Discussion
Evening all,
Whilst I'm tinkering with my car I plan to seal it from the elements. The last time the car was out in the rain the carpets on both sides became wetter than an otter's pocket.
I can see all the obvious places that need the sealant / grommets refreshing in the engine bay but are there other not so obvious points where water can find it's way in that I need to know about?
ta
Ian
Whilst I'm tinkering with my car I plan to seal it from the elements. The last time the car was out in the rain the carpets on both sides became wetter than an otter's pocket.
I can see all the obvious places that need the sealant / grommets refreshing in the engine bay but are there other not so obvious points where water can find it's way in that I need to know about?
ta
Ian
one trick to stop the water coming in via the door seal is to cut a tiny section of the rubber out at the bottom front. The water runs down the seal between the rubber and the part that attaches to the body then when it gets to the bottom trickles inside the car instead of down onto the sill. Or if you can rotate the door seal so the join in is the same place this works well too.
Also seal up the clutch reservoir cover. I've put a bead of sealant round the outside edge to deflect the water as i need constant access to my reservoir.
Also seal up the clutch reservoir cover. I've put a bead of sealant round the outside edge to deflect the water as i need constant access to my reservoir.
Thanks for this too. I put a set of the later style seals on - mainly for wind noise reduction.
In a similar fashion I've been obsessing about the engine bay, but this makes sense as I think the leak has got a bit worse.
The seals are fresh enough that I could probably rotate.
Does anyone have a photo with the little cut out?
Thanks,
Brian
In a similar fashion I've been obsessing about the engine bay, but this makes sense as I think the leak has got a bit worse.
The seals are fresh enough that I could probably rotate.
Does anyone have a photo with the little cut out?
Thanks,
Brian
Don't have a photo, but cutting out a 1cm gap at the front lower corner of the door seal can prevent water leaking into the interior. I've often seen a small puddle sat on my car's door seal after a lot of rain. On my car theres 2 small indentations in the door, seemingly to allow this water to drain away. As my car is an early model which originally had the single type seal these indentations are filled by the new double seal type, so I should probably cut the seals at that point too to open up those drains again.
Hi Ian
I copied this from a TVR bulletin quite a few years back. I did post it on another thread but in case you missed it, here you go:
A list of water ingress points on the front offside on the Cerb.
1. The grommets which the throttle cable, water temperature capillary tube brake servo hose pass through
2. Clutch master cylinder cover (on the inner front wing)
3. Pedal box securing bolts
4. Brake master cylinder reservoir bolts
5. Bolts securing bonnet stay rod bracket
6. Oil pipe union
7. Scuttle panel securing riv-nut
8. Brake block mounted on toe board
9. Grommets in floor pan
10. Bonnet release shaft
11. Windscreen
12. Bolts securing bonnet lock bracket
13. Door seals
14. Steering column bearing
15. Indicator side repeater
And the nearside footwell........
1. Wiring loom grommet or multiplug connector on early cars.
2. Grommet for wiper motor wiring
3. Wiper motor securing bolts
4. Expansion tank bracket securing bolts
5. Heater pipes
6. Battery tray securing bolts
7. MAP sensor pipe (barometric pressure pipe from rear l/h airbox)
8. Rivnut for scuttle panel
9. Windscreen
10. Door seals
11. Grommets in floorpan
12. Indicator side repeater
Hope it helps you
Regards
Simon
I copied this from a TVR bulletin quite a few years back. I did post it on another thread but in case you missed it, here you go:
A list of water ingress points on the front offside on the Cerb.
1. The grommets which the throttle cable, water temperature capillary tube brake servo hose pass through
2. Clutch master cylinder cover (on the inner front wing)
3. Pedal box securing bolts
4. Brake master cylinder reservoir bolts
5. Bolts securing bonnet stay rod bracket
6. Oil pipe union
7. Scuttle panel securing riv-nut
8. Brake block mounted on toe board
9. Grommets in floor pan
10. Bonnet release shaft
11. Windscreen
12. Bolts securing bonnet lock bracket
13. Door seals
14. Steering column bearing
15. Indicator side repeater
And the nearside footwell........
1. Wiring loom grommet or multiplug connector on early cars.
2. Grommet for wiper motor wiring
3. Wiper motor securing bolts
4. Expansion tank bracket securing bolts
5. Heater pipes
6. Battery tray securing bolts
7. MAP sensor pipe (barometric pressure pipe from rear l/h airbox)
8. Rivnut for scuttle panel
9. Windscreen
10. Door seals
11. Grommets in floorpan
12. Indicator side repeater
Hope it helps you
Regards
Simon
SimonKD said:
Hi Ian
I copied this from a TVR bulletin quite a few years back. I did post it on another thread but in case you missed it, here you go:
A list of water ingress points on the front offside on the Cerb.
