Sledge hammer or surgeon's tweezer?
Discussion
Following yet another poor showing at the Thorpe's most brutal Brunt, I have been in a state of agitation.
Irritated by the lack of double tonnage and aware of the existence of realistically achievable and suitable whallop to there achieve, I made the foolish mistake of talking to my local fettler.
Internally, the options are purest Domster: a complete roll cage with the option of subtle trim coverage to give it that integrated RUF feel; obviously that means bye-bye to the rear seats and hello to yet further automotive liposuction; and of course, the carpet retrim can be done with an oh-so finer woven hemp.
But where it counts, out back, things look exceptionally moist...
The process involves effectively losing the car for an unholy period of time (which I'm not sure I could bear) but it's return would yield over 550 bhp /800 Nm Torque and a fair guarantee of a comfortable excess beyond the holy trinity of hyper car entry velocities (one of the speeds mentioned is pant-wettingly ludicrous...)
The cylinder heads are reworked to take twin spark plugs, a twin spark diss system is installed, larger exhaust valves employed, less limp-wristed pistons from Odin's own parts bin, not to mention something loin-cloth unfriendly called flame trap base gaskets; some race spec conrods and non-short-arsed cams (this'd be the third batch) get chucked in, whilst some chap called Heinz in Landau replaces the ECU prog for something to cope with the twin sparks, higher boost and fuel pressure.
Finally a GT2 motorsport intercooler gets bolted on but at least I already have the uprated clutch so I think Mr.H can cancel his ermine-shod slipperettes.
The wierd thing is that whilst this seems a perfectly logical thing to do, I was simultaneoulsy mulling the concept of a nice spring return to the simple and relatively inexpensive purity of a supple wee Elsie Mk1, what with warmer weather and the freshly scented waft of a post-rush hour evening's contemplation nudging the conscience.
Would this be an unpardonable sin against the Order of
Schnell?
>>> Edited by derestrictor on Tuesday 30th March 11:59
Irritated by the lack of double tonnage and aware of the existence of realistically achievable and suitable whallop to there achieve, I made the foolish mistake of talking to my local fettler.
Internally, the options are purest Domster: a complete roll cage with the option of subtle trim coverage to give it that integrated RUF feel; obviously that means bye-bye to the rear seats and hello to yet further automotive liposuction; and of course, the carpet retrim can be done with an oh-so finer woven hemp.
But where it counts, out back, things look exceptionally moist...
The process involves effectively losing the car for an unholy period of time (which I'm not sure I could bear) but it's return would yield over 550 bhp /800 Nm Torque and a fair guarantee of a comfortable excess beyond the holy trinity of hyper car entry velocities (one of the speeds mentioned is pant-wettingly ludicrous...)
The cylinder heads are reworked to take twin spark plugs, a twin spark diss system is installed, larger exhaust valves employed, less limp-wristed pistons from Odin's own parts bin, not to mention something loin-cloth unfriendly called flame trap base gaskets; some race spec conrods and non-short-arsed cams (this'd be the third batch) get chucked in, whilst some chap called Heinz in Landau replaces the ECU prog for something to cope with the twin sparks, higher boost and fuel pressure.
Finally a GT2 motorsport intercooler gets bolted on but at least I already have the uprated clutch so I think Mr.H can cancel his ermine-shod slipperettes.
The wierd thing is that whilst this seems a perfectly logical thing to do, I was simultaneoulsy mulling the concept of a nice spring return to the simple and relatively inexpensive purity of a supple wee Elsie Mk1, what with warmer weather and the freshly scented waft of a post-rush hour evening's contemplation nudging the conscience.
Would this be an unpardonable sin against the Order of
Schnell?
>>> Edited by derestrictor on Tuesday 30th March 11:59
Tough one.
Making the quickest and best sounding 993TT in captivity faster and better sounding or buying a scale model of said car...
Not that tough at all really.
Send the ubershcnellerbeetle to der faderland, buy an elise for the time being and sell it again when the beetle returns.
Weiner!
Making the quickest and best sounding 993TT in captivity faster and better sounding or buying a scale model of said car...
Not that tough at all really.
Send the ubershcnellerbeetle to der faderland, buy an elise for the time being and sell it again when the beetle returns.
Weiner!
DeR, old mate,,this post took a little longer arriving than I anticipated 
A difficult call you can spend a lot of money, for the marginal improvement in bhp, but will that be enough?
The major concern is aerodynamics in your quest for the big 2 followed by the double zeros!
Having been fortunate & honoured to take the helm of your car in it's current form I was stunned by it's performance, Brunters due to it's size humbles large bhp cars,now back on my usual A & B roads my usable 300bhp doesn't seem as inadequate.
You may end up with a real beast that offers no real improvement over it's current form on the road for a massive hole in the state coffers.
In terms of cost effectivenes (do you care) it may be a nightmare, a 996 X50 with a decent remap may be what you are looking for to get to 200mph...great, once you have done that you could be bored with the car in relation to the feedback a 993TT offers.
