12 months on...
Discussion
I've just had a my insurance renewal through, so it's been twelve months living with a Cerbera and I thought it might be useful for any prospective purchasers to see exactly what it has cost for 1 year...
My car cost £15,500 when i bought it, this was for a 1996 4.2 Cerbera with 26,000 miles on the clock. Since then I have done 14,000 miles in the past 12 months.
What's it worth now? Probably £15k if I'm lucky and don't need a quick sale.
So, in the order that they come out of the file (roughly chronological)...
£1682.88 - Steering rack gaiter, tracking, oil pressure spring, broken engine mount, engine setup, nitron suspension, throttle return spring, anti roll bar rubbers.
£1412.82 - Replace engine valve springs, clutch master cylinder, clutch slave cylinder seals, tappet adjustment, service.
£214.89 - Air con pipe, air con recharge, big fuse.
£897.81 - Mot, service, brake pads, steering rack seal.
£110.37 - Oil filler cap, alloy handbrake.
£8.49 - Brake fluid.
£395.00 - Warranty (totally worthless).
£15.04 - Oil pressure spring.
£200.00 - 17" RL Alloys.
£47.02 - Balancing and tracking.
£19.90 - Door switch.
£474.61 - Coil, oil pressure gauge, leads, plugs.
£298.45 - Lambda sensors.
£121.61 - Decat.
£200.00 - Alcantara doors and parcel shelf, speaker upgrade.
Total for maintenance, upgrades, tyres and servicing =
£6580.09
£165 - Tax.
£830 - Insurance.
£100 - Oil.
£3200 - Petrol.
Total for absolutely everything =
£10875.09
A shocking amount, but not too bad for 14,000 miles and a set of Nitrons included. A few of the jobs I did myself, where possible (door switch, oil pressure spring, alcantara trim, etc...) but the vast majority of the work has been done by Topcats racing, who have done me proud and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them to anyone.
Also, a big thanks to this forum and the members who post, this is probably the only reason why I still own the car as the first few months were very trying. Without this resource to rely on i'd have probably moved on a long time ago.
Touch wood, cross fingers and all that, she has been fine for the past 3000 miles and it looks like I've sorted out the neglect from the previous owners, she is at full health. A little grumbly in the cold mornings and a few creaks and rattles, but that is just the owner
>>> Edited by trooper1212 on Wednesday 1st December 18:10
My car cost £15,500 when i bought it, this was for a 1996 4.2 Cerbera with 26,000 miles on the clock. Since then I have done 14,000 miles in the past 12 months.
What's it worth now? Probably £15k if I'm lucky and don't need a quick sale.
So, in the order that they come out of the file (roughly chronological)...
£1682.88 - Steering rack gaiter, tracking, oil pressure spring, broken engine mount, engine setup, nitron suspension, throttle return spring, anti roll bar rubbers.
£1412.82 - Replace engine valve springs, clutch master cylinder, clutch slave cylinder seals, tappet adjustment, service.
£214.89 - Air con pipe, air con recharge, big fuse.
£897.81 - Mot, service, brake pads, steering rack seal.
£110.37 - Oil filler cap, alloy handbrake.
£8.49 - Brake fluid.
£395.00 - Warranty (totally worthless).
£15.04 - Oil pressure spring.
£200.00 - 17" RL Alloys.
£47.02 - Balancing and tracking.
£19.90 - Door switch.
£474.61 - Coil, oil pressure gauge, leads, plugs.
£298.45 - Lambda sensors.
£121.61 - Decat.
£200.00 - Alcantara doors and parcel shelf, speaker upgrade.
Total for maintenance, upgrades, tyres and servicing =
£6580.09
£165 - Tax.
£830 - Insurance.
£100 - Oil.
£3200 - Petrol.
Total for absolutely everything =
£10875.09
A shocking amount, but not too bad for 14,000 miles and a set of Nitrons included. A few of the jobs I did myself, where possible (door switch, oil pressure spring, alcantara trim, etc...) but the vast majority of the work has been done by Topcats racing, who have done me proud and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them to anyone.
Also, a big thanks to this forum and the members who post, this is probably the only reason why I still own the car as the first few months were very trying. Without this resource to rely on i'd have probably moved on a long time ago.
Touch wood, cross fingers and all that, she has been fine for the past 3000 miles and it looks like I've sorted out the neglect from the previous owners, she is at full health. A little grumbly in the cold mornings and a few creaks and rattles, but that is just the owner
>>> Edited by trooper1212 on Wednesday 1st December 18:10
Pretty similar to my costs, if that makes you feel any better.
