LW versus Red Rose
Discussion
Hi Guys,
New to PH and hopefully soon to Cerberas :-). I will (like most of you I imagine), be looking for a car to use during the summer and lay to bed in the winter so not very many miles being put on the car. I would like to think that (at best) wont loose any money and possibly gain in value, so was looking for either a 4.5LW or a Red Rose.
I realise this is a subjective question but from a "depreciation" and maintenance point of view which of these 2 model would I best concentrate looking for?
Cheers Dale
New to PH and hopefully soon to Cerberas :-). I will (like most of you I imagine), be looking for a car to use during the summer and lay to bed in the winter so not very many miles being put on the car. I would like to think that (at best) wont loose any money and possibly gain in value, so was looking for either a 4.5LW or a Red Rose.
I realise this is a subjective question but from a "depreciation" and maintenance point of view which of these 2 model would I best concentrate looking for?
Cheers Dale
dB0WM4N said:
Hi Guys,
New to PH and hopefully soon to Cerberas :-). I will (like most of you I imagine), be looking for a car to use during the summer and lay to bed in the winter so not very many miles being put on the car. I would like to think that (at best) wont loose any money and possibly gain in value, so was looking for either a 4.5LW or a Red Rose.
I realise this is a subjective question but from a "depreciation" and maintenance point of view which of these 2 model would I best concentrate looking for?
Cheers Dale
Better off just finding the nicest car you can.New to PH and hopefully soon to Cerberas :-). I will (like most of you I imagine), be looking for a car to use during the summer and lay to bed in the winter so not very many miles being put on the car. I would like to think that (at best) wont loose any money and possibly gain in value, so was looking for either a 4.5LW or a Red Rose.
I realise this is a subjective question but from a "depreciation" and maintenance point of view which of these 2 model would I best concentrate looking for?
Cheers Dale
My preference would be for a V8....a 4.5 if neccessary. The LW bit means next to nothing...30Kg's IIRC...? You will struggle to find a RR...but if you do I guess thats the Cerbera pinacle?
or you could go looking for the last cerbera....where is that at the mo?
peteA said:
Better off just finding the nicest car you can.
My preference would be for a V8....a 4.5 if neccessary. The LW bit means next to nothing...30Kg's IIRC...? You will struggle to find a RR...but if you do I guess thats the Cerbera pinacle?
My preference would be for a V8....a 4.5 if neccessary. The LW bit means next to nothing...30Kg's IIRC...? You will struggle to find a RR...but if you do I guess thats the Cerbera pinacle?
The difference between a sorted 4.5 and a sorted 4.5RR is going to be about 15-20 bhp (and several £grand). IMO by the time you have eaten a decent lunch the LWs would be wasted too.
If it was my money, Id be looking for a sorted 4.5 and save the extra £s for a slush fund (and the annual PH European Cerb tour
)FUBAR said:
peteA said:
Better off just finding the nicest car you can.
My preference would be for a V8....a 4.5 if neccessary. The LW bit means next to nothing...30Kg's IIRC...? You will struggle to find a RR...but if you do I guess thats the Cerbera pinacle?
My preference would be for a V8....a 4.5 if neccessary. The LW bit means next to nothing...30Kg's IIRC...? You will struggle to find a RR...but if you do I guess thats the Cerbera pinacle?
The difference between a sorted 4.5 and a sorted 4.5RR is going to be about 15-20 bhp (and several £grand). IMO by the time you have eaten a decent lunch the LWs would be wasted too.
If it was my money, Id be looking for a sorted 4.5 and save the extra £s for a slush fund (and the annual PH European Cerb tour
)When we got the Chimaera 9.5 years ago we almost immediately started looking for a Cerb too. We didn't look hard admittedly and some months where we didn't look at all.
To start with we were very specific, it had to be a 4.5RR in certain colours, then 4.5LW, then realised if we were ever going to get one it would just have to be a 4.5.
Now got a lovely, well looked after 1998 4.5, not LW or RR clearly but still a great car.
Don't get hung up too much on specifics as the chances of finding it are slim. Find a good'un and love it.
Thanks for the replies. While I appreciate what you're telling me regarding the cost v weight / performance saving, I was thinking more of the depreciation / assett side of the car giving the "rareness" of the LW or RR compared to the "normal" 4.5's? (bit like the SE Griffiths being rarer and therefore more valuable) ... or am I barking up the wrong tree and all 4.5's will hold their value as much?
dB0WM4N said:
Thanks for the replies. While I appreciate what you're telling me regarding the cost v weight / performance saving, I was thinking more of the depreciation / assett side of the car giving the "rareness" of the LW or RR compared to the "normal" 4.5's? (bit like the SE Griffiths being rarer and therefore more valuable) ... or am I barking up the wrong tree and all 4.5's will hold their value as much?
