Tuscan S brake upgrades?

[ehasler]

Has anyone upgraded the brakes on a Tuscan S, and if so, what did you do?

[satman]

Hi Ed. I think you have the biggest discs at the moment on yours, same as my Redrose, which are 322mm fronts and 298mm rears. (non S/Redrose are 291/282). Braided hoses, if not fitted as standard (sorry dont know if they are) would help, as would an upgrade in brake fluid.

With my Cerbera, the upgrade to 335mm AP front discs was possible because it had Bell discs, which the Tuscan does not. I dont know if the Tuscan uses the same hub as the Cerbera, but maybe its possible to get hold of some later Bell type discs from a Cerbera, upgrade to 335mm AP grooved discs, and convert the Tuscan?

[1timeloser]

What are you finding lacking (if at all) in the S braking set up? Personnaly I have found them stupendous.... excellent feel and very little fade.

[ehasler]

I'm not really finding it lacking at all to be honest, although the pedal did start to go soft after a good hard run down a mountain recently, and so I'll definitely be looking to upgrade the fluid.

I'm more curious really, as mine is due for a set of discs and pads all round fairly soon, and I figured that if there was a better option than standard, I'd go for that, however it sounds like fluid and possibly braided hoses are all that I can do, which will save me a few quid

[trackcar]

You can go to the Satman discs if you have alloy bells at the same time, they're only 330mm not 335mm though, but far higher quality than the OE discs and grooved not drilled so withstand the heat far better

Edited by trackcar on Thursday 3rd January 14:47

[ehasler]

Sounds interesting! What sort of cost would I be looking at, including the bells, and braided hoses? Would I also need to change the calipers too, or is the increase in diameter small enough not to require this?

Edited by ehasler on Thursday 3rd January 14:59

[Basil Brush]

I'd recommend upgrading the pads even if you stick with the standard discs. I've got Ferodo DS2500s on mine and I really like them, although I think Jools at TCS is a Mintex fan, along with many others.

[tuscan_al]

Apm showed me some lovely AP 6 pots that fit the early tuscans straight on, and allow a thicker disc and a larger pad for more friction contact, plue they look

[Whitey]

Factory Red Rose cars had the separate alloy bells. Tuscan S cars had the one piece discs. A lot of RR cars would now have the Tuscan S discs as dealers could not source replacement discs through official channels and just used the S discs.

[Steve_T]

Whitey, a major factor in replacement is the cost. One piece discs are £140 each, the bell and rotor version was more like £300 a side (ex VAT I think). I'd anticipate that, like the Cerb, the bolt pattern for the bell on the Tusc S is standard AP fitment, but the rotor is not a standard AP thickness or diameter. You can buy 330mm AP rotors and a bolt kit from someone like say BG developments and just shim the caliper out 4mm (TVR's rotors are 322mm for the Cerb/Tusc S) and you're off and going.

TVR initially used AP CP5200 4 pot calipers, which can take a max 330mm diameter disc and have 152mm between the mounting centres. AP produces 6 pot calipers with the same mounting centres which can take 355 and 362mm discs. TVR later used CP6600s which have different mounting centres (130mm) and I'm not aware if there is a 6 pot with this fitment.

Steve.

[jellison]

Steve_T said:

Whitey, a major factor in replacement is the cost. One piece discs are £140 each, the bell and rotor version was more like £300 a side (ex VAT I think). I'd anticipate that, like the Cerb, the bolt pattern for the bell on the Tusc S is standard AP fitment, but the rotor is not a standard AP thickness or diameter. You can buy 330mm AP rotors and a bolt kit from someone like say BG developments and just shim the caliper out 4mm (TVR's rotors are 322mm for the Cerb/Tusc S) and you're off and going.

TVR initially used AP CP5200 4 pot calipers, which can take a max 330mm diameter disc and have 152mm between the mounting centres. AP produces 6 pot calipers with the same mounting centres which can take 355 and 362mm discs. TVR later used CP6600s which have different mounting centres (130mm) and I'm not aware if there is a 6 pot with this fitment.

Steve.

The CP6600 vs the Earlier 5200 might be something to do with the switch to a solid (Cheap and Heavy all in one Disc). When the time comes Whitey - there is alway a way to retain the alloy bell - don't settle for the std later stuff.

(Mine are the later 6600 caliper with disc and alloy bell like the RR cars).

[Steve_T]

Worst case you get a bell made for you. BG estimated that a bell with an 8" diameter bolt pattern, which would have been required for the discs larger than 330mm, would be £70-90 a side. One with the 7" diameter bolt pattern ought to be a bit less. Never realised the bell and rotor saved 2kg a side!

Steve.

Edited by Steve_T on Friday 4th January 10:41

[1timeloser]

trackcar said:

You can go to the Satman discs if you have alloy bells at the same time, they're only 330mm not 335mm though, but far higher quality than the OE discs and grooved not drilled so withstand the heat far better

Edited by trackcar on Thursday 3rd January 14:47

Interesting, how can one procure the alloy bells and satman rotors?

[jellison]

I could not believe how light the 6600's wa campared to the Sh8t that that cam as std on a Chim!

CP5500 even lighter again! (Race only - no dust covers).

[ehasler]

Interesting stuff guys - thanks!

So, assuming I have the CP6600 caliper (mines a 2003 Tuscan S, with one-piece discs), it looks like my best option is to go for alloy bell + 330mm rotor, plus upgraded pads?

AP only do 330mm rotors in 28 or 32mm thickness, and the CP6600s take 30mm discs - I assume it's straightforward to fit a spacer to the caliper to enable the 32mm discs to fit?

Edited by ehasler on Friday 4th January 10:58

[Tusc_si]

Hi guys I'm still new to my Tuscan and one of the changes i want to make is to upgrade it to a S/RR spec with alloy bells etc.

Mine is a 2000 standard 4.0 do either of you know if it also will have the AP CP5200's which i assume would take the 330mm discs on a alloy bell?

Si

[jellison]

The 5200 are longer and thinner with Rib's! Like in Whiteys Pic.

6600 - Phatter and shorter with no Ribs - like mine

[ehasler]

5200
6600

Another question - it doesn't look like you can easily swap the 6600 for a 6-pot caliper, however would it be possible to upgrade the 5200 to the 6-pot CP5570? It looks like it would be a straight swap, and I assume would be worth doing?

Edited by ehasler on Friday 4th January 11:12

[VARLEYHYD]

Tuscan S Sagaris CP6600D55 caliper drawing here if it helps (max disc width 30mm)

http://www.varleyhyd.com/images/SagarisAPracingCal...

G

[Tusc_si]

jellison said:

The 5200 are longer and thinner with Rib's! Like in Whiteys Pic.

6600 - Phatter and shorter with no Ribs - like mine

They would be the later 6600's then and reading above i asume they will take 330 discs.