993 wieght loss?
Discussion
I am doing a lot of Ring trips and trackdays,ive got lightwieght seats,de-cat pipe,which has saved about 50kgs,but added a roll cage so this is probably counteracted that.
Has anybody stripped the carpets and doorcards or had anymore experience in this fiel to tell me wether its worth it?
I am told the the carpet/underlay,soundproofing wieghs a ton???
Thanks Dan
Has anybody stripped the carpets and doorcards or had anymore experience in this fiel to tell me wether its worth it?
I am told the the carpet/underlay,soundproofing wieghs a ton???
Thanks Dan
If your not careful you can ruin the things you love about a car 95% of the time for a slight improvement 5% of the time, stripped out loud harsh race cars are great when you have a helmet on and are batting round a track, but they are horrible on the road.
On the road some luxuries are nice, like being able to get out without a headache, open the passenger window without leaning across the car, adjust the mirrors without stopping and getting in and out a dozen times, and sit in a seat that doesn't give you back ache after 10 miles.
As another chap has said if it's improving your times your after, new suspension/brakes/rubber, if you can find lighter wheels to reduce unsprung weight then great. And get some tuition that will reduce your times more than any other modification. There are not many drivers me included that can't benefit from someone elses observations and advice.
On the road some luxuries are nice, like being able to get out without a headache, open the passenger window without leaning across the car, adjust the mirrors without stopping and getting in and out a dozen times, and sit in a seat that doesn't give you back ache after 10 miles.
As another chap has said if it's improving your times your after, new suspension/brakes/rubber, if you can find lighter wheels to reduce unsprung weight then great. And get some tuition that will reduce your times more than any other modification. There are not many drivers me included that can't benefit from someone elses observations and advice.
wildoliver said:
If your not careful you can ruin the things you love about a car 95% of the time for a slight improvement 5% of the time, stripped out loud harsh race cars are great when you have a helmet on and are batting round a track, but they are horrible on the road.
On the road some luxuries are nice, like being able to get out without a headache, open the passenger window without leaning across the car, adjust the mirrors without stopping and getting in and out a dozen times, and sit in a seat that doesn't give you back ache after 10 miles.
As another chap has said if it's improving your times your after, new suspension/brakes/rubber, if you can find lighter wheels to reduce unsprung weight then great. And get some tuition that will reduce your times more than any other modification. There are not many drivers me included that can't benefit from someone elses observations and advice.
I have to agree with Wildoliver. The heaviest part of the interior is the electric seats that you have already removed and you have not got 70kg of soundproofing and carpet unless it is lying in 3" of water. Light weight aluminium BBS wheels are a very good idea. (not magnesium). As said concentrate on improving your own ability either by instruction or practice rather than hoping to find time in saving a few KG of weight. On the road some luxuries are nice, like being able to get out without a headache, open the passenger window without leaning across the car, adjust the mirrors without stopping and getting in and out a dozen times, and sit in a seat that doesn't give you back ache after 10 miles.
As another chap has said if it's improving your times your after, new suspension/brakes/rubber, if you can find lighter wheels to reduce unsprung weight then great. And get some tuition that will reduce your times more than any other modification. There are not many drivers me included that can't benefit from someone elses observations and advice.
Teetering on the brink of this myself & having done a bit of research (ie searching through old threads on Rennlist & here) I reckon the following:
Lightweight seats - net loss ~ 30 kgs
Remove aircon compressor & other bits (doesn't work anyway) - 15 kgs
Remove Carpets & underlay/padding - 40-50 kgs
Lightweight wheels - net loss ~ 15 kgs
RS flywheel & clutch - net loss ~ 10 kgs
Remove Engine Tray - 7kgs
Total Net loss around 130 kgs, or a bit less than 10% of the cars weight - and I think some of the estimates above are conservative...Happy to be corrected by anybody out there who has different / better information...This is without removing the engine soundproofing (although the lack of carpets etc would doubtless change the 'acoustics', and without losing any of the electrics. Also keeping the rear seats & would need tiltable lightweight seats as need to put the kids in the back from time to time.
