Advice needed - wrecked engine

[floatingjimi]

Cerbera 4.5rr had a top end rebuild. The engine work was guaranteed for two years.
The car then had an induction and remap and worked fine.
After only a 2000 miles the engine has had a catastrophic failure with part of the engine coming through the engine casing.

Am I right in saying that it is worth getting the vehicle inspected - and if yes - by whom - it has not been touched since the incident.
The people who have done the work are pointing towards the induction and remap - obviously and are willing to take the car back but only to cover the parts they have replaced.

I presume that an expert would be able to look and say if it is as a result of poor engine work or other?
And also if it is as a result of poor work then surely they woud be liable for the resulting damage.

Looking for help on this one please

[high52kojak]

Do you know which part of the engine has made an exit through the casing?

[floatingjimi]

I will post pics

[floatingjimi]

con rod cap

[gruffalo]

depends on what caused the failure, had this on an XJS once, chucked a con rod out the side of the block, on inspection it had been assembled incorrectly but it took the garage so long to settle that we ended up sorting it through legal routes, engineers reprt was key to getting it sorted.

Did a Cam snap? there has been a spate of this recently. I can not see how a re map and short induction kit could cause such a major engine failure.

Where is the car, can you get it to a specialist to get it stripped down to see what caused the problem?

[floatingjimi]

[floatingjimi]

[floatingjimi]

[floatingjimi]

My thoughts exactly re the engineers report however I need to be sure re this - TVR Specialist or any Engineer.
I dont want someone saying later that a tvr sepc would have picked up on something that a standard sepc would not.
With the figures associated with this - dont want to get it wrong.

[floatingjimi]

spec sorry - typo tastic

[Alan Kee]

Does the ecu software for the ecu give you any clues as to what happened immediately before the failure? does it have data logging? I know you can look at the fuelling table things. maybe post up screenshots of the fuelling and fault code screens and see if anyone spots anything amiss?

[ridds]

No joy with either here I would suspect.

Rebuild was top end and so they would not have touched the rods.

Induction kit and remap are an upgrade and therefore not waranted really.

I suspect, upping output has wiped out a bearing or you have suffered oil starvation which wiped out the bearing.

[Alexdaredevilz]

Im pretty sure the mapping side of things will only affect the air/fuel which would mean it it were to give up it would seize the cylinder bore (heat seize) or melt pistons,
That to me looks like nothing to do with mapping even if wrong

Id send it back to the engine builders

[Alexdaredevilz]

ridds said:

Rebuild was top end and so they would not have touched the rods.

Looks like it was on it way out

[floatingjimi]

dont have a copy of the software - can I download it from somewhere -

[floatingjimi]

found it

[stuthemong]

That's a tough one. Really depends on the wording of the warranty from the builders, I'd say. Problem is, during a top end rebuild they wouldn't have gone anywhere near the area that failed, unless they specifically warrantied the whole engine, not just the top end, I think you'll have to eat this one yourself.

Do you know if during your top end rebuild they dropped the crank to inspect the lot, or did they just lift the heads?

If a cam snapped or something and punched valves, then that would certainly be a different matter.


Stu

[APMAUTO]

stuthemong said:

That's a tough one. Really depends on the wording of the warranty from the builders, I'd say. Problem is, during a top end rebuild they wouldn't have gone anywhere near the area that failed, unless they specifically warrantied the whole engine, not just the top end, I think you'll have to eat this one yourself.

Do you know if during your top end rebuild they dropped the crank to inspect the lot, or did they just lift the heads?

If a cam snapped or something and punched valves, then that would certainly be a different matter.


Stu

have to agree with that i think you need to go over your invoice to see exactly the work that was carried out first and then get the engine inspected to determine the damage and a possible cause. Don't rule out a mapping issue either being a r/r the compression ratio is higher and therefore the risk of detonation is higher(which is a killer of big end bearings)i have seen a few engines do similar in quite a short time after having been remapped( usually No 4 cyliner failing first)i've then rebuilt and mapped them and are still going strong now and a good amount of them are being well used!!

happy to give advice if wanted just PM me

andy

[floatingjimi]

Thanks Andy will give you a call

[fatjon]

Ramping up the advance without dealing with combustion chamber shape, squish and fueling can cause big end failure due to detonation. The clues will be in the piston crowns. If they look like they have been shot blasted with scrap iron you may have a case. But without this evidence you cannot assume that the remap is the cause, there are many reasons an engine can let go and you have to be fair minded and not unreasonably litigious. A print out of the map and a engineers report on the piston crowns should make the decision easier. Maybe one more thing to check is has the RPM limit been raised excessively. What consitutes excessively is a matter of opinion though.