do you really need to run it in?
Discussion
I don't think this is true at all.
Firstly the production processes at Porsche are so tight as in seats arrive at factory the day of production in they go etc..
Are they really going to spend many hours on the production & costing of a car.porsche is apparently the most profitable car producer per unit and this kind of bespoke procedure goes against that.
secondly my car arrived with 8 miles on it which is the run round the block to see if anything falls of,hardly run in.
It felt so tight from new I wasn't that impressed,however having been incredibly strict with myself on running it in,I felt initial improvement after 2,500 miles and now after a further 2000 miles it feels better still.
Consider you are not just running the main bearings in,there are brakes,wheel bearings to consider also.
As mentioned the idea of running the owner in with the car is something I have heard before directly from Porsche.
Firstly the production processes at Porsche are so tight as in seats arrive at factory the day of production in they go etc..
Are they really going to spend many hours on the production & costing of a car.porsche is apparently the most profitable car producer per unit and this kind of bespoke procedure goes against that.
secondly my car arrived with 8 miles on it which is the run round the block to see if anything falls of,hardly run in.
It felt so tight from new I wasn't that impressed,however having been incredibly strict with myself on running it in,I felt initial improvement after 2,500 miles and now after a further 2000 miles it feels better still.
Consider you are not just running the main bearings in,there are brakes,wheel bearings to consider also.
As mentioned the idea of running the owner in with the car is something I have heard before directly from Porsche.
running on the bench is one thing, running under load
in the car is another. If you thrash it from the off you may damage the engine & will certainly end up with
excess oil usage later on.Porsche diagnostics are also so accurate that they can tell how many times you have hit the rev limiter, if you need to claim under warranty for engine problems they could have a let out clause if you don't follow guideline's. I looked into this subject & the overall advice was under 3000ish revs for the first 500 miles then gradually increase the revs up to 900/1000 miles then your off !!
I think the key is to gradually increase load, revs
& driving style to bed the car in properly
in the car is another. If you thrash it from the off you may damage the engine & will certainly end up with
excess oil usage later on.Porsche diagnostics are also so accurate that they can tell how many times you have hit the rev limiter, if you need to claim under warranty for engine problems they could have a let out clause if you don't follow guideline's. I looked into this subject & the overall advice was under 3000ish revs for the first 500 miles then gradually increase the revs up to 900/1000 miles then your off !!
I think the key is to gradually increase load, revs
& driving style to bed the car in properly
my local porker dealer reckons that they test run the engines before you get them as they couldn't rely on customers to run them in properly even though it still tells you to in the manual. Is this right? Anyone know for sure? Been to the factory and found out?
EVERY engine is test run and revved to over 6000 rpm. Its a fact. I've seen this and asked myself "there they are revving an engine with a life of 20 minutes past 6000 rpm - whats the point of running them in?"
Well, I'd still run the engine in properly, but it does make you wonder ...
grant3 said: I looked into this subject & the overall advice was under 3000ish revs for the first 500 miles then gradually increase the revs up to 900/1000 miles then your off !!
Oh dear... I used an occasional 4000 for the first 200 miles, then fairly frequent 4000. Still around that level at 1,500 miles, but occasional bursts to 5000/5500 when the oil is truly hot.
For most cars the old rule (very old!) was max 3000 for 3,000 miles, and if you floored a Jaguar at less than 1,000 miles you needed more oil than petrol from then on!
I'm still inclined not to cane it until after the 3,000 mark has been passed, but maybe this is too cautious, and the temptation is hard to live with. What's best for a 996 Turbo? Comments appreciated.
Ian
Oh dear, this thread could be widened to incorporate the question about when it's safe to cane one's blowers after a start up generally (long after run in)?
Yesterday, I rolled out the barrel and tootled for some small herbivores to frighten over the moors.
I'm quite paranoid about nailing the plunger before all the juices are suitably flowing and hot so generally favour a several minute amble up the m-way until temptation always intervenes...
How do you guys approach the 'my car's stone cold but I want to drive' quandry?
P.S. Question for any other turbo owners: I find my car feels more accelerative in 4th or 5th (even 6th when really flying) that it often does in 3rd; any ideas or do you think I'm just not trying hard enough?
(Sh1t - oh no - flat spot?...paranoia city...)
Yesterday, I rolled out the barrel and tootled for some small herbivores to frighten over the moors.
I'm quite paranoid about nailing the plunger before all the juices are suitably flowing and hot so generally favour a several minute amble up the m-way until temptation always intervenes...
How do you guys approach the 'my car's stone cold but I want to drive' quandry?
P.S. Question for any other turbo owners: I find my car feels more accelerative in 4th or 5th (even 6th when really flying) that it often does in 3rd; any ideas or do you think I'm just not trying hard enough?