I'm in the process of getting the above work / parts priced up - if anyone's interested I'll post the numbers when I get them.
N.B. Not quite sure why I'm interested in doing this, I've never tracked the car (yet), but fancy both a bit more performance / handling and reckon I can happily live with a rawer / noisier drive in a car I primarily use for pleasure...
Lightweight seats - net loss ~ 30 kgs
Remove aircon compressor & other bits (doesn't work anyway) - 15 kgs
Remove Carpets & underlay/padding - 40-50 kgs
Lightweight wheels - net loss ~ 15 kgs
RS flywheel & clutch - net loss ~ 10 kgs
Remove Engine Tray - 7kgs
Total Net loss around 130 kgs, or a bit less than 10% of the cars weight - and I think some of the estimates above are conservative...Happy to be corrected by anybody out there who has different / better information...This is without removing the engine soundproofing (although the lack of carpets etc would doubtless change the 'acoustics', and without losing any of the electrics. Also keeping the rear seats & would need tiltable lightweight seats as need to put the kids in the back from time to time.
I'm in the process of getting the above work / parts priced up - if anyone's interested I'll post the numbers when I get them.
N.B. Not quite sure why I'm interested in doing this, I've never tracked the car (yet), but fancy both a bit more performance / handling and reckon I can happily live with a rawer / noisier drive in a car I primarily use for pleasure...
Yep, I'd heard numbers of 30-45 for all the aircon + coolant, but wasn't sure if these were lbs or kgs 
so thought I'd play safe with the estimates...
Only hesitation(s) on the battery are (a)keeping a bit of weight over the front seems like a good idea, and (b) I'd heard that lightweight batteries will get past their use by date quickly if the car isn't used regularly (trickle charging doesn't keep them in as good nick??) & mine's a bit of a weekend toy. Again happy to be corrected on this if I've got it wrong.
so thought I'd play safe with the estimates...Only hesitation(s) on the battery are (a)keeping a bit of weight over the front seems like a good idea, and (b) I'd heard that lightweight batteries will get past their use by date quickly if the car isn't used regularly (trickle charging doesn't keep them in as good nick??) & mine's a bit of a weekend toy. Again happy to be corrected on this if I've got it wrong.
Undertrays, aerodynamics...how fast are you going????
Most remove undertrays to help cooling on track, only use in winter to keep muck off of theengine.
wouldn't get excited about removing the pas, Porsche used a non assisted rack in the lhd 964RS, it isn't the same as the assisted one,,,i don't think it is as simple as just taking the pump off...i certainly feel more adjustability with pas on a 993 on track, which may make for a slightly better lap time, not that I honestly care that much.
The real answer is sell the car, buy a 993RS where Porsche has done most of the lightening work already, it will cost more but you won't lose money if you look after it, where as you will get slaughtered on the value if you butcher a standard 993 transforming it into a track hack.
Most remove undertrays to help cooling on track, only use in winter to keep muck off of theengine.
wouldn't get excited about removing the pas, Porsche used a non assisted rack in the lhd 964RS, it isn't the same as the assisted one,,,i don't think it is as simple as just taking the pump off...i certainly feel more adjustability with pas on a 993 on track, which may make for a slightly better lap time, not that I honestly care that much.
The real answer is sell the car, buy a 993RS where Porsche has done most of the lightening work already, it will cost more but you won't lose money if you look after it, where as you will get slaughtered on the value if you butcher a standard 993 transforming it into a track hack.
clubsport said:
Undertrays, aerodynamics...how fast are you going????
Most remove undertrays to help cooling on track, only use in winter to keep muck off of theengine.
wouldn't get excited about removing the pas, Porsche used a non assisted rack in the lhd 964RS, it isn't the same as the assisted one,,,i don't think it is as simple as just taking the pump off...i certainly feel more adjustability with pas on a 993 on track, which may make for a slightly better lap time, not that I honestly care that much.
