BBC2 anti fake petrol show
Discussion
did anyone see last nights prpaganda on fake petrol.
they reckon upto 20% of drivers are now using farm deisel or kerosene (neat?!) to power the trucks and cars.
the propaganda machine of the bbc machine was on full tilt, apparrently the is costs the TAXPAYER 6 million ; no I would say it costs the government in lost revenue to pay immigrants for houses.
oh and fuel industries said they are loosing sales by 15%, err how? they still make red deisel as well, so its still profit to them isnt it?
until the government stop screwing us and delivery industry (truckers) way more than the rest of europe, to NOT spend it on roads, then I have no sympathy.
but to watch the show, was trying to blame everyone but the government for a monopoly on fuel prices.. makes me mad
they reckon upto 20% of drivers are now using farm deisel or kerosene (neat?!) to power the trucks and cars.
the propaganda machine of the bbc machine was on full tilt, apparrently the is costs the TAXPAYER 6 million ; no I would say it costs the government in lost revenue to pay immigrants for houses.
oh and fuel industries said they are loosing sales by 15%, err how? they still make red deisel as well, so its still profit to them isnt it?
until the government stop screwing us and delivery industry (truckers) way more than the rest of europe, to NOT spend it on roads, then I have no sympathy.
but to watch the show, was trying to blame everyone but the government for a monopoly on fuel prices.. makes me mad
Yeah i saw it, what a load of sh*te once again from the B(lair)BC.
Particularly liked the bit about the black market being sustained because of a few motorists willing to cheat the system. spin spin spin.
The government have themselves created the market and the ensuing situation by humping up duty on fuel and making it worthwhile to sell it illegally.
Particularly liked the bit about the black market being sustained because of a few motorists willing to cheat the system. spin spin spin.
The government have themselves created the market and the ensuing situation by humping up duty on fuel and making it worthwhile to sell it illegally.
Yep. Saw the show. Yet more proof that the BBC are simply the propoganda arm of this lying, theiving, middle-class hating bunch of low-lifes who somehow seem to have control of my beloved country.
But that aside.
Whilst loony duties are in place then there is obviously going to be a motivation for people to circumvent them. Booze. Cigarettes. and so on.
If they want to tackle the crime - make it unprofitable. Make the legal fuel more competetively priced. No-one is going to buy dodgy diesel if its only 2p a litre cheaper - why risk prosecution? 30p a litre cheaper and there's your motivation.
Simply bleating about how "bad" the people are who do this isn't going to change a thing.
Did you note how they tried (partially successfully) to link red-diesel filterers with Terrorism? Sure - in NI there'll be a connection. But over here??? I'll bet they'd have tried to associate fuel-tax evading with fcuking child-murder if they thought the public would fall for it.
I was incensed by the program - which took a serious problem and made both the program makers and the forces of law and order look like fascists - instead of painting a more balanced view that might have persuaded the thinking public to view this form of lawbreaking as a bad thing.
Frankly - I think it will encourage otherwise honest people to vote with their chequebooks and buy cheap (and not legal) fuel.
But that aside.
Whilst loony duties are in place then there is obviously going to be a motivation for people to circumvent them. Booze. Cigarettes. and so on.
If they want to tackle the crime - make it unprofitable. Make the legal fuel more competetively priced. No-one is going to buy dodgy diesel if its only 2p a litre cheaper - why risk prosecution? 30p a litre cheaper and there's your motivation.
Simply bleating about how "bad" the people are who do this isn't going to change a thing.
Did you note how they tried (partially successfully) to link red-diesel filterers with Terrorism? Sure - in NI there'll be a connection. But over here??? I'll bet they'd have tried to associate fuel-tax evading with fcuking child-murder if they thought the public would fall for it.
I was incensed by the program - which took a serious problem and made both the program makers and the forces of law and order look like fascists - instead of painting a more balanced view that might have persuaded the thinking public to view this form of lawbreaking as a bad thing.
Frankly - I think it will encourage otherwise honest people to vote with their chequebooks and buy cheap (and not legal) fuel.
yup I saw this program too. I was going to raise a thread about it but I was too busy.
It was quite amusing really just gives people ideas though.
I liked the bit with the guy in the scrap yard who basically said if the governments stopped screwing folk then the problem will simply go away. He also said that it was folks way of motoring econically these days.
But seriously though I thought that the MOT centres were supposed to check for evidence of red diesel use in MOTs. Aren't they supposed to check the injectors or summat? I was under the impression that if you even use red diesel once in a car the injectors would stained permantently.
