Up to 2 years for being on the phone!!!
Discussion
Just seen the latest news regarding mobiles while driving,fair enough people on them while driving is against the law as we all know but the up to 2 years bird is a bit heavy handed in my opinion specially in these times when you see people getting less for beating up old ladies and the likes, what do you guys and gals think?
My rant is mainly the sentence, one of our local rebels stole a car after beating up the owner, dragging him from the car then proceeded to drive like a lunatic up the kerbs then planted the car into a shop front,sentence-nil £75.00 for damages to the owners teeth payable at £1 a week,wheres the justice in that?
My rant is mainly the sentence, one of our local rebels stole a car after beating up the owner, dragging him from the car then proceeded to drive like a lunatic up the kerbs then planted the car into a shop front,sentence-nil £75.00 for damages to the owners teeth payable at £1 a week,wheres the justice in that?
I'm not against harsh sentences for folks whose driving is impaired whilest they are on the phone/sat-nav/etc. I'm not going to argue whether these sentences are proportional to those for other offences or not.
What really concerns me is this:
What really concerns me is this:
said:
The guidelines could also see motorists in England and Wales who cause death on the roads facing life imprisonment.
It may have been taken out of context - however if someone wants to commit suicide, or a young child who doesn't know better, runs out in front of you: sometimes there is nothing you can do. Period. ft500 said:
Just seen the latest news regarding mobiles while driving,fair enough people on them while driving is against the law as we all know but the up to 2 years bird is a bit heavy handed in my opinion specially in these times when you see people getting less for beating up old ladies and the likes, what do you guys and gals think?
My rant is mainly the sentence, one of our local rebels stole a car after beating up the owner, dragging him from the car then proceeded to drive like a lunatic up the kerbs then planted the car into a shop front,sentence-nil £75.00 for damages to the owners teeth payable at £1 a week,wheres the justice in that?
They will do no good untill the bring back hanging.Oh and the cat & nine tails too.My rant is mainly the sentence, one of our local rebels stole a car after beating up the owner, dragging him from the car then proceeded to drive like a lunatic up the kerbs then planted the car into a shop front,sentence-nil £75.00 for damages to the owners teeth payable at £1 a week,wheres the justice in that?
It's not 2 years for being on the phone, it's up to 2 years for dangerous driving caused by being on the phone, ie by someone deliberately doing something distracting which stops them paying due care and attention and then driving dangerously as a result. Which is quite a different matter, although I agree that the assault, theft and criminal damage offence the OP mentions should have received a far stiffer sentence.
Don't forget that dangerous driving sometimes kills people. I have always thought that dangerous driving caused by an individual's deliberate and inexcusable actions (such as driving when tired or while texting, for example) should be treated harshly irrespective of whether an accident is caused - which is often just the luck of the draw. So not causing death by dangerous driving, more "reckless endangerment".
Don't forget that dangerous driving sometimes kills people. I have always thought that dangerous driving caused by an individual's deliberate and inexcusable actions (such as driving when tired or while texting, for example) should be treated harshly irrespective of whether an accident is caused - which is often just the luck of the draw. So not causing death by dangerous driving, more "reckless endangerment".
saxmund said:
It's not 2 years for being on the phone, it's up to 2 years for dangerous driving caused by being on the phone, ie by someone deliberately doing something distracting which stops them paying due care and attention and then driving dangerously as a result. Which is quite a different matter, although I agree that the assault, theft and criminal damage offence the OP mentions should have received a far stiffer sentence.
Don't forget that dangerous driving sometimes kills people. I have always thought that dangerous driving caused by an individual's deliberate and inexcusable actions (such as driving when tired or while texting, for example) should be treated harshly irrespective of whether an accident is caused - which is often just the luck of the draw. So not causing death by dangerous driving, more "reckless endangerment".
SO by your logic having a child in the car would also be an example of reckless endagerment? I fully accept that if I cause an accident any actions I was carrying out in adition to control of the vehicle must be taken into account to determine if I were neglegent in any way and if proved so then I must be guilty of such neglect. If, however no accident occurs the only reason for this new legislation to enable Nanny to micro manage every aspect of my and everyone elses lives. Personally I would like to get rid of this kind of thinking its a mutation too far and removing it from the gene pool can only benefit the human race.Don't forget that dangerous driving sometimes kills people. I have always thought that dangerous driving caused by an individual's deliberate and inexcusable actions (such as driving when tired or while texting, for example) should be treated harshly irrespective of whether an accident is caused - which is often just the luck of the draw. So not causing death by dangerous driving, more "reckless endangerment".
No, I said "deliberate and inexcusable actions". Driving with kids in the car is a normal (and necessary) thing to do, although if for example a small child managed to start physically interfering with the driver I think it would be negligent not to pull over & sort it out.
You can't completely remove all distractions - other passengers, the radio etc - but drivers shouldn't in my view do things that are unnecessary and significantly compromise their ability to concentrate on driving. Using a mobile phone probably isn't too bad, although I wonder why some people find it so necessary. But you see stories of people in the press who have apparently been texting while driving, these people need the book thrown at them.
I don't accept that your driving is only culpable if it actually causes an accident. If by your own deliberate actions you have significantly increased the chances of having an accident, then I think you are equally guilty. For example, there was a controversy about the guy who made himself too tired to drive before setting out to tow a trailer quite a large distance, and caused an accident. He was convicted of death by dangerous driving. My view is that, if the police had happened to stop him before the accident had happened, exactly the same sentence should be available to the courts.
Maybe the issue is driver training. Maybe all HGV, PSV (whatever their called) training should include a section on how to use a hands-free while driving, and there should be courses that other professional drivers can take to ensure they can do so safely. After all we accept that drivers with certain types of advanced training can do things that the rest of us can't - drive heavier vehicles, carry fare paying passengers, break traffic rules in pursuit of criminals - so I don't see why this shouldn't be seen as another trainable skill.
Having once answered my mobile on a motorway and come close to driving into a truck as a result I've never done it again - if I'm expecting a call, I leave the phone on and if it rings I pull over at the next opportunity to answer it. I don't eat and drink at the wheel either, for the same reason, unless I have a passenger who can pass it to me (which makes it a lot easier). I often turn the radio/CD off if I'm havving to concentrate on directions & traffic, for example if driving thorugh an unfamiliar city. But I really don't see why people find the use of a mobile in the car so necessary, what's wrong with checking your voicemail when you arrive? For delivery drivers and a lot of other driving professionals I accept that it is a necessary, and for those we should treat it as a trainable skill.
You can't completely remove all distractions - other passengers, the radio etc - but drivers shouldn't in my view do things that are unnecessary and significantly compromise their ability to concentrate on driving. Using a mobile phone probably isn't too bad, although I wonder why some people find it so necessary. But you see stories of people in the press who have apparently been texting while driving, these people need the book thrown at them.
I don't accept that your driving is only culpable if it actually causes an accident. If by your own deliberate actions you have significantly increased the chances of having an accident, then I think you are equally guilty. For example, there was a controversy about the guy who made himself too tired to drive before setting out to tow a trailer quite a large distance, and caused an accident. He was convicted of death by dangerous driving. My view is that, if the police had happened to stop him before the accident had happened, exactly the same sentence should be available to the courts.
Maybe the issue is driver training. Maybe all HGV, PSV (whatever their called) training should include a section on how to use a hands-free while driving, and there should be courses that other professional drivers can take to ensure they can do so safely. After all we accept that drivers with certain types of advanced training can do things that the rest of us can't - drive heavier vehicles, carry fare paying passengers, break traffic rules in pursuit of criminals - so I don't see why this shouldn't be seen as another trainable skill.
Having once answered my mobile on a motorway and come close to driving into a truck as a result I've never done it again - if I'm expecting a call, I leave the phone on and if it rings I pull over at the next opportunity to answer it. I don't eat and drink at the wheel either, for the same reason, unless I have a passenger who can pass it to me (which makes it a lot easier). I often turn the radio/CD off if I'm havving to concentrate on directions & traffic, for example if driving thorugh an unfamiliar city. But I really don't see why people find the use of a mobile in the car so necessary, what's wrong with checking your voicemail when you arrive? For delivery drivers and a lot of other driving professionals I accept that it is a necessary, and for those we should treat it as a trainable skill.
Edited by saxmund on Monday 24th December 15:21
I suppose at the end of the day the powers to be would like you to travel in your car with passengers in total silence as any conversation aimed at you as the driver would be classed as "taking your attention from the road ahead" ,where will it end,as whilst driving we all adjust the heating/radio/ac and we all chat and sing along to whatever music is on etc,is that in the same bundle?
saxmund said:
No, I said "deliberate and inexcusable actions". Driving with kids in the car is a normal (and necessary) thing to do, although if for example a small child managed to start physically interfering with the driver I think it would be negligent not to pull over & sort it out.
You can't completely remove all distractions - other passengers, the radio etc - but drivers shouldn't in my view do things that are unnecessary and significantly compromise their ability to concentrate on driving. Using a mobile phone probably isn't too bad, although I wonder why some people find it so necessary. But you see stories of people in the press who have apparently been texting while driving, these people need the book thrown at them.
I don't accept that your driving is only culpable if it actually causes an accident. If by your own deliberate actions you have significantly increased the chances of having an accident, then I think you are equally guilty. For example, there was a controversy about the guy who made himself too tired to drive before setting out to tow a trailer quite a large distance, and caused an accident. He was convicted of death by dangerous driving. My view is that, if the police had happened to stop him before the accident had happened, exactly the same sentence should be available to the courts.
Maybe the issue is driver training. Maybe all HGV, PSV (whatever their called) training should include a section on how to use a hands-free while driving, and there should be courses that other professional drivers can take to ensure they can do so safely. After all we accept that drivers with certain types of advanced training can do things that the rest of us can't - drive heavier vehicles, carry fare paying passengers, break traffic rules in pursuit of criminals - so I don't see why this shouldn't be seen as another trainable skill.
Having once answered my mobile on a motorway and come close to driving into a truck as a result I've never done it again - if I'm expecting a call, I leave the phone on and if it rings I pull over at the next opportunity to answer it. I don't eat and drink at the wheel either, for the same reason, unless I have a passenger who can pass it to me (which makes it a lot easier). I often turn the radio/CD off if I'm havving to concentrate on directions & traffic, for example if driving thorugh an unfamiliar city. But I really don't see why people find the use of a mobile in the car so necessary, what's wrong with checking your voicemail when you arrive? For delivery drivers and a lot of other driving professionals I accept that it is a necessary, and for those we should treat it as a trainable skill.
OK you have nearly completed the policy here, however I have to take issue with some of what you said. IF the key is to be to allow only essential distractions then we must immediately ban all car gadgets like stereos, sat nav, on board computers, vehicle condition warning lights etc. Children should be strapped in and gagged. Taxis must be banned as they have text boxes and hand held radios. All drinks holders must be smashed at the next MOT? It all sounds like the kind of thing that bit of vermin Blair would support, because after all its high time every little bit of our lives should be micro managed by the gummint. You can't completely remove all distractions - other passengers, the radio etc - but drivers shouldn't in my view do things that are unnecessary and significantly compromise their ability to concentrate on driving. Using a mobile phone probably isn't too bad, although I wonder why some people find it so necessary. But you see stories of people in the press who have apparently been texting while driving, these people need the book thrown at them.
I don't accept that your driving is only culpable if it actually causes an accident. If by your own deliberate actions you have significantly increased the chances of having an accident, then I think you are equally guilty. For example, there was a controversy about the guy who made himself too tired to drive before setting out to tow a trailer quite a large distance, and caused an accident. He was convicted of death by dangerous driving. My view is that, if the police had happened to stop him before the accident had happened, exactly the same sentence should be available to the courts.
Maybe the issue is driver training. Maybe all HGV, PSV (whatever their called) training should include a section on how to use a hands-free while driving, and there should be courses that other professional drivers can take to ensure they can do so safely. After all we accept that drivers with certain types of advanced training can do things that the rest of us can't - drive heavier vehicles, carry fare paying passengers, break traffic rules in pursuit of criminals - so I don't see why this shouldn't be seen as another trainable skill.
Having once answered my mobile on a motorway and come close to driving into a truck as a result I've never done it again - if I'm expecting a call, I leave the phone on and if it rings I pull over at the next opportunity to answer it. I don't eat and drink at the wheel either, for the same reason, unless I have a passenger who can pass it to me (which makes it a lot easier). I often turn the radio/CD off if I'm havving to concentrate on directions & traffic, for example if driving thorugh an unfamiliar city. But I really don't see why people find the use of a mobile in the car so necessary, what's wrong with checking your voicemail when you arrive? For delivery drivers and a lot of other driving professionals I accept that it is a necessary, and for those we should treat it as a trainable skill.
Edited by saxmund on Monday 24th December 15:21
I think I would prefer to see a few people die every year as a result of people being free to make choices, good or bad, than to have to put up with what will inevitably result civil war for civil liberties. Lets face it if we prioritised life saving measures we would sort out domestic accidents and MRSA then move on to scrapping GMT long before we looked at speed or drink driving or using mobile phones.
Having been carved up by several 'highly skilled' truck drivers who have carried on across my path at roundabouts while chatting on their mobiles, I feel that a short stay off the road while they consider the wisdom of their actions could give us some very clear motorways and A roads in just a few months.
[quote=chrisw2811]Having been carved up by several 'highly skilled' truck drivers who have carried on across my path at roundabouts while chatting on their mobiles, I feel that a short stay off the road while they consider the wisdom of their actions could give us some very clear motorways and A roads in just a few months.[/quote
Dont think it is just the truck drivers we are looking at here its motorists as a whole on the phone so you cant blame the truckies I have seen trucks "carved up" by mindless car drivers also on the phone so you cant pidgeon hole hgv drivers with that statement....
Dont think it is just the truck drivers we are looking at here its motorists as a whole on the phone so you cant blame the truckies I have seen trucks "carved up" by mindless car drivers also on the phone so you cant pidgeon hole hgv drivers with that statement....
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