As others have said, just go for the best one you can find. If you are worried about depreciation, and looking at the Cerb as an 'assett' - forget it, It'll cost you an arm and a leg. You buy a Cerbera with your heart, definitely not your head.dB0WM4N said:
Thanks for the replies. While I appreciate what you're telling me regarding the cost v weight / performance saving, I was thinking more of the depreciation / assett side of the car giving the "rareness" of the LW or RR compared to the "normal" 4.5's? (bit like the SE Griffiths being rarer and therefore more valuable) ... or am I barking up the wrong tree and all 4.5's will hold their value as much?
I think as always with 'classics' get as original car as possible, in the best condition with low to reasonable mileage, and a good maintenance history. Colour does have an effect on value but many on here will tell you that yellow ones are fastest! Mines a grey 4.2 BTW but still ruddy fast and gives me a grin still after 3 years. If your buying for investment sake do remember the running costs probably will out run the asset, just get it for fun and get used to exercising your wallet. 
Demondad said:
dB0WM4N said:
Thanks for the replies. While I appreciate what you're telling me regarding the cost v weight / performance saving, I was thinking more of the depreciation / assett side of the car giving the "rareness" of the LW or RR compared to the "normal" 4.5's? (bit like the SE Griffiths being rarer and therefore more valuable) ... or am I barking up the wrong tree and all 4.5's will hold their value as much?
I think as always with 'classics' get as original car as possible, in the best condition with low to reasonable mileage, and a good maintenance history. Colour does have an effect on value but many on here will tell you that yellow ones are fastest! Mines a grey 4.2 BTW but still ruddy fast and gives me a grin still after 3 years. If your buying for investment sake do remember the running costs probably will out run the asset, just get it for fun and get used to exercising your wallet. 4.5RR is a great car. Mine is a lateish one and is just a better car than my last two earlier 4.5s.
Personally I think a good later cerb is going to be better than a good earlier cerb. It will just be better screwed together, steer better and if its a RR will have a bit more power. But as people say you can close the power gap considerably with remaps on a standard 4.5
The thing with a RR is that you probably dont want to go short induction as it strips torque and makes it more peaky (or so I am told). Mine is on standard induction and get 436bhp albeit had an hour on the rolling road to adjust the fuelling after some headwork (to fix poorly cast and poorly treated heads).
If I threw some more money at it (and I tend to throw money at cerbs :-) ) I could probably get over 450 bhp but to be honest my pants are clearly very baggy as it is.
Look for one that has good suspension upgrades and has had plenty lavished on it by a PHeader.
A good red rose could set you back £20k to £25K though.
Personally I think a good later cerb is going to be better than a good earlier cerb. It will just be better screwed together, steer better and if its a RR will have a bit more power. But as people say you can close the power gap considerably with remaps on a standard 4.5
The thing with a RR is that you probably dont want to go short induction as it strips torque and makes it more peaky (or so I am told). Mine is on standard induction and get 436bhp albeit had an hour on the rolling road to adjust the fuelling after some headwork (to fix poorly cast and poorly treated heads).
If I threw some more money at it (and I tend to throw money at cerbs :-) ) I could probably get over 450 bhp but to be honest my pants are clearly very baggy as it is.
Look for one that has good suspension upgrades and has had plenty lavished on it by a PHeader.
A good red rose could set you back £20k to £25K though.
dB0WM4N said:
There's an RR on ebay atm ... http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&am...
Been for sale for many many months. Higher price than current owner paid from memory. Also was up for sale within weeks of current owner buying. From memory!Suspect the owner still uses it and they are trying their luck at that price?
dB0WM4N said:
Mr Cerbera said:
dB0WM4N said:
..... but from a "depreciation" and maintenance point of view which of these 2 model would I best concentrate looking for?
Buy something else !When I was looking and researching the only difference between a LW and RR was the button and some claim of reshaped inlet and exhaust ports
I found an old car magazine article that said any 4.5 could have the RR for about 2500
Weight save about 40kg I think the main things are the slight styling alterations and that RR might have some suspension tweaks because they are late models
I bought the nicest 4.5 I could and it ace! It's a LW
I found an old car magazine article that said any 4.5 could have the RR for about 2500
Weight save about 40kg I think the main things are the slight styling alterations and that RR might have some suspension tweaks because they are late models
I bought the nicest 4.5 I could and it ace! It's a LW
Chewitt said:
When I was looking and researching the only difference between a LW and RR was the button and some claim of reshaped inlet and exhaust ports
I found an old car magazine article that said any 4.5 could have the RR for about 2500
Weight save about 40kg I think the main things are the slight styling alterations and that RR might have some suspension tweaks because they are late models
I bought the nicest 4.5 I could and it ace! It's a LW
Your research wasnt quite right. I found an old car magazine article that said any 4.5 could have the RR for about 2500
Weight save about 40kg I think the main things are the slight styling alterations and that RR might have some suspension tweaks because they are late models
I bought the nicest 4.5 I could and it ace! It's a LW
Afaik the 4.5 and RR's of the same eras are identical except for the RR having higher compression, some headwork/porting and a different map (and the button).
They have same suspension afaik (although late cerbs have improved steering).
The weight on the 4.5 and RR would be the same too. The LW element doesnt save weight either.
Edited by Gazzab on Sunday 17th October 08:45
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