Sometimes I wonder at these '£3k' for running costs per year quotes, as if you actually use the car, thats only a fraction of the total cost.
Still, I tell myself you can't look at the bottom line, you just need to look at the difference between running the Cerbera and running another car. Suddenly it seems like a bargain! (if you can suspend reality
)
Sometimes I wonder at these '£3k' for running costs per year quotes, as if you actually use the car, thats only a fraction of the total cost.
Still, I tell myself you can't look at the bottom line, you just need to look at the difference between running the Cerbera and running another car. Suddenly it seems like a bargain! (if you can suspend reality
)trooper1212 said:
I've just had a my insurance renewal through, so it's been twelve months living with a Cerbera and I thought it might be useful for any prospective purchasers to see exactly what it has cost for 1 year...
My car cost £15,500 when i bought it, this was for a 1996 4.2 Cerbera with 26,000 miles on the clock. Since then I have done 14,000 miles in the past 12 months.
What's it worth now? Probably £15k if I'm lucky and don't need a quick sale.
So, in the order that they come out of the file (roughly chronological)...
£1682.88 - Steering rack gaiter, tracking, oil pressure spring, broken engine mount, engine setup, nitron suspension, throttle return spring, anti roll bar rubbers.
£1412.82 - Replace engine valve springs, clutch master cylinder, clutch slave cylinder seals, tappet adjustment, service.
£214.89 - Air con pipe, air con recharge, big fuse.
£897.81 - Mot, service, brake pads, steering rack seal.
£110.37 - Oil filler cap, alloy handbrake.
£8.49 - Brake fluid.
£395.00 - Warranty (totally worthless).
£15.04 - Oil pressure spring.
£200.00 - 17" RL Alloys.
£47.02 - Balancing and tracking.
£19.90 - Door switch.
£474.61 - Coil, oil pressure gauge, leads, plugs.
£298.45 - Lambda sensors.
£121.61 - Decat.
£200.00 - Alcantara doors and parcel shelf, speaker upgrade.
Total for maintenance, upgrades, tyres and servicing =
£6580.09
£165 - Tax.
£830 - Insurance.
£100 - Oil.
£3200 - Petrol.
Total for absolutely everything =
£10875.09
A shocking amount, but not too bad for 14,000 miles and a set of Nitrons included. A few of the jobs I did myself, where possible (door switch, oil pressure spring, alcantara trim, etc...) but the vast majority of the work has been done by Topcats racing, who have done me proud and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them to anyone.
Also, a big thanks to this forum and the members who post, this is probably the only reason why I still own the car as the first few months were very trying. Without this resource to rely on i'd have probably moved on a long time ago.
Touch wood, cross fingers and all that, she has been fine for the past 3000 miles and it looks like I've sorted out the neglect from the previous owners, she is at full health. A little grumbly in the cold mornings and a few creaks and rattles, but that is just the owner
>>> Edited by trooper1212 on Wednesday 1st December 18:10
Interesting reading that!
I am particularly interested in the Oil spring costing £15? I thought they were a coupel of quid?
And the RL Alloys costing £200
! That's a good price, second hand?
Duncan
DuncanM said:
Interesting reading that!
I am particularly interested in the Oil spring costing £15? I thought they were a coupel of quid?
And the RL Alloys costing £200
That's a good price, second hand?
Duncan
2 springs plus postage = £15.
Yup, the alloys were off ebay, with new tyres
I will get the costs up for Dads car over the past 4 years/45k miles+ on here, its been pretty reasonable to date (even including this years little tantrum of expense.)
£10k a year sounds shockingly expensive, I cant imagine that ours is run for that money?? Admittedly ours has had very little in the way of upgrades.
Glad you are still enjoying it, long may it continue...
£10k a year sounds shockingly expensive, I cant imagine that ours is run for that money?? Admittedly ours has had very little in the way of upgrades.
Glad you are still enjoying it, long may it continue...
Here's my 1st years running costs. Higher than the 3k but not as high as 10k
Oil leak - resealed breather unit. Water leak - resealed seal around master cylinder. Adjust N/S emergency exit cable. Adjusted exhaust as knocking.
Buzzer volume adjusted. Aircon regassed. Wheel geometry. New front wheels.
£140 as dealer sorted rest under warranty.
New clutch. Totally covered by warranty.
