RE: Fuel Boycott
Monday 27th January 2003
Fuel Boycott
Nonsense chain mail or the beginning of something big?
Discussion
Bit of a waste of time this. I don't buy petrol from esso or bp. They are too bloody expensive, so as far as I am concerned this won't have any effect.
Whoever is organising this needs to find a more blanket way of making this very valid point.
Esso always aim to match the lowest price in the area. It's true for our local Esso garage at least.
OK, humour me a little bit here...
Let's say that everyone in the UK boycotts Esso and BP garages, and buys their petrol at Shell, Texaco, Sainsbury, whatever. The argument runs that when the action starts hitting those two companies in the pocket, they'll be forced to reduce their prices. So let's say they do.
Now, one of three things probably happens here. One, people start buying their petrol at BP and Esso again because it's now cheaper. The other companies have not had to do the same thing so are still selling at the higher price, so in no time at all, BP and Esso miraculously put their prices back to where they started from, nothing has really changed and no-one's got much in the way of cheap fuel, except for a couple of weeks.
Secondly, everyone continues (somehow) to ignore the cheaper petrol and keeps on buying at Shell, Texaco, etc. Well, if these guys think that the entire populace is happy to carry on paying their inflated prices (which by the evidence would be correct), then they're not going to reduce their forecourt price in line with BP and Esso, are they? APPARENTLY (so they would say) the UK is happy to pay the going rate.
So Esso and BP go out of business because no-one buys their petrol, which reduces the competition in the marketplace, and then there's even MORE likelihood that the remaining players will continue to operate this complex price-fixing cartel, but with the prices going even higher than they are now!!!!!!!
Thirdly, when the gruesome twosome drop their prices, EVERYONE switches to them (by pre-arranged plan, of course), and stops buying from the others, to try and force their prices down in line. It only takes BP and Essp a few seconds to work out that, all of a sudden, it's THEIR turn to supply the entire country with fuel, and back up goes their prices too.
The whole thing is a great idea in theory, but I just don't see it working out, at least not in the long term. As someone else has already mentioned, the majority of the cost of fuel is tax anyway, so if you want to do something serious about it, change the government!
Let's say that everyone in the UK boycotts Esso and BP garages, and buys their petrol at Shell, Texaco, Sainsbury, whatever. The argument runs that when the action starts hitting those two companies in the pocket, they'll be forced to reduce their prices. So let's say they do.
Now, one of three things probably happens here. One, people start buying their petrol at BP and Esso again because it's now cheaper. The other companies have not had to do the same thing so are still selling at the higher price, so in no time at all, BP and Esso miraculously put their prices back to where they started from, nothing has really changed and no-one's got much in the way of cheap fuel, except for a couple of weeks.
Secondly, everyone continues (somehow) to ignore the cheaper petrol and keeps on buying at Shell, Texaco, etc. Well, if these guys think that the entire populace is happy to carry on paying their inflated prices (which by the evidence would be correct), then they're not going to reduce their forecourt price in line with BP and Esso, are they? APPARENTLY (so they would say) the UK is happy to pay the going rate.
So Esso and BP go out of business because no-one buys their petrol, which reduces the competition in the marketplace, and then there's even MORE likelihood that the remaining players will continue to operate this complex price-fixing cartel, but with the prices going even higher than they are now!!!!!!!
Thirdly, when the gruesome twosome drop their prices, EVERYONE switches to them (by pre-arranged plan, of course), and stops buying from the others, to try and force their prices down in line. It only takes BP and Essp a few seconds to work out that, all of a sudden, it's THEIR turn to supply the entire country with fuel, and back up goes their prices too.
The whole thing is a great idea in theory, but I just don't see it working out, at least not in the long term. As someone else has already mentioned, the majority of the cost of fuel is tax anyway, so if you want to do something serious about it, change the government!
trouble is, the fuel companies (BP or whoever) can't reduce their prices that much... hardly any of the cost is actually for the petrol.. and an even smaller part of that really small part is their profit margin.... so they just don't have much to play with...
It's the government that needs to get it... I think the last protests were the best way.. block off the depots etc.
this time though, we need proper spokesmen and a bit of organisation and resolution to carry it on as long as possible, and make sure blair can't dismiss it as a bunch of yobs or whatever he tried last time..
It's the government that needs to get it... I think the last protests were the best way.. block off the depots etc.
this time though, we need proper spokesmen and a bit of organisation and resolution to carry it on as long as possible, and make sure blair can't dismiss it as a bunch of yobs or whatever he tried last time..