(Sh1t - oh no - flat spot?...paranoia city...)
derestrictor said:How do you guys approach the 'my car's stone cold but I want to drive' quandry?
Yesterday there was a thread about this which went a bit off topic. Supposing you haven't seen it yet you might find some information.
By the way DeR, do you let your turbos cool down when you park the car before turning the engine off or do you directly turn off the engine after parking?
edited to add some missing nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn
>> Edited by Thom on Saturday 5th April 13:13
Ian,,,,I have heard some poor oil consumption figures for 996TT.I assume they were not treated so well in their early days.This definitely writes the book for later in the cars life.
I ran my 996 C2 in very carefully up to 3000rpm for the first 1000 miles then went to the factory 4000rpm suggestion up to 1850 miles or the 3000km stated.
It now has 4500 odd feeling loser.practically zero oil consumption.
I ran my 996 C2 in very carefully up to 3000rpm for the first 1000 miles then went to the factory 4000rpm suggestion up to 1850 miles or the 3000km stated.
It now has 4500 odd feeling loser.practically zero oil consumption.
Thom - merci beaucoup mon copain. Yes, indeed; I usually perform a tedious ritual involving dropping the portcullis and defenestrating a few tiresome Hugenots into the moat which wastes a minute or two; thereafter, Herr Pigenstein is wheeled into his straw filled sty for an evening of lardy arsed oriental banter with Lexo-san.
(Btw, had a hugely enjoyable razz in the little bugger yesterday; nothing quite beats the thrill of hitting the m-way at a reasonable lick, staying in 5th and then exocetting one's way to stratospheric interpretations of the speed limit and pining for the joys of Bruntingthorpe...or of course the autoroute north of Montepellier, naturellement.
)
derestrictor said:Yes, indeed; I usually perform a tedious ritual involving dropping the portcullis and defenestrating a few tiresome Hugenots into the moat which wastes a minute or two; thereafter, Herr Pigenstein is wheeled into his straw filled sty for an evening of lardy arsed oriental banter with Lexo-san.
Can somebody please tell me if DeR actually talk like the way he types ?!
I hope I will reach this level of vocabulary some day.
Paul...Thank you for the good advice. Quite a lot of gentle motorway running and only occasional bursts to 4000, so I think it should be OK. No unusual oil consumption so far.
DeR...Five gentle miles and then nothing too ambitious for another five. I suppose it all comes down to the roads where you live vs the natural urge (call of nature? Or have I got that wrong us usual)!
Thom...re turbos generally I always used to give the Quattro and the Supra a four minute tickover before switching off. Nothing about that in the Porsche manual, but I can't get out of the habit, and still give it a couple of minutes.
Anybody wondering why I've done such a low mileage, I had an interesting glitch at 600 miles. Fractured O ring resulted in large pool of oil on garage floor. Ouch! Engine out then a water leak. Now perfect, thank goodness, and faith restored!
Cheers,
Ian.
DeR...Five gentle miles and then nothing too ambitious for another five. I suppose it all comes down to the roads where you live vs the natural urge (call of nature? Or have I got that wrong us usual)!
Thom...re turbos generally I always used to give the Quattro and the Supra a four minute tickover before switching off. Nothing about that in the Porsche manual, but I can't get out of the habit, and still give it a couple of minutes.
Anybody wondering why I've done such a low mileage, I had an interesting glitch at 600 miles. Fractured O ring resulted in large pool of oil on garage floor. Ouch! Engine out then a water leak. Now perfect, thank goodness, and faith restored!
Cheers,
Ian.
Yes I have been to the factory... and here's the gospel truth.... (as of two years ago)
The engine assembly plant builds the engines "just in time" before they are mated to transmissions and then either transfered 100yds to the main assembly plant or shipped for Finnish Boxster or Leipzig Cayenne installation.
The engines are each generally built by one guy - unless he needs a break in which case he is replaced by another - his/their identity can be traced by the engine serial number. It's a remarkable process - the builder walks with the engine around a 60 yards circuit as the engine moves to where the next parts and specialist tools are waiting for him. It is then bench tested in a soundproof booth - using warm Mobil 1 oil that has just been used in another engine previously - not sure how frequently the oil is changed / discarded, but any faults that are discovered are traced and then the supplier of the faulty part is liable for the cost of the whole engine......
Assembly workers are then given the chance to train to become temporary test drivers - Porsche remains one of the only manufacturers to pre-test their cars on the public road. The workers can only do it for a set period of time and I think only once in their career, but they take the new cars out of the plant, turn right at the main Porsche roundabout (it has traffic lights to allow Porsches out of the factory - deeply cool to see two brand new cars waiting with temporary plates and protective plastic revving up waiting for the lights to change) and along about 1km to the nearest Autobahn. Not sure the distance driven, but only after the testers are happy does the car get signed off.