Engine set up. £80
Replacement oil pressure switch (cost to me)
Welded broken exhaust (cost to me)
Replaced coil (under warranty)
Replaced both throttle pots (cost to me)
£409
12k service and diff bush bolt. £591
Near side exhaust welded. FOC.Thanks Castle
4 x Bridgestone S03 tyres. £613
Nitrons from EBay £400
Nitrons fitted and full wheel alignment. £513
6k Service. Fitted 4 new gaiters. Replaced steering column joint. Replaced A/C belt and recharged A/C. Refitted CATs, Refitted DE-CAT pipes after MOT. Repaired handbrake lever and linkage. Replaced faulty low note horn. Cleaned chassis and re painted. Fitted Helicoil sump thread. New wiper blades. MOT. £1427
Tax £165
New rad. Under warranty.
Leven Petrol cap. £40
Insurance. £971
Total 1st year = £5524 plus oil(not much which is strange for a Cerb)and petrol.
Oil leak - resealed breather unit. Water leak - resealed seal around master cylinder. Adjust N/S emergency exit cable. Adjusted exhaust as knocking.
Buzzer volume adjusted. Aircon regassed. Wheel geometry. New front wheels.
£140 as dealer sorted rest under warranty.
New clutch. Totally covered by warranty.
Engine set up. £80
Replacement oil pressure switch (cost to me)
Welded broken exhaust (cost to me)
Replaced coil (under warranty)
Replaced both throttle pots (cost to me)
£409
12k service and diff bush bolt. £591
Near side exhaust welded. FOC.Thanks Castle
4 x Bridgestone S03 tyres. £613
Nitrons from EBay £400
Nitrons fitted and full wheel alignment. £513
6k Service. Fitted 4 new gaiters. Replaced steering column joint. Replaced A/C belt and recharged A/C. Refitted CATs, Refitted DE-CAT pipes after MOT. Repaired handbrake lever and linkage. Replaced faulty low note horn. Cleaned chassis and re painted. Fitted Helicoil sump thread. New wiper blades. MOT. £1427
Tax £165
New rad. Under warranty.
Leven Petrol cap. £40
Insurance. £971
Total 1st year = £5524 plus oil(not much which is strange for a Cerb)and petrol.
The £3000 is referred to as the slush fund... not running costs. The key thing is the cost for just stuff that needs fixing... be interesting to know how many miles were done last year... if it's only 1000 miles last year, it would appear you're just soaking up the stuff that's failing because the car was sitting around. (That's what I've been lead to believe, reading posts on PH about TVRs, anyway.)
I think the 3K guys are doing a fair amount themselves.
For me the figures above confirm my philosphy. Which is, the Cerb is a labour of love. I couldn't have half the cars I do if I spent that much on them.
I spend most of my money on the right tools, and give my time to learn and do things myself. By doing this I have a glorious set of cars and maintain them all.
There is a limit to my knowledge and abilities, and at that time Jools/Mark can take over, but so far my philosophy has kept the bills under 3K each year for ALL my cars. I don't buy warranties and I only have servicing done if I am sure there will be no surprises and if the car resale price would suffer without it.
For me the figures above confirm my philosphy. Which is, the Cerb is a labour of love. I couldn't have half the cars I do if I spent that much on them.
I spend most of my money on the right tools, and give my time to learn and do things myself. By doing this I have a glorious set of cars and maintain them all.
There is a limit to my knowledge and abilities, and at that time Jools/Mark can take over, but so far my philosophy has kept the bills under 3K each year for ALL my cars. I don't buy warranties and I only have servicing done if I am sure there will be no surprises and if the car resale price would suffer without it.
I am simply not brave enough to open my file and work out how much money I have spent in the 18 months I've had my Cerb.
But, however much it is, I now have a very sorted and fantastic car that makes me grin everytime I get in - there is nothing else like it!
Life is for living
and money is for spending
But, however much it is, I now have a very sorted and fantastic car that makes me grin everytime I get in - there is nothing else like it!
Life is for living
and money is for spending trooper1212 said:
davetherave1970 said:
Total 1st year = £5524 plus oil(not much which is strange for a Cerb)and petrol.
Well, £3200 of my £10k was petrol...
My petrol works out around £2900 so nearly the same! Just shocked myself working that out
Edited after looking at my Cerb profile: Servicing/Repairs: £2980 to date. 13 months of ownership and 12070 miles covered. So I have £20 in the Cerb fund to carry over
Only £953 on upgrades. Note to self, must try harder.
>> Edited by davetherave1970 on Thursday 2nd December 13:26
I got off lightly! 
1998 4.2
Owned for 18 months.
11,000 miles.
6K Service, MOT, warranty renewal, new back box, de-cat, manifold weld, various tune ups and throttle pot adjustments came to just under £2000.
£400 for 17" RL-7's (not via ebay)
£1100 insurance
Sold it losing £3600 in depreciation.
1998 4.2
Owned for 18 months.