1. The grommets which the throttle cable, water temperature capillary tube brake servo hose pass through
2. Clutch master cylinder cover (on the inner front wing)
3. Pedal box securing bolts
4. Brake master cylinder reservoir bolts
5. Bolts securing bonnet stay rod bracket
6. Oil pipe union
7. Scuttle panel securing riv-nut
8. Brake block mounted on toe board
9. Grommets in floor pan
10. Bonnet release shaft
11. Windscreen
12. Bolts securing bonnet lock bracket
13. Door seals
14. Steering column bearing
15. Indicator side repeater
And the nearside footwell........
1. Wiring loom grommet or multiplug connector on early cars.
2. Grommet for wiper motor wiring
3. Wiper motor securing bolts
4. Expansion tank bracket securing bolts
5. Heater pipes
6. Battery tray securing bolts
7. MAP sensor pipe (barometric pressure pipe from rear l/h airbox)
8. Rivnut for scuttle panel
9. Windscreen
10. Door seals
11. Grommets in floorpan
12. Indicator side repeater
Hope it helps you
Regards
Simon
That's a brilliant list and also quite worrying at the same time......I copied this from a TVR bulletin quite a few years back. I did post it on another thread but in case you missed it, here you go:
A list of water ingress points on the front offside on the Cerb.
1. The grommets which the throttle cable, water temperature capillary tube brake servo hose pass through
2. Clutch master cylinder cover (on the inner front wing)
3. Pedal box securing bolts
4. Brake master cylinder reservoir bolts
5. Bolts securing bonnet stay rod bracket
6. Oil pipe union
7. Scuttle panel securing riv-nut
8. Brake block mounted on toe board
9. Grommets in floor pan
10. Bonnet release shaft
11. Windscreen
12. Bolts securing bonnet lock bracket
13. Door seals
14. Steering column bearing
15. Indicator side repeater
And the nearside footwell........
1. Wiring loom grommet or multiplug connector on early cars.
2. Grommet for wiper motor wiring
3. Wiper motor securing bolts
4. Expansion tank bracket securing bolts
5. Heater pipes
6. Battery tray securing bolts
7. MAP sensor pipe (barometric pressure pipe from rear l/h airbox)
8. Rivnut for scuttle panel
9. Windscreen
10. Door seals
11. Grommets in floorpan
12. Indicator side repeater
Hope it helps you
Regards
Simon
Looks like I may need some more tubes of sealant
)As a first, perhaps obvious check, put the windows all of the way down and press the lock button on the fob so that they close again. Then unlock it, open the doors, shut them and press lock again.
If a small gap appears at the top of the window then there's drag somewhere in the window system, maybe caused by old guide felt, slowing the window in the up phase. This checks that the timing provided for "Up" matches that recorded from "Down" since you might not be able to perceive a difference in speed when using the window buttons on the inside. Anything less than a tight fit against the seal will let water in.
If a small gap appears at the top of the window then there's drag somewhere in the window system, maybe caused by old guide felt, slowing the window in the up phase. This checks that the timing provided for "Up" matches that recorded from "Down" since you might not be able to perceive a difference in speed when using the window buttons on the inside. Anything less than a tight fit against the seal will let water in.
So, my new Cerb is garaged when not in use, so water ingress is not going to be a day to day problem. BUT, it was parked at an airport for two days last weekend when there was very heavy rain. When I got back, the car behaved perfectly except for having the infamous wet footwells. I've been in touch with a former owner from 2011/2012 (Paul - Noisy on here) who confirmed that he fixed some minor leakage issues by changing the seals, so it's not a fundamental problem with the car. The seals and windows were removed when the car was resprayed in 2014, so I suspect something has happened with them being replaced (probably not noticed by the guy from whom I bought the car who also kept the car garaged and used it lightly and in good weather).
I've been researching the forum and, as well as all the suggestions in the posts above, I found the below paragraph posted by Luckyone in a great "Cerbera - Most common problems" thread spanning 2004 to 2013:
"Wet carpets:
Check all the seals in the engine bay under the removable cover in front of windscreen. Mainly the seal round the back lump (clutch fluid inspection cover) on the drivers side this can look ok but I found a main dealer hadn’t re-sealed it & it was letting in loads of water, it only needs silicone bath sealer. If not check the door seals I found the second (98- only) seal on the door was channelling water over the inner body seal & into the car. This is easy to see if it’s raining as the top of the inner seal will be wet. If it’s still getting in check the inner door seals them selves, I found that as they run flat & upside down against the inner door panel where all the rain drains, the water tends to get inside the fitting “U” (in cross section) channel of the seal, then as the seal goes down the front of the door shut the & curves round to run along the bottom the right (?) way up, the water keeps on going down. Tricky explanation –easy fix: Pull the inner door seal off the body were it joins together at the bottom (just under the door speaker if you have them) all the way forward & up to the windscreen let it dry out, then put a run of silicone sealant inside the “U” (where it pushes back on to the body) of all of the seal you pulled off. Don’t put in too much though or it will all come out on to the carpet when you push it back on. I did all this a year ago & it been fine living on the street since, all you need to then is fit up a new carpet set…"
It's raining today and so I pushed the car outside, sat in it for a while and watched the drips coming in all of which appear to be coming in around the window/door seals and dribbling down to enter the footwell just in front of the emergency door release. Thoughts are:
1) The drivers side window has a fair sized gap at the back of it, even when fully wound up, so presumably some water is getting onto the inside of the seal and dribbling down to the bottow.