The real answer is sell the car, buy a 993RS where Porsche has done most of the lightening work already, it will cost more but you won't lose money if you look after it, where as you will get slaughtered on the value if you butcher a standard 993 transforming it into a track hack.
Actually, with a lot of people spending 7OK plus on converting SC's and 964's to 2.7 look alikes and 50K on converting SC's to track cars I think it makes sense to go the 993 route. its a beautifull little car with a much better platform. With RS's and cup cars making stratespheric money, I think the smart money is on converting a C2 to track spec. Strip it out, fit a cage, harnesses ricaros, shorten the diff give it a respray and you have a beautifull little track car for half the cost of an RS. It will have a great retro look, be quick on the track and you can park it anywhere and not get strssed about it.Most remove undertrays to help cooling on track, only use in winter to keep muck off of theengine.
wouldn't get excited about removing the pas, Porsche used a non assisted rack in the lhd 964RS, it isn't the same as the assisted one,,,i don't think it is as simple as just taking the pump off...i certainly feel more adjustability with pas on a 993 on track, which may make for a slightly better lap time, not that I honestly care that much.
The real answer is sell the car, buy a 993RS where Porsche has done most of the lightening work already, it will cost more but you won't lose money if you look after it, where as you will get slaughtered on the value if you butcher a standard 993 transforming it into a track hack.
Makes sense to me...
Each to their own, but if you buy a 993 for £20k, spend £20k converting it,,,it owes you £40k,,,some will leave that parked anywhere some will not.
Pick up an RS for £50kish and chances are it will be worth what you paid if not more....the value of replicas is mostly dependent on the value of the original RS...for the cost of modification it makes no sense.
To spend £50k on a '70's RS rep is a slightly different story as the real deal M471 is £150-200k now.....this part of the reason why 964RS prices have shot up, it is the real thing for good replica money.....right now the price of making a 993RS rep is too close to the real thing, it wasn't exactly a difficult decision when it came to spending my own £££
Pick up an RS for £50kish and chances are it will be worth what you paid if not more....the value of replicas is mostly dependent on the value of the original RS...for the cost of modification it makes no sense.
To spend £50k on a '70's RS rep is a slightly different story as the real deal M471 is £150-200k now.....this part of the reason why 964RS prices have shot up, it is the real thing for good replica money.....right now the price of making a 993RS rep is too close to the real thing, it wasn't exactly a difficult decision when it came to spending my own £££
clubsport said:
Each to their own, but if you buy a 993 for £20k, spend £20k converting it,,,it owes you £40k,,,some will leave that parked anywhere some will not.
Pick up an RS for £50kish and chances are it will be worth what you paid if not more....the value of replicas is mostly dependent on the value of the original RS...for the cost of modification it makes no sense.
To spend £50k on a '70's RS rep is a slightly different story as the real deal M471 is £150-200k now.....this part of the reason why 964RS prices have shot up, it is the real thing for good replica money.....right now the price of making a 993RS rep is too close to the real thing, it wasn't exactly a difficult decision when it came to spending my own £££
Yep, i see your point, but I was thinking of a more focussed car than the RS. Maybe solid top mounts, cup springs, electric power steering, brembo big brakes etc. You probably wouldn't want to do that to an RS. Generally, its the standard cars that make the money. Certainly i cant see RS values dropping and a few drivers are a bit wary of tracking them these days.. Pick up an RS for £50kish and chances are it will be worth what you paid if not more....the value of replicas is mostly dependent on the value of the original RS...for the cost of modification it makes no sense.
To spend £50k on a '70's RS rep is a slightly different story as the real deal M471 is £150-200k now.....this part of the reason why 964RS prices have shot up, it is the real thing for good replica money.....right now the price of making a 993RS rep is too close to the real thing, it wasn't exactly a difficult decision when it came to spending my own £££
Don't know, just a thought. It just seems bonkers to spend money on turning a SC or a 964 into track car when the 993 platform is so good and bits are relatively cheap to buy.
Steve
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