11,000 miles.
6K Service, MOT, warranty renewal, new back box, de-cat, manifold weld, various tune ups and throttle pot adjustments came to just under £2000.
£400 for 17" RL-7's (not via ebay)
£1100 insurance
Sold it losing £3600 in depreciation.
Nearly 8 months in:
8000 miles
Petrol £1700
Insurance £790
Tax £150ish
Brakes & pads etc £600 (6 track days)
Cams & top end tidy up £1700 (shared with dealer, nice man)
Servicing and bits £500
Radiator £200 (from breakers)
Starter motor £100 (from breakers)
Exhaust & broken manifold £1000
New leads £110
Waxoyl etc £100
Oil £100
Tyres £400
Jimi Hendrix collection £16.99
Total cost to me about £6500
Do a lot myself and take the servicing and specialist bits to Andy at APM who keeps me confident on the road, never let me down, including a phenominal trip to the World Surfing Championships near Biaritz (I was not competing) this summer with my two sons.
Depreciation is also an intersting one now the model isn't made anymore, I think I could sell mine for what I paid for it? What will good ones be worth in the future?
You have to pay a lot more for jaw dropping good looks and performance in another make not only in maintenance but depreciation. Porsches are probably the closest?
8000 miles
Petrol £1700
Insurance £790
Tax £150ish
Brakes & pads etc £600 (6 track days)
Cams & top end tidy up £1700 (shared with dealer, nice man)
Servicing and bits £500
Radiator £200 (from breakers)
Starter motor £100 (from breakers)
Exhaust & broken manifold £1000
New leads £110
Waxoyl etc £100
Oil £100
Tyres £400
Jimi Hendrix collection £16.99
Total cost to me about £6500
Do a lot myself and take the servicing and specialist bits to Andy at APM who keeps me confident on the road, never let me down, including a phenominal trip to the World Surfing Championships near Biaritz (I was not competing) this summer with my two sons.
Depreciation is also an intersting one now the model isn't made anymore, I think I could sell mine for what I paid for it? What will good ones be worth in the future?
You have to pay a lot more for jaw dropping good looks and performance in another make not only in maintenance but depreciation. Porsches are probably the closest?
Hi all
My figures are not that different from trooper1212's (which means that I too have breached the £10K barrier all in!!)
Here's the summary from my profile:
36,000 miles service, including adjustment of valve clearances. Top diff mounting bush replaced, boot catch adjusted, various electrical niggles sorted.
All done brilliantly (as always) by Andy at APM.
£799.00
Great run to Le Mans - only incident a smashed headlight lens. Replaced by Andy at APM for a whopping £20!! Thanks mate!
£20.00
Fitted BMC F1 air filters (as used by Ferrari and Minardi F1 teams, I kid you not!). £100 the pair, fit to the ends of the airboxes, have removed the hoses, and the foam filter from the front housing.
Immediate effect was so much under-bonnet air pressure that bonnet straining upwards at over 80mph. So have removed the air scoop in the front grille to reduce ram effect. Noticed slightly cooler running as more of radiator open to the elements.
£100.00
pre-Le Mans trip checkover, plus RR upgraded chip fitted by Andy at APM - nice work, fella!!
£258.00
Just spent nearly £1200 and still the bloody car won't go properly!! New battery is it's final chance, I will not spend any more money on this car (for the next week or so, at least!) From Mole Valley TVR
£88.00
Ouch! Lost 5th gear. Gearbox rebuild required, new 5th gear clusters plus syncros on 1st and 2nd replaced. Gearbox rebuild work subbed to specialist by Andy at APM.
Plus two new front tyres for MOT - Toyos
£1,175.00
Insurance renewal from Ian Fray & Co. Classicline policy switched from RSA to KGM, premium up to £798. Doh!
£798.00
Adjust ride height (too low initially on Nitrons), repair heated rear screen, Replace odd bank throttle switch (excessive interference causing false signal to be sent to ECU). Replace both cats, tighten rear exhaust mounting bracket.
All done by Andy at APM - good job, car now feels as it should!
£815.00
New clutch (slave cylinder and labour charge covered by WH), Nitron dampers and uprated springs, Green Stuff rear pads, new rear tyres (Toyos), bodywork repair to rear bumper (Wife. Parking. Say no more), minor welding to exhaust bracket, fix seized suspension bush, 30K service, numerous electrical gremlins. All done (really well) by Andy at APM.
£3,130.00
Pre-Le Mans checkover - new front pads (Greens), fitted lip spoiler and bonnet lock rods. Geometry checked and re-aligned.
