Cerbera Racing
Discussion
Looking at doing the ARDS test so as to get a national b licence, but what would be a good entry point for racing a cerbera?
theres obviously tuscan challenge and tasmin, but not sure what kind of racing would suit a rookie in a cerb, preferably the type of racing that doesnt tend to favour much if any contact, so as to minimise constant repair costs!
theres obviously tuscan challenge and tasmin, but not sure what kind of racing would suit a rookie in a cerb, preferably the type of racing that doesnt tend to favour much if any contact, so as to minimise constant repair costs!
TBH you couldn't do much better than the Tuscan Challenge, very little contact and the drivers are really friendly, ideal for a rookie. Plus the series will have a number of rookies next season which helps too. Generally speaking contact isn't approved of by series organisers, obviously there can be the occasional unavoidable incident but that's racing. There will be 2 other cerbs in the challenge next year (1 rookie) so why not add another.
ceejay
ceejay
Speak to John Wilson: http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/profile.asp?h=0...
and Andy at APM (said car may be living with him at the mo, if I'm not getting confused!): http://www.apmautomotive.co.uk/
Prepping a Cerb for racing is NOT cheap, I've got wind of the kind of figures involved, and buying a prebuilt racer has got to make more sense.
Tuscan racers were going for around the £25K mark, not sure if that still holds true.
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/284076.htm
Good luck
Tim
and Andy at APM (said car may be living with him at the mo, if I'm not getting confused!): http://www.apmautomotive.co.uk/
Prepping a Cerb for racing is NOT cheap, I've got wind of the kind of figures involved, and buying a prebuilt racer has got to make more sense.
Tuscan racers were going for around the £25K mark, not sure if that still holds true.
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/284076.htm
Good luck
Tim
Edited by TT Tim on Friday 16th November 10:00
I would have thought prepping a cerbera for racing would be very cheap, prepping one to go as fast as Jonny's though might cost a bit, it is a fast car 
essentially : gut the interior, add a rear tow hook, get a cage installed, seat, fire extinguisher, cut-off switch .. erm is that about it? say 5 k for the lot?
if you want to go fast though add in .. rebuilt engine, lower ratio diff, diff cooler, bigger brakes, better suspension and all of a sudden you're another 10k up the price.
essentially : gut the interior, add a rear tow hook, get a cage installed, seat, fire extinguisher, cut-off switch .. erm is that about it? say 5 k for the lot?
if you want to go fast though add in .. rebuilt engine, lower ratio diff, diff cooler, bigger brakes, better suspension and all of a sudden you're another 10k up the price.
trackcar said:
I would have thought prepping a cerbera for racing would be very cheap, prepping one to go as fast as Jonny's though might cost a bit, it is a fast car
essentially : gut the interior, add a rear tow hook, get a cage installed, seat, fire extinguisher, cut-off switch .. erm is that about it? say 5 k for the lot?
if you want to go fast though add in .. rebuilt engine, lower ratio diff, diff cooler, bigger brakes, better suspension and all of a sudden you're another 10k up the price.
essentially : gut the interior, add a rear tow hook, get a cage installed, seat, fire extinguisher, cut-off switch .. erm is that about it? say 5 k for the lot?
if you want to go fast though add in .. rebuilt engine, lower ratio diff, diff cooler, bigger brakes, better suspension and all of a sudden you're another 10k up the price.
Speaking to Andy, engine wise it has only had a remap and 4.2 induction kit fitted. So much of the exspense is as Jools says.
Edited by thegreengoblet on Friday 16th November 11:43
Joo is correct.
You can get out in a Cerb in the Tuscan Sag' Challenge by doing basically the following:
Rip out the interior, your time
Cage and seats and Belts, £2,000 to £4,000 plus fettling, dependant on how much you value your life?
Extinguisher and cut out, £400 - £700
Side windows or nets £700 or £100
Package the electrics, cables, pipes up, £100 - £300
Set of tyres 210s on the 17 inch Speedlines, £700
Set of stiffer springs, £80
Oil catch system, £50 - £100
Proper Racing Pads, £200
Other bits, £100 to £500
Time of an expert, APM, to fettle and make the difference is up to you, does save money though as he doesn't have to experiment.
Then you get out and you get the fix and you need more and you justify it with Man Maths and spend another £15 to £30k!!
Jonny
You can get out in a Cerb in the Tuscan Sag' Challenge by doing basically the following:
Rip out the interior, your time
Cage and seats and Belts, £2,000 to £4,000 plus fettling, dependant on how much you value your life?
Extinguisher and cut out, £400 - £700
Side windows or nets £700 or £100
Package the electrics, cables, pipes up, £100 - £300
Set of tyres 210s on the 17 inch Speedlines, £700
Set of stiffer springs, £80
Oil catch system, £50 - £100
Proper Racing Pads, £200
Other bits, £100 to £500
Time of an expert, APM, to fettle and make the difference is up to you, does save money though as he doesn't have to experiment.
Then you get out and you get the fix and you need more and you justify it with Man Maths and spend another £15 to £30k!!
Jonny
JonnyW said:
Yeah! Thanks for that
I owe you a beer and or favour! Where's the offset information on the MO1810s & MO1890s before I spend more money?
I owe you a beer and or favour! Where's the offset information on the MO1810s & MO1890s before I spend more money?
If you wait a month i will have a new set made. The current ones dont really have enough offset for me.
Although your not going quite as big are you??
I may not be able to help as all my wheels protrude from the bodyline. I will send you an email with them when i get home tonight.
All in exchange for knowing your suspension setup details from when you finished this season....
Looking forward to some close racing hopefully!
itsallyellow said:
Or spend money on getting expensive molds made for plastic cerbera front screens......Then have other competetors take advantage of the cheap price!!!
