The old chestnut - 944 or E30 M3?

[nos4a2]

I know that it's been done a few times but usually comparing 968's and the E30 M3.

I'm in the lovely position of having about £5k for a weekend toy. It must be RWD, older than 1992 (for classic insurance) and have at least token rear seats so that I can take the kids with me and above all FUN. The list is pretty short:
E30 M3 - for this money it would be an early one in pretty average condition
944 S2 - I should be able to get a nice one
944 Turbo - once again, probably a bit tired at this money

I'm leaning towards the 944 S2 as it will probably be in the best condition and there shouldn't be any horrible bills around the corner if I keep on top of things.

I would be interested in other people's opinions/experiences.

[bob1179]

I'd go for the E30! But you are right in saying that 5k will get you a taxed and tested runner. It could make a good rolling project though. Spend a bit on it as you use it and get it up to scratch over a bit of time.

They are awesome handling cars, not that quick by todays standards but loads of fun.

Go on, do it, do it!

[Koln-RS]

I think the S2/Turbo is a better car. A good one would surpass the M3 for handling and performance.

But, the M3 does have a superior 'classic' status and the benefit of proper rear seats.

Tricky choice.

[nos4a2]

My worry is that the M3 or 940 Turbo will be a money pit. Having negotiated some toy money I would be deeply unpopular at home if that turned out to be the start of a massive spending spree. Similarly, I would be disappointed if I ended up with a shed that I couldn't use, particularly as I would like to have a go at some track days later in the year.

[AJLintern]

I'd budget at least £1k per year for maintenance, maybe a bit less if you do it yourself. I suspect M3 parts and servicing would be similar to the 944. If you really need to make use of rear seats, the M3 would of course be better. But in terms of looks and performance, I think the 944 has it

Edited by AJLintern on Saturday 3rd March 11:41

[gandhi]

A good friend of mine spent £6k on an E30 M3, and it hasnt missed a beat.

I've a couple of E30's myself, quite fancy an M3 myself. There is a wealth of parts and advice available on e30zone.com/co.uk? Cant remember which. He's had to buy track rods & ends, and other similarly minor parts, nothing more than that. But it really is an absolute joy on a winding B road.

Gets my vote, albeit i've no experience of the Porsches.

[silvers2]

944 S2 is a good enough car but space is limited, I would say it's more of a second car being a 2+2 with small seats in tha back.
The later cars do have folding seat backs to give a bit more room but not much.
My S2 has been very reliable and good fun, I also considered the BMW but decided it just wasn't as different as the Porsche, and looked, well, like any amount of 3 box cars out there.
Andy

[freedman]

Why does it have to be pre 92?

You can get classic insurance on 10 yeasr old at many insurers

I've had an S2 as a daily driver for 2 and a half years, car was fantastic and I would recommend them to anyone, but as a weekend toy I think the M3 knocks spots off it.

[verysideways]

Depends how much time you will use the back seats - lots? M3. Not often? 944

Of the two 944's i reckon the turbo would be cheaper to maintain because it's such a simple engine, just make sure you cool the trubo down after a good spanking. Maybe i've just heard too many camshaft horror stories on S2's and 968's.

Turbo would be cheaper to tune too when you decide you need a bit more power...

[silverS2]

I agree with Verysideways on the turbo route, not sure about which one is the more reliable as both engines seem pretty indestructible though, and last for massive milages if A. you get a good one and B. you look after it.
I think the cam problem stories are a bit exaggerated on the 16 valve motors, is this not more to do with the variocam on the 968 causing problems?, cartainly when I had a look at the sprockets on my 112,000 mile engine they were perfect, as was the slipper/ tensioner assembly.

I don't think there are many 16 valve S2 owners out there who haven't wished for 'just a bit more power', while the turbo owners are all giggling like crazy fools at their latest easy BHP increase.

I often wonder if I should have bought a turbo but I'm in no way disappoinded with the car, I'm biding my time until a reasonably priced bolt on turbo or supercharger kit becomes available (never?)
oh, and 5 grand is a lot of money and should buy an absolutely fantastic N/A 944, or a good turbo.