There is currently a fully ruf converted '98 993TT (lhd) for sale on topmarques for £59,950...I am also aware of a low mileage rhd car for similar money....I really think both come cheaper.
In closing Elise is fun,,but if you want the kicks try a caterham first...it should offer the level of excitement you have become accustomed to
A difficult call you can spend a lot of money, for the marginal improvement in bhp, but will that be enough?
The major concern is aerodynamics in your quest for the big 2 followed by the double zeros!
Having been fortunate & honoured to take the helm of your car in it's current form I was stunned by it's performance, Brunters due to it's size humbles large bhp cars,now back on my usual A & B roads my usable 300bhp doesn't seem as inadequate.
You may end up with a real beast that offers no real improvement over it's current form on the road for a massive hole in the state coffers.
In terms of cost effectivenes (do you care) it may be a nightmare, a 996 X50 with a decent remap may be what you are looking for to get to 200mph...great, once you have done that you could be bored with the car in relation to the feedback a 993TT offers.
There is currently a fully ruf converted '98 993TT (lhd) for sale on topmarques for £59,950...I am also aware of a low mileage rhd car for similar money....I really think both come cheaper.
In closing Elise is fun,,but if you want the kicks try a caterham first...it should offer the level of excitement you have become accustomed to
Isn't there a crossover point on the graph of speed improvement when the car becomes a track-day special and no longer fit for the vagaries of public roads? I'm out of my depth here, never having owned that kind of 'special', but I'd hate to be in a position where my pride and joy could only be experienced on a track.
Assuming you've got the bug (and the dosh), perhaps the answer is to go for the burn and get something less blistering for the other 90% of your driving time?
That said, the various modifications you mention sound wonderful - I've had the hots for a Gemballa 700 bhp ever since I saw the pictures, but have to confess that the thought of taking it on the road scares the pants off me!
Assuming you've got the bug (and the dosh), perhaps the answer is to go for the burn and get something less blistering for the other 90% of your driving time?
That said, the various modifications you mention sound wonderful - I've had the hots for a Gemballa 700 bhp ever since I saw the pictures, but have to confess that the thought of taking it on the road scares the pants off me!
That phrase, in itself, provides the answer I think. Tarka makes a good point,,I think I read maybe on here about that Turbo charged blue GT3 that william loughran had for sale for some time. It looked a relative bargain considering the outlay by the original owner.
I was under the impression that it was retuned by one buyer as the thing was too impractical to drive on the road.
I was under the impression that it was retuned by one buyer as the thing was too impractical to drive on the road.
One relatively cheap way to free up some extra BHP is to remove the front dif and associated wastage...
My T2 records 310bhp at the wheels at G-Force, which is exactly the same as a 996tt (again at the wheels). However, I only record 375bhp at the flywheel, verse 420bhp of the 996tt.
I gain a lot of enjoyment from modifying through the anticipation of the vehicles return, and consequently the stepwise improvement in performance. Something you can't buy on Master Card, or so they say...
Your biggest problem is probably aero dynamics if you are striving for the double-ton at brunters. I'm sure if you had more room, you'd probably already be pretty close ...
My T2 records 310bhp at the wheels at G-Force, which is exactly the same as a 996tt (again at the wheels). However, I only record 375bhp at the flywheel, verse 420bhp of the 996tt.
I gain a lot of enjoyment from modifying through the anticipation of the vehicles return, and consequently the stepwise improvement in performance. Something you can't buy on Master Card, or so they say...
Your biggest problem is probably aero dynamics if you are striving for the double-ton at brunters. I'm sure if you had more room, you'd probably already be pretty close ...
Bruntingthorpe has a way of humbling the most potent of vehicles. To keep accelerating strongly down the two mile straight - well - its not something that seriously tests the overall package of the car.
My Boxster S seriously ran out of puff in a way your own amazing steed did not.
And yes I admit to a hankering for vast quantities of additional power.
But might it come at the expense of losing the overall package of what the car is? On the road or on a twistier track then the sheer brute force aspect of the car loses some of the importance that Brunters, somewhat artifically, assigns to it.
In short: Why not keep the Porsche for blasting and get a second-hand Elise as well for some B-road and on-track hoonery...
My Boxster S seriously ran out of puff in a way your own amazing steed did not.
And yes I admit to a hankering for vast quantities of additional power.
But might it come at the expense of losing the overall package of what the car is? On the road or on a twistier track then the sheer brute force aspect of the car loses some of the importance that Brunters, somewhat artifically, assigns to it.
In short: Why not keep the Porsche for blasting and get a second-hand Elise as well for some B-road and on-track hoonery...
Leave Beetlespurter alone. 
As mentioned before, aerodynamics are your real problem when trying to achieve the double ton. You really need to buy an additional car, now stop
ing about and buy a McLaren.
Alternatively buy a used 996GT2, ECU remap, loud exhaust etc taking the car to perhaps about 550bhp+ and maybe a longer sixth gear to reach the double ton if necessary. You'll need to swap the brake discs to steels on the GT2 for this sort of driving though. Get the double ton obsession out of your system, sell the GT2 and then get back to driving the iconic beetlespurter ON THE ROADS, where YOU will be quicker than driving the GT2.