This compares with the passenger side window which fits snugly against the seal in that area:
Why could this be? The drivers side window looks to fit pretty well around the rest of the seal. Surely, even in a TVR, neither the glass nor the door can be different sizes on each side?!
2) I may as well replace the door seal and use the silicone bath sealer method quoted from Luckyone above. However, TVR Parts don't seem to sell a seal that matches my car (which is a fairly early (first reg in April 1997) 4.2):
Any ideas where I can get some new seals that match this (or can I just use some seals from later cars)?
3) If/when I get them, where should I put the join? The current join is halfway up the door by the hinges (with a fairly big gap between the two ends (see picture), but from the posts above it looks like it might be best to put them somewhere else to help stop water transferring from the outside to the inside at the join.
Any help will be much appreciated!
I've been researching the forum and, as well as all the suggestions in the posts above, I found the below paragraph posted by Luckyone in a great "Cerbera - Most common problems" thread spanning 2004 to 2013:
"Wet carpets:
Check all the seals in the engine bay under the removable cover in front of windscreen. Mainly the seal round the back lump (clutch fluid inspection cover) on the drivers side this can look ok but I found a main dealer hadn’t re-sealed it & it was letting in loads of water, it only needs silicone bath sealer. If not check the door seals I found the second (98- only) seal on the door was channelling water over the inner body seal & into the car. This is easy to see if it’s raining as the top of the inner seal will be wet. If it’s still getting in check the inner door seals them selves, I found that as they run flat & upside down against the inner door panel where all the rain drains, the water tends to get inside the fitting “U” (in cross section) channel of the seal, then as the seal goes down the front of the door shut the & curves round to run along the bottom the right (?) way up, the water keeps on going down. Tricky explanation –easy fix: Pull the inner door seal off the body were it joins together at the bottom (just under the door speaker if you have them) all the way forward & up to the windscreen let it dry out, then put a run of silicone sealant inside the “U” (where it pushes back on to the body) of all of the seal you pulled off. Don’t put in too much though or it will all come out on to the carpet when you push it back on. I did all this a year ago & it been fine living on the street since, all you need to then is fit up a new carpet set…"
It's raining today and so I pushed the car outside, sat in it for a while and watched the drips coming in all of which appear to be coming in around the window/door seals and dribbling down to enter the footwell just in front of the emergency door release. Thoughts are:
1) The drivers side window has a fair sized gap at the back of it, even when fully wound up, so presumably some water is getting onto the inside of the seal and dribbling down to the bottow.
This compares with the passenger side window which fits snugly against the seal in that area:
Why could this be? The drivers side window looks to fit pretty well around the rest of the seal. Surely, even in a TVR, neither the glass nor the door can be different sizes on each side?!
2) I may as well replace the door seal and use the silicone bath sealer method quoted from Luckyone above. However, TVR Parts don't seem to sell a seal that matches my car (which is a fairly early (first reg in April 1997) 4.2):
Any ideas where I can get some new seals that match this (or can I just use some seals from later cars)?
3) If/when I get them, where should I put the join? The current join is halfway up the door by the hinges (with a fairly big gap between the two ends (see picture), but from the posts above it looks like it might be best to put them somewhere else to help stop water transferring from the outside to the inside at the join.
Any help will be much appreciated!
I'm not sure about the seals but the window alignment should be easy enough to sort.
Remove the inner door car card, 8 countersunk bolts if I remember correctly. The glass is then plain to see including the two clamps that hold it to the mechanism. Simply undo the two clamps and move the window to get the best alignment you can. Do up the clamps and then check to make sure the window can move up and down without binding in the channels.
HTH
Ian
Remove the inner door car card, 8 countersunk bolts if I remember correctly. The glass is then plain to see including the two clamps that hold it to the mechanism. Simply undo the two clamps and move the window to get the best alignment you can. Do up the clamps and then check to make sure the window can move up and down without binding in the channels.
HTH
Ian
Gassing Station | Cerbera | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff