Wednesday 14th May 2008

Sat Nav Rules On The Way

Lorry drivers could be stopped from using car sat navs

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New rules preventing sat navs from sending lorry drivers down inappropriate routes are being planned.

The proposals are designed to stop hundreds of truckers rat-running through villages and side-streets.

Firms supplying the guidance information could also be forced to include information on weight and height restrictions on electronic maps.

Safety may be improved by preventing drivers from programming the systems while driving.

It is said that thousands of lorry drivers use cheap sat navs designed for cars and frequently get stuck under low bridges.

The Society for the Protection of Buildings has already expressed its dismay at a large number of old structures being destroyed by lost truckers.

A Department for Transport report published yesterday said that the problem lies in the fact that most systems were portable, meaning truck drivers were using routes designed for cars.

One option the DfT has is to introduce a licence system for the devices; however some manufacturers say they would oppose it.

[tegwin]

About time something was done....but the truckers will just ignore the new "rules" and still follow the car routes....



Im having one of those days... but...

[quote]A Department for Transport report published yesterday said that the problem lies in the fact that most systems were portable, meaning truck drivers were using routes designed for cars.[/quote

[Don]

It's bks. People blame the Sat Nav.

It isn't. It's the driver. ALL Sat Navs will redirect you if you don't take a turn. So if you see a fking great sign saying NO HGVs and you still go down it in your HGV just because the Sat Nav says so? You are a tt.

[Mr Whippy]

A sat nav licence

Why not just tell the truckers not to be so stupid in the first place?

Plan their routes? Program into sat nav? Special map data sets that just remove inappropriate road sections?

Not hard. Simple problem, relatively simple solution, government ignorants make problem bigger than it is and want to waste yet MORE of our money with feckin licences!?

Dave

Edited by Mr Whippy on Wednesday 14th May 11:05

[RB Will]

Mr Whippy said:

government ignorants make problem bigger than it is and want to waste yet MORE of our money with feckin licences!?

Dave

Edited by Mr Whippy on Wednesday 14th May 11:05

Surely this would make them money?

[Graham]

RB Will said:

Mr Whippy said:

government ignorants make problem bigger than it is and want to waste yet MORE of our money with feckin licences!?

Dave

Edited by Mr Whippy on Wednesday 14th May 11:05

Surely this would make them money?

<LOL> nope remember this is the government we're talking about it would no doubt cost 5* more to administer the system than it takes in income... which would have to be made up by yet more taxes somewhere else..

[Ravell]

I agree that truck drivers shouldn't completely rely on their satnav to direct them, but the fact is that some/most do and that won't change any time soon.

The idea of adapting satnav maps seems a good one in principle. Although I can't help but wonder how long before the plan is implemened in the most ludicrous longwinded and costly way, the licence system seems to be pointing towards that already!

[Chrisgr31]

Surely if ypou are drivinga truck and ignore signs telling you of low bridges etc then you are driving without due care and attention?

[Don]

Ravell said:

I agree that truck drivers shouldn't completely rely on their satnav to direct them, but the fact is that some/most do and that won't change any time soon.

The idea of adapting satnav maps seems a good one in principle. Although I can't help but wonder how long before the plan is implemened in the most ludicrous longwinded and costly way, the licence system seems to be pointing towards that already!

Having better maps and superior routing algorithms that take into account your type of vehicle, the type of road, width restrictions, height restrictions and so on is a GREAT idea. No problem there. The software is a piece of piss - it's the mapping data that will require aquisition - which takes time. Market forces will see the development of features like this.

But that absolutely will not stop some numpty deciding to go down a totally inappropriate road - AFTER seeing signs saying DO NOT TAKE YOUR HGV DOWN HERE! What stops that is (1) putting up the necessary signs (mostly done) and (2) TRAFPOL!

Of course - this idiotic government will believe you can fix this with yet more CCTV and cameras. Twunts.

[Patrick1964]

"the problem LIED"

Surely you mean "the problem LAY"

Better English please, you're supposed to journalists

[Collaudatore]

Patrick1964 said:

"the problem LIED"

Surely you mean "the problem LAY"

Better English please, you're supposed to journalists

Shirley it should read the problem "lies", as it has not yet been resolved?


EDIT: Oh dear, what have I become?

Edited by Collaudatore on Wednesday 14th May 11:37

[GPSS]

Licenced Sat Nav, Mmmmmm...... More Tax

[jmorgan]

Yeah, sat nav's a numpty maker for lorry drivers only.