Seriously though it does get expensive. You begin to loose the concept of value for money!!
Mike
On the basis that we make sagaris screens from flat sheets of (coated) marguard polycarbonate, which must have the same degree of curvature as the Cerb, I'd say you didn't need to spend that money Seriously though it does get expensive. You begin to loose the concept of value for money!!
Mike
Sorry, that info would probably have been of more use to you before you'd had the mould made...
teamHOLDENracing said:
itsallyellow said:
Or spend money on getting expensive molds made for plastic cerbera front screens......Then have other competetors take advantage of the cheap price!!!
Seriously though it does get expensive. You begin to loose the concept of value for money!!
Mike
On the basis that we make sagaris screens from flat sheets of (coated) marguard polycarbonate, which must have the same degree of curvature as the Cerb, I'd say you didn't need to spend that money Seriously though it does get expensive. You begin to loose the concept of value for money!!
Mike
Sorry, that info would probably have been of more use to you before you'd had the mould made...
TT Tim said:
Prepping a Cerb for racing is NOT cheap, I've got wind of the kind of figures involved, and buying a prebuilt racer has got to make more sense.
Tuscan racers were going for around the £25K mark, not sure if that still holds true.
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/284076.htm
Good luck
Tim
There is little doubt that the cheapest way of going REALLY fast is to buy a race Tuscan. With all its years of development the Tuscan is likely to be more robust in terms of its components and potentially safer with its stiffer chassis and side impact protection. But the grid is a more varied and better place with the other cars and I admire anyone who gives it a go.Tuscan racers were going for around the £25K mark, not sure if that still holds true.
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/284076.htm
Good luck
Tim
Edited by TT Tim on Friday 16th November 10:00
The ex Lee Caroline car is currently available and I am happy to discuss prices/options with anyone who is genuinely interested. There is intentionally no price on the advert because the car is available with or without its AJP engine, some or all of the spares package etc..
I bought it to keep forever, but looking at 8 overseas race weekends next year it slowly dawned on me that I simply won't have the time to run both the Sagaris and the Tuscan
Just a thought, but would it be a bit cheaper (ignoring the purchase price of the car) perhaps to race prep a T350c as it is a more track focused car to start with. Having said that I imagine it would cost a fair bit to get a good 400+ bhp from the SP6 - I know 400+ bhp is easily achievable, but what about reliability - any thoughts Cliff / Joo ?.
The costs would be largely the same as you still need to remove the road car 'cage' and replace it with something suitable for racing. The issues with brake pads, dampers/springs, extinguishers, seat etc remain the same. The Speed 6 is already dry sumped and arguably more suitable but it, how do I put it, doesn't have the best reputation for longevity. On the plus side the AJP engines (6 and 8) tend to be a lot closer to TVR's claimed power outputs than the RV8s.
Ultimately you could put any road car straight on the race track simply by adding the required safety equipment and changing the brake pads/fluid. It would be cheap (ish) but not terribly quick. The car would be too soft and you would immediately want to upgrade the suspension. Running on slicks also puts far more stress through everything
Ultimately you could put any road car straight on the race track simply by adding the required safety equipment and changing the brake pads/fluid. It would be cheap (ish) but not terribly quick. The car would be too soft and you would immediately want to upgrade the suspension. Running on slicks also puts far more stress through everything
as andy has said, the costs of building a competitive Racer are huge (and mostly unseen!)
it is something that several of us have done in our different ways because we love the cars (T350/Cerb/Griff/Chim/Tamora) etc and have allowed that to cloud our judgement. Having said THAT we are all very happy with the results!
The best cost effective way is to buy a Tuscan. The only real issue is that most Rookies are scared by them, but if you book a Topcats experience you'll see that the are quite easy to drive...they are only monsters when on the edge...and you won't be there for a while.
either way, get out there and have a go...its the only REAL way to train...to DO it.
andy
BTW the Challenge is the best start into Racing IMHO and Sprinting the best way into M'sport.
TVR fortunately has cracking series in BOTH!
it is something that several of us have done in our different ways because we love the cars (T350/Cerb/Griff/Chim/Tamora) etc and have allowed that to cloud our judgement. Having said THAT we are all very happy with the results!
The best cost effective way is to buy a Tuscan. The only real issue is that most Rookies are scared by them, but if you book a Topcats experience you'll see that the are quite easy to drive...they are only monsters when on the edge...and you won't be there for a while.
either way, get out there and have a go...its the only REAL way to train...to DO it.
andy
BTW the Challenge is the best start into Racing IMHO and Sprinting the best way into M'sport.
TVR fortunately has cracking series in BOTH!
S5TVR said:
Just a thought, but would it be a bit cheaper (ignoring the purchase price of the car) perhaps to race prep a T350c as it is a more track focused car to start with. Having said that I imagine it would cost a fair bit to get a good 400+ bhp from the SP6 - I know 400+ bhp is easily achievable, but what about reliability - any thoughts Cliff / Joo ?.
The T350 is the more expensive option, mainly because the donor car costs a fair bit more than say an early Cerb. On top of that (unless you're lucky) you'll probably need a 4 litre engine plus a few mods to get the required 400ish bhp. The actual prep itself costs about the same regardless of model. Choice is yours.Yup .. I firmly believe the T350 is fundamentally a better starting package than a cerbera, however Jonny has shown us the way to go so far so extracting the potential from the T350 (especially it's engine) seems to be harder. Cliff's right about the pricing too .. starting with a cerb would be so much cheaper .. if building a T350 again I would never go fo the box of bits approach but go for a good solid straight car in the classifieds, and they're about twice the price of a cheap early cerbera 4.2 (8-10k versus 16-18k ?) I'd love to build a race cerbera though, they just look so damn cool out on track
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