Go to your local Porsche Centre if you are an owner and ask to be included in a tour - it's fascinating - Stuttgart's a bit dull otherwise though (but the 'ring isn't that far away.....
The engine assembly plant builds the engines "just in time" before they are mated to transmissions and then either transfered 100yds to the main assembly plant or shipped for Finnish Boxster or Leipzig Cayenne installation.
The engines are each generally built by one guy - unless he needs a break in which case he is replaced by another - his/their identity can be traced by the engine serial number. It's a remarkable process - the builder walks with the engine around a 60 yards circuit as the engine moves to where the next parts and specialist tools are waiting for him. It is then bench tested in a soundproof booth - using warm Mobil 1 oil that has just been used in another engine previously - not sure how frequently the oil is changed / discarded, but any faults that are discovered are traced and then the supplier of the faulty part is liable for the cost of the whole engine......
Assembly workers are then given the chance to train to become temporary test drivers - Porsche remains one of the only manufacturers to pre-test their cars on the public road. The workers can only do it for a set period of time and I think only once in their career, but they take the new cars out of the plant, turn right at the main Porsche roundabout (it has traffic lights to allow Porsches out of the factory - deeply cool to see two brand new cars waiting with temporary plates and protective plastic revving up waiting for the lights to change) and along about 1km to the nearest Autobahn. Not sure the distance driven, but only after the testers are happy does the car get signed off.
Go to your local Porsche Centre if you are an owner and ask to be included in a tour - it's fascinating - Stuttgart's a bit dull otherwise though (but the 'ring isn't that far away.....
Re turbos cooling down...
I believe that you don't need to let the turbos 'wind down' after a run with the 993 turbo, nor with many other modern turbo installations.
This is because Porsche (in their wisdom) knew that many of their customers thrash the nuts off their car down their long gravel drive, then switch the engine off as soon as the wheels have come to a crunching stop.
Therefore, IIRC, the 993 installation has a small oil pump which circulates oil through the turbo bearing for a few minutes after, preventing oil crystallisation... someone more technically able may be able to confirm/deny, but I'm sure you are being kind to your turbos for no good reason.
Remember to always warm a turbo's oil up extra carefully, though, as shagged turbo bearings are often caused through sloppy warm up.
I believe that you don't need to let the turbos 'wind down' after a run with the 993 turbo, nor with many other modern turbo installations.
This is because Porsche (in their wisdom) knew that many of their customers thrash the nuts off their car down their long gravel drive, then switch the engine off as soon as the wheels have come to a crunching stop.
Therefore, IIRC, the 993 installation has a small oil pump which circulates oil through the turbo bearing for a few minutes after, preventing oil crystallisation... someone more technically able may be able to confirm/deny, but I'm sure you are being kind to your turbos for no good reason.
Remember to always warm a turbo's oil up extra carefully, though, as shagged turbo bearings are often caused through sloppy warm up.
To Mcnab, if you've done over 1000-ish mile's give that right foot the full flex...NOW !!! Once run in you need to drive that car hard to ensure it becomes a quick one !!!
Re-Dom's comment, I still think it's best to let the motor tick over for around 30secs if you have just had a hard blast & are parking up, even with modern technology it can't hurt to take some of the heat out of the Turbo's, I always do in the same way as I don't thrash it until the engines fully warmed through.
Re-Dom's comment, I still think it's best to let the motor tick over for around 30secs if you have just had a hard blast & are parking up, even with modern technology it can't hurt to take some of the heat out of the Turbo's, I always do in the same way as I don't thrash it until the engines fully warmed through.
thx for all the responses
i didn't believe the guy at the dealership too much so have been taking it relatively carefully with the car, up to 1000 miles now and occasionally nudging it up to 5k. in another 1,000 i'll start to occassionally red line it and in between probably the occassional 6k foray.
If its anything like a bike engine they respond well to occassional trips into the higher rev range whilst running in. Although... I ran a zx9r in very carefully and it was blown away (an extra 5bhp) on the dyno by another zx9r (identical) but it had been thrashed from new. Now whether that engine would have lasted as long as mine is another matter but then i suppose he would of sold it by the time it had done 20,000 miles.
i didn't believe the guy at the dealership too much so have been taking it relatively carefully with the car, up to 1000 miles now and occasionally nudging it up to 5k. in another 1,000 i'll start to occassionally red line it and in between probably the occassional 6k foray.
If its anything like a bike engine they respond well to occassional trips into the higher rev range whilst running in. Although... I ran a zx9r in very carefully and it was blown away (an extra 5bhp) on the dyno by another zx9r (identical) but it had been thrashed from new. Now whether that engine would have lasted as long as mine is another matter but then i suppose he would of sold it by the time it had done 20,000 miles.
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