To be fair there is a road near me with one of those signs. But at the start it appears to be OK width wise, there are villages that take deliveries but other routes are more suited.

[louiebaby]

Better mapping on Sat Nav's, with tight roads, low bridges and weight restrictions: - Good.

Ability to configure what you're driving to take these details into account with the route planning function: - Great.

More taxes: - Poo.

[big_rob_sydney]

Hmm. Some systems need a computer to let you mess around with what bits and pieces of the map you want to use, eg 5 kilometers either side of the intended route.

I can imagine that a trucker might be faced with times where using a laptop wouldnt be practical. They might not take one with them.

I see some issues with putting this onto the map providers. How long \ wide \ heavy does the vehicle need to be before certain roads are "no go" zones? Will every road in the country need to be rated for allowable length, width, and weight? Presumably some of this information is already available, but is it available for the entire country?

Then add in height as well for bridges. And then maybe add in noise restrictions, and so on. I can see this is a logistical nightmare. And if the sat nav unit is portable, then the initial vehicle dimensions and characteristics are void.

While I think its a problem, really, its not the end of the world. Maybe people should just be left to sort themselves out without the nanny state running to put in rolls royce solutions for every petty problem (which will also require rolls royce budgets funded by already-under-attack voters).

[timewatch]

Use a map FFS !

Havn't used a good sat nav yet.

TomTom diverted me down a street then told me I had taken the wrong turning I gave it away I had enough !

TW>>>

[Mr Whippy]

big_rob_sydney said:

Hmm. Some systems need a computer to let you mess around with what bits and pieces of the map you want to use, eg 5 kilometers either side of the intended route.

I can imagine that a trucker might be faced with times where using a laptop wouldnt be practical. They might not take one with them.

I see some issues with putting this onto the map providers. How long \ wide \ heavy does the vehicle need to be before certain roads are "no go" zones? Will every road in the country need to be rated for allowable length, width, and weight? Presumably some of this information is already available, but is it available for the entire country?

Then add in height as well for bridges. And then maybe add in noise restrictions, and so on. I can see this is a logistical nightmare. And if the sat nav unit is portable, then the initial vehicle dimensions and characteristics are void.

While I think its a problem, really, its not the end of the world. Maybe people should just be left to sort themselves out without the nanny state running to put in rolls royce solutions for every petty problem (which will also require rolls royce budgets funded by already-under-attack voters).

Yep, problem is if the drivers are dependent on the system then slowly but surely nannying councils and NIMBY's may well influence the road ratings and then you have trucks needlessly avoiding reasonably useful roads because of wittering interference.

The only real solution is for Plod to do drivers for DWDCAT where appropriate if they are using clearly inappropriate roads (we need more TrafPol, a net gain in every single way, rather than a cost on society imho).
If drivers would plan their routes, like they used to, then they wouldn't have a problem.

SatNav is a tool. If lazy drivers use it as a complete guide then they are stupid.

Dave

[Sciroccology]

Don said:

It's bks. People blame the Sat Nav.

It isn't. It's the driver. ALL Sat Navs will redirect you if you don't take a turn. So if you see a fking great sign saying NO HGVs and you still go down it in your HGV just because the Sat Nav says so? You are a tt.

Quite. I drive a Class 2 HGV and do rely on Sat-Nav, but not without a bit of common sense thrown in as well. Low bridges, width-restrictions and the like are (mostly) signposted well in advance and there are (usually) no excuses for getting into trouble.

Saying that, our lorries (15t) aren't the biggest HGVs in the world and can probably get places that many couldn't.

[louiebaby]

Looks like there are some systems available.

http://www.nav-now.co.uk/product.php?fdProductId=3...

I suspect the extra cost is related to the software development costs, but if it was incorporated into all systems, it would come down in price VERY quickly, meaning the extra cost would be negligible.

Technology moves quickly, and someone will start to incorporate it soon.

(Should be useful for people towing caravans too...)

[New Scot]

Some of us still use maps and/or a road atlas either instead of as well as SatNav. Will the law require a "truckers" version of these too?

Again the old adage "a sledgehammer to crack a nut" springs to mind ...

[logoman]

My Garmin frequently takes me on routes more suitable for HGVs.
what I need is a setting for the scenic, no scamera, b-route.