Andy
It was quite amusing really just gives people ideas though.
I liked the bit with the guy in the scrap yard who basically said if the governments stopped screwing folk then the problem will simply go away. He also said that it was folks way of motoring econically these days.
But seriously though I thought that the MOT centres were supposed to check for evidence of red diesel use in MOTs. Aren't they supposed to check the injectors or summat? I was under the impression that if you even use red diesel once in a car the injectors would stained permantently.
Andy
andytk said: I was under the impression that if you even use red diesel once in a car the injectors would stained permantently.
Andy
My understanding is the same. The program did show that the red dye could be chemically removed - providing you with "clean" white diesel.
Did you note they tried to pooh pooh the quality of the diesel in the programme? Considering with minor modifications you can run a Diesel Engine car on Vegetable Oil from the supermarket this seemed rather sour grapes - although I'm sure it isn't as good as purely legit fuel....but all the same.
funkydredd said: Yeah, but compare that against higher income taxes and higher NI contributions and road tolls and what is the figure?
Actually you'll find that in Britain although we have one of the lowest "headline" income tax rates in the EU we are actually one of the higher tax economies as a percentage of GDP.
This is in part due to "stealth" taxes like Employers NI and duties on various goods like fuel. We have very few "breaks" we are allowed to offset against tax - I understand from European friends that they are able to offset many more items against tax than we can.
You have to collect tax somehow - don't get me wrong. But don't think we're a lower tax economy than other EU countries because its not true. Remember this when voting...all Governments must collect tax to pay for society. They only vary in how much tax they raise and what section of society they get it from.
Tax gathering is a political tool, remember. If you are voted in by a particular group it pays to reduce their tax burden and increase the tax burden of the group that didn't vote for you. Our current lot aren't the only Government who've done this, mind.
Its just that this time I'm the one who pays. F*** 'em.
M@H said: the other night they were on about the smuggled cigarette industry
"which is costing the "country" XX million..." "..enough to build 7 new hospitals"
This argument has always confounded me. See below:
1. The govt want to stop us social pariahs smoking for the benefit of our health.
2. That being the case, good old Gordon should be expecting tax revenues to fall from tobacco.
3. When tax revenue from tobacco duty falls, he'll have to either put up with collecting less, or tax something else.
Unfortunately for Gordon, of course, the wonderful EU now allows us to bring back what we like for our own personal consumption (AND THAT'S ANOTHER THING - THERE ARE NO F
KING LIMITS - MORE GOVERNMENT MISINFORMATION) (:rant mode off: ) so, not only are we getting cheaper baccy, but also still living and daring to use the NHS we've been paying into all our working lives Life's a sh
it for a Chancellor, sometimes, ain't it? Reduce the duty on tobacco, alcohol and fuel to European levels and put VAT on children's clothes, that what I say ...
Don said:
Actually you'll find that in Britain although we have one of the lowest "headline" income tax rates in the EU we are actually one of the higher tax economies as a percentage of GDP.
Interesting, that is.
I often wondered how high the total cost of citizenship (->taxes in whole) actually is. Maybe it makes sense to compare how many taxes the governmenst raise per inhabitant per year?
I start with Germany: soureced the facts from www.destatis.de :
Public overall budget (2000): €975,581,000,000
Inhabitants (2000/IV): 82,253,000
makes €11,861 per inhabitant
Would be intersting to compare that with data from other European countries. Dunno what the 'overall budget' comprises, but where else should the money come from other than taxes?
Don and Bodo, I would rather check the figures like yourselves. If I get the chance I will try to see if I can. But I certainly won't listen to the propaganda (spouted by Prats like 'Mr Angry - Voice of the People or whatever that d**kheads name was) that everyone else in the world is living in luxury and us Brits always eat crap. Problem is most people in this country don;t bother reading the full facts, they would rather just go straight to the Editors Comment page in the The Sun, Daily Star etc and believe it.
If you add up all the taxes you pay it would be a rather large percentage of your total income. For a start you have 40% on the higher amount, then you have NI on top, then add on 17.5% vat on everything you buy - food etc. That's already added up to over 60% of your income gone. Obviously all the other stealth taxes on your life inflate this figure even higher. By the time you've taken all things into account (inheritance tax etc etc...) I wouldn't be suprised if 75% of all your cash goes down the tubes in tax. And look at the state of everything around us! This waste of money is why I'm going freelance instead of employed next year. My girlfriend's an accountant and will get my tax bill down to sod all! I'll let you lot pay for our shite public transport, shite infastructure, shite hospitals, immigrants and dhs scroates. I'll be free!
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