 - 340
8000 - 320

So no surprise that it feels gutless. I suppose gearing helps though because it's got an extra 1500rpm to play with, but those figures really do demonstrate the real world difference. Almost half as much torque all the way through to 5k is a pretty hard defficiency to make up with gearing and weight.

SM

Aye, the GT3 in all its forms is completely gutless with no torque whatsoever.

[Pugsey]

supermono said:

Well looking at the graphs on the superchips site, it seems:

tt gt3
2000 275 260
2500 475 275
3000 540 270
3500 550 280
4000 550 300
4500 540 310
5000 525 310
5500 520 340
6000 500 340
6500 470 350
7000 - 360
7500 - 340
8000 - 320

So no surprise that it feels gutless. I suppose gearing helps though because it's got an extra 1500rpm to play with, but those figures really do demonstrate the real world difference. Almost half as much torque all the way through to 5k is a pretty hard defficiency to make up with gearing and weight.

SM

Oh for heavens sake - another example of how we all get lost in our own little 'Porsche World' me thinks! The GT3 may have less torque than the tt but, in the real world, it doesn't feel gutless by any stretch of the imagination.That's a bit like me saying that compared to a GT3 the tt handles with all the agility of a cow in a bog...............

Edited by Pugsey on Tuesday 12th September 12:25

[supermono]

The GT3 felt gutless to me. Ie there was no low grunt and those figures explain why and why -- crucially -- it wasn't right for me and my kind of driving. I put up that chart to counter people saying it was quite torquey. I think an E36M3 makes similar levels of torque to a GT3, though it doesn't hold on to it so well up the rev range, and I've never heard anyone describe a 1996 M3 as torquey!

However, in the context of the OP I'm genuinely interested in knowing has he found this lack of torque is causing him much frustration?

I've still not written off the GT3 as a next car for myself, because under the right circumstances I know it would have been a scream.

SM