But I thought there was an Esso boycott!
www.stopesso.com/
They spent a day in the rain outside the one in Romsey!
www.stopesso.com/
They spent a day in the rain outside the one in Romsey!
I got this off the BBC news site
If a litre of petrol costs 85p then 21.7p will be the production/retailing costs which INCLUDES the profit margin, which acording to the oil companies, is wafer thin.
The rest is tax. 50.8p is fixed fuel duty and in this case 12.5p VAT on top of all of that.
Now the 50.8p fuel duty is fixed. This doesn't change regardless of oil price.
At the moment the price for a litre of Unleaded is about 73p litre.
The reason its cheaper is that the (crude) oil prices must've been higher when that example was made up.
It's worth noting that the more the basic cost is for fuel the more we end up paying in VAT. It may not be much but it soon adds up.
So if there was no tax at all on fuel we'd be paying somewhere around 21p/litre for petrol.
As for this campane the idea isn't to hurt the oil companies but it is to take away their revenue stream. The oil company will then exert pressure on the government to do something, like reduce fuel tax.
To be honest I don't see it working mainly due to British apathy. It might work in France but not here.
Also as an interesting point all of the UK's petrol comes from three main refineries as I understand. Grangemouth is Scotlands and there are two in England.
All the Shell optimax in Scotland comes form south of the border.
I'm under the impression that most petrol consumed in Scotland regardless of the petrol station you buy it from is refined at BP grangemouth. So even if you chose not to buy it a BP garage then you'd end up buying from a Texaco garage and it'd be the same stuff.
Of course I could be wrong on this. It wouldn't be the first time
So the only way is to take the fight to them and blockade the refineries. Then come election time ensure that this shower of fools are voted out in favour of someone who understands that they have to reduce fuel tax ASAP to avoid a repeat performance.
Andy
If a litre of petrol costs 85p then 21.7p will be the production/retailing costs which INCLUDES the profit margin, which acording to the oil companies, is wafer thin.
The rest is tax. 50.8p is fixed fuel duty and in this case 12.5p VAT on top of all of that.
Now the 50.8p fuel duty is fixed. This doesn't change regardless of oil price.
At the moment the price for a litre of Unleaded is about 73p litre.
The reason its cheaper is that the (crude) oil prices must've been higher when that example was made up.
It's worth noting that the more the basic cost is for fuel the more we end up paying in VAT. It may not be much but it soon adds up.
So if there was no tax at all on fuel we'd be paying somewhere around 21p/litre for petrol.
As for this campane the idea isn't to hurt the oil companies but it is to take away their revenue stream. The oil company will then exert pressure on the government to do something, like reduce fuel tax.
To be honest I don't see it working mainly due to British apathy. It might work in France but not here.
Also as an interesting point all of the UK's petrol comes from three main refineries as I understand. Grangemouth is Scotlands and there are two in England.
All the Shell optimax in Scotland comes form south of the border.
I'm under the impression that most petrol consumed in Scotland regardless of the petrol station you buy it from is refined at BP grangemouth. So even if you chose not to buy it a BP garage then you'd end up buying from a Texaco garage and it'd be the same stuff.
Of course I could be wrong on this. It wouldn't be the first time
So the only way is to take the fight to them and blockade the refineries. Then come election time ensure that this shower of fools are voted out in favour of someone who understands that they have to reduce fuel tax ASAP to avoid a repeat performance.
Andy
Buycotting petrol stations will never make the industry stand up to the government.
Just before the last election the government told the oil companies to keep their prices low (despite the tax!!!) or risk a windfall tax on their upstream business.
They threatned to make this windfall tax so high that the losses to each company could never be recovered by raised forecourt prices, and believe me that wouldn't take much.
Threats and blackmail? That'll be New Labour...
Just before the last election the government told the oil companies to keep their prices low (despite the tax!!!) or risk a windfall tax on their upstream business.
They threatned to make this windfall tax so high that the losses to each company could never be recovered by raised forecourt prices, and believe me that wouldn't take much.
Threats and blackmail? That'll be New Labour...
the only way i think to bring down fuel prices is to show the public how much the fuel really costs. the international oil, petrol and diesel prices are available each day in Lloyd's List which is a shipping and energy daily newspaper. oil is selling at about $35 per barrel which is pretty high but the products are still only selling at about 18 p per litre from the refinery. if these daily prices were made available to the public i think the government would be under a lot of pressure.
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