Andy

Edited by silverS2 on Saturday 3rd March 13:43

[iguana]

Ah a very good question. Bit biased as ive had 5 944s but no m3, however I love e30 M3s & are one of the best looking cars ever made, but driven a couple- road & track but always end up disapointed, & the track one had lost spent & was about as good as you'd get a non evo one to go power & handling wise. No midrange at all & all top end & there is not really very much of it, handling is great, but IMHO not much if any better than a 944 with decnet aftermarket suspension (or new mo30 etc) tho the turn in alwasy feels more nimble on m3 & car feels lighter tho i dont think it is much, but I feel power wise its very similar to 944 2.5 'S' rather than S2 performance. A really nice e30 325i sport is IMHO a far far better road car, & you'd get the best in the world for the price of a very average m3.


As stock an S2 is waaaaaay too wallowy a GT car rather than a sports car, but has so much more usable power than the e30, lots of midrange & stomping top end too. Turbo a diferent proposition & s2 & turbo has been covered on here many times before, so wont delv into now but a 944t with sorted suspension & normal 300bhp area fettleing is a darn swift car in the right hands.

My summing up, m3 is by far the better looking of the two, its an icon, rather than just a car & I'll still bloody have one someday despite all my protestations tho! So all in all, sorry I can't help much really!

[Buttmonkey Racer]

E30 325i w/motorsport bits will be a better bet all round. RHD, parts are easy to get , very tuneable and not that much down on power/speed on a £5k(wornout) M3. £5K will buy a minter too

[iguana]

On the subject of M3s tho if you are thinking of a 944 don't watch this this vid.....

Ok regular m3s dont quite go or sound this good & by jingo thats some driver skill, & its a glorious vid, turn up the volume!

http://videos.streetfire.net/hottestv


& little bit of m3 btcc from 89 at brands here, on board with Mike 'Helicopter' Smith (I dont remember him actually being any good, but not too shabby in the clip)

www.dailymotion.com/visited/search/btcc/video/xdpqn_racing-btcc-1988-brandshatch

Edited by iguana on Sunday 4th March 18:31

[AJLintern]

Wow - he was pressing on a bit wasn't he?! Great clip Alex!

Yes I didn't realise Mike Smith was quite such a handy driver - good stuff!

[loach]

Two fantastic clips there. The first one is awe-inspiring - there can't have been much more to come from that car. Awesome.

[Brett928S2]

Hi

928 ???

For 5k you would get a very good S2 or an average S4..

170 mph...small back seats but my teenagers fit in mine (just)

And that great V8 rumble that puts a smile on your face every time you start it

All the best Brett

[slippydiff]

iguana said:

On the subject of M3s tho if you are thinking of a 944 don't watch this this vid.....

Ok regular m3s dont quite go or sound this good & by jingo thats some driver skill, & its a glorious vid, turn up the volume!

http://videos.streetfire.net/hottestv


& little bit of m3 btcc from 89 at brands here, on board with Mike 'Helicopter' Smith (I dont remember him actually being any good, but not too shabby in the clip)

www.dailymotion.com/visited/search/btcc/video/xdpqn_racing-btcc-1988-brandshatch

Edited by iguana on Sunday 4th March 18:31

Or for some real oversteer action try this ..................

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hm2il442qo4

[nos4a2]

I thought about a 928 or and E34 M5 (again) but I want something smaller & sportier - less GT like.

[nos4a2]

Buttmonkey Racer said:

E30 325i w/motorsport bits will be a better bet all round. RHD, parts are easy to get , very tuneable and not that much down on power/speed on a £5k(wornout) M3. £5K will buy a minter too

How much would you have to spend to get a 325 up to M3 performance - not just the power but the handling - I thought that the two were significantly different in the suspension department?

[nos4a2]

iguana said:

On the subject of M3s tho if you are thinking of a 944 don't watch this this vid.....

Ok regular m3s dont quite go or sound this good & by jingo thats some driver skill, & its a glorious vid, turn up the volume!

http://videos.streetfire.net/hottestv

Great vid - something to aspire to