DAZ
As mentioned before, aerodynamics are your real problem when trying to achieve the double ton. You really need to buy an additional car, now stop
ing about and buy a McLaren. Alternatively buy a used 996GT2, ECU remap, loud exhaust etc taking the car to perhaps about 550bhp+ and maybe a longer sixth gear to reach the double ton if necessary. You'll need to swap the brake discs to steels on the GT2 for this sort of driving though. Get the double ton obsession out of your system, sell the GT2 and then get back to driving the iconic beetlespurter ON THE ROADS, where YOU will be quicker than driving the GT2.
DAZ
Difficult question.
DeR, would you ever seriously consider a 996-derived uber-motor? I know you described Adam's Ruf as "The Best Car in the World", and at the end of the day, it's a (very) modified 996.
And at the end of the day, it is a much more slippery shape than the 993.
Has eveyone noticed that 996 turbos are coming down in price day by day! Check out the OPC website ads. We are talking mid-60K for a RHD fully warrantied car.
So whilst trawling those 996 turbo ads, I looked out for X50 versions. If I'm not mistaken, there is an X50 in silver (manual) at Sutton Coldfield's OPC for 75 grand.....then knock a couple of grand off for your discount......hmmmmmmmm.
I reckon it would be easy to tweek that baby to well over 500 bhp, and in the process create a 200 mph car for not TOO much wedge.
Just don't forget to put a Tubi (or similar) exhaust on the thing.
DeR, would you ever seriously consider a 996-derived uber-motor? I know you described Adam's Ruf as "The Best Car in the World", and at the end of the day, it's a (very) modified 996.
And at the end of the day, it is a much more slippery shape than the 993.
Has eveyone noticed that 996 turbos are coming down in price day by day! Check out the OPC website ads. We are talking mid-60K for a RHD fully warrantied car.
So whilst trawling those 996 turbo ads, I looked out for X50 versions. If I'm not mistaken, there is an X50 in silver (manual) at Sutton Coldfield's OPC for 75 grand.....then knock a couple of grand off for your discount......hmmmmmmmm.
I reckon it would be easy to tweek that baby to well over 500 bhp, and in the process create a 200 mph car for not TOO much wedge.
Just don't forget to put a Tubi (or similar) exhaust on the thing.
Well said Daz.
I originally advised Simon to get a taller sixth gear fitted because (aerodynamics aside) the thing pulls like a bastard. If the sixth gear is taller then the engine will be further back on the torque curve (and power curve) at the same speed which will hopefully give a better top end grunt.
But hey! WTF do I know. Except how to knock out Chas and Dave's seminal "Down to Margate" on a pair of spoons
I originally advised Simon to get a taller sixth gear fitted because (aerodynamics aside) the thing pulls like a bastard. If the sixth gear is taller then the engine will be further back on the torque curve (and power curve) at the same speed which will hopefully give a better top end grunt.
But hey! WTF do I know. Except how to knock out Chas and Dave's seminal "Down to Margate" on a pair of spoons
GregE240 said:
Well said Daz.
I originally advised Simon to get a taller sixth gear fitted because (aerodynamics aside) the thing pulls like a bastard. If the sixth gear is taller then the engine will be further back on the torque curve (and power curve) at the same speed which will hopefully give a better top end grunt.
But hey! WTF do I know. Except how to knock out Chas and Dave's seminal "Down to Margate" on a pair of spoons
Difficult if you have too tall a top gear you can end up slowing up as you change into 6th, particularly as you would have the turbos off boost.. also have to take into account length of straight at Brunters. It is like tailor making a car to do one specific task.
Plotloss said:
The boy Daz does speak a modicum of sense it has to be said...
I'm afraid common sense has been conspicuous by it's abscence for many a year round here!
Thing is, I cannot deny being completely and illogically smitten with the melted cheese aka the 993 and whilst it is technically old hat next to the current crop I just adore the overall ensemble: that it can be intensified seems like 'a no brainer.'
Regarding driveability, the T9 boys are aware of the issue and I have experienced the incarnation to which I refer; Phil H reckons it's absolutely as tractable as the current set up except that when the torch is lit, we're into the realms of Frank Whittle versus The Montgoflier Bros and Frankie's packing the Magnum .357, as it were...
Having just come off the phone to Alan at T9, it seems the project is more bespoke than I'd imagined; a veriatble cornucopia of black art tweakage and knowing that other examples are out there (all be they few) and putting it down well, steels the confidence.
The Gregorian ratio shuffle does seem desirable despite the theoretical possibilities of grunt slippage as Paul has suggested but such is the wet kipper across face effect that it hardly matters; the last car has apparently recorded an astonishing 580 bhp although it is acknowledged this is largely related to atmospherics.
Oh bollocks, I'll just see how the cookie crumbleth. The concept of a Kramer-sized air cooler lurking around continues to amass an increasingly mindless appeal and, er, speed matters?
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