Spares kit (belts, fuses, bulbs) supplied.
£286.00
New front lip spoiler
New bonnet lock rods and ends
parts from TMS
£48.00
Car at APM for minor niggles to be sorted:
New steering column UJ
Oil pressure relief valve spring (upgraded)
Replace one throttle switch (readings out of range on ECU) Cleared fault codes and reset maps.
Top value, thanks Andy! £144.00
Bootlid cable repaired F.O.C by Martin/John at Racing Green in Ash Vale - nice one chaps!
First Cerbie premium from Ian Fray & Co.
£695.00
So that's £10,043 in total - £1,700 on fuel, £1500 on insurance, and £6,800 on repairs, servicing and upgrades.
Jeez, hope the current Mrs beemer is reading this...
cheers
sean
My figures are not that different from trooper1212's (which means that I too have breached the £10K barrier all in!!)
Here's the summary from my profile:
36,000 miles service, including adjustment of valve clearances. Top diff mounting bush replaced, boot catch adjusted, various electrical niggles sorted.
All done brilliantly (as always) by Andy at APM.
£799.00
Great run to Le Mans - only incident a smashed headlight lens. Replaced by Andy at APM for a whopping £20!! Thanks mate!
£20.00
Fitted BMC F1 air filters (as used by Ferrari and Minardi F1 teams, I kid you not!). £100 the pair, fit to the ends of the airboxes, have removed the hoses, and the foam filter from the front housing.
Immediate effect was so much under-bonnet air pressure that bonnet straining upwards at over 80mph. So have removed the air scoop in the front grille to reduce ram effect. Noticed slightly cooler running as more of radiator open to the elements.
£100.00
pre-Le Mans trip checkover, plus RR upgraded chip fitted by Andy at APM - nice work, fella!!
£258.00
Just spent nearly £1200 and still the bloody car won't go properly!! New battery is it's final chance, I will not spend any more money on this car (for the next week or so, at least!) From Mole Valley TVR
£88.00
Ouch! Lost 5th gear. Gearbox rebuild required, new 5th gear clusters plus syncros on 1st and 2nd replaced. Gearbox rebuild work subbed to specialist by Andy at APM.
Plus two new front tyres for MOT - Toyos
£1,175.00
Insurance renewal from Ian Fray & Co. Classicline policy switched from RSA to KGM, premium up to £798. Doh!
£798.00
Adjust ride height (too low initially on Nitrons), repair heated rear screen, Replace odd bank throttle switch (excessive interference causing false signal to be sent to ECU). Replace both cats, tighten rear exhaust mounting bracket.
All done by Andy at APM - good job, car now feels as it should!
£815.00
New clutch (slave cylinder and labour charge covered by WH), Nitron dampers and uprated springs, Green Stuff rear pads, new rear tyres (Toyos), bodywork repair to rear bumper (Wife. Parking. Say no more), minor welding to exhaust bracket, fix seized suspension bush, 30K service, numerous electrical gremlins. All done (really well) by Andy at APM.
£3,130.00
Pre-Le Mans checkover - new front pads (Greens), fitted lip spoiler and bonnet lock rods. Geometry checked and re-aligned.
Spares kit (belts, fuses, bulbs) supplied.
£286.00
New front lip spoiler
New bonnet lock rods and ends
parts from TMS
£48.00
Car at APM for minor niggles to be sorted:
New steering column UJ
Oil pressure relief valve spring (upgraded)
Replace one throttle switch (readings out of range on ECU) Cleared fault codes and reset maps.
Top value, thanks Andy! £144.00
Bootlid cable repaired F.O.C by Martin/John at Racing Green in Ash Vale - nice one chaps!
First Cerbie premium from Ian Fray & Co.
£695.00
So that's £10,043 in total - £1,700 on fuel, £1500 on insurance, and £6,800 on repairs, servicing and upgrades.
Jeez, hope the current Mrs beemer is reading this...
cheers
sean
I suspect that the costs of Cerbera ownership overall are similar whatever path you take:
- an early car, with lower purchase price, is likely to need a significant amount spent on it to bring it up to scratch and keep it running.
- a later car is likely to need less spent in maintenance, but the losses due to depreciation are greater.
Obviously, if you're not going to get rid of the car and you can afford the greater outlay, a later car will probably end up being the less expensive proposition.
- an early car, with lower purchase price, is likely to need a significant amount spent on it to bring it up to scratch and keep it running.
- a later car is likely to need less spent in maintenance, but the losses due to depreciation are greater.
Obviously, if you're not going to get rid of the car and you can afford the greater outlay, a later car will probably end up being the less expensive proposition.
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