A whole heap of questions....
Discussion
OK, let me apologise in advance for what will probably end up being a longer post than originally intended.
Exotica (in the form of early Astons) aside, for the past 15 years there have been two cars that I repeatedly come back to with an irrational (?) desire to own. One is a hot 7, the other is a Cerbera. Both very different propositions I know, but there's something immensely attractive about proper cars... cars that force you to think for yourself. This year, assuming a new garage also becomes a reality, I should be in a position to make one of these arrive so I'm spending the next couple of months exploring both in more detail.
My gut feeling is that I'd get more track time with a Cat but would, overall, get more use out of a Cerb through increased road time (small child will fit in back, thus making it suitable for the days I need to drop him off at childcare or for the 3 of us at weekends - not to mention the unpredictability of the British weather and the impact that might have on one's propensity to leave a Cat outside work all day).
Budget seems to be in line with what folk are selling for via the classified (or even some dealers). However, I was hoping a couple of you might be able to shed some light on the potential downsides/reality of ownership... for example:
o What are the big bills that come along (either planned or unexpected)?
o Has parts availability become an issue?
o Does unwanted attention outweigh positive attention - or is this simply addressed by common sense?
o If well cared for, just how true is the stereotype about reliability? (SWMBO convinced that every other journey will involve the AA - which I rather doubt)?
o Having looked at some of the rebuild threads, is the issue of body-off chassis repairs becoming a fairly frequent occurrence as the cars age and to what extent can this be pre-planned and what does this sort of work usually cost?
o Are there any "avoid at all costs" variants?
Also in terms of purchase/upkeep:
o Are Cerbs generally "honest" when viewed or are any rust traps and the such well hidden (or is it easy for vendor to hide a dog of a car)? And lastly, particularly if there are owners around Cheshire, is there anyone in the NW who you'd trust to pre-purchase inspect and/or maintain a Cerbera or is it a case of using the firms still around Blackpool (which I'm more than open to)? (I'm honest enough with myself that I probably have neither the time nor expertise to do the car justice without extra support)
o Given that I see little point in buying one and having it rot around me, how realistic is an annual maintenance budget of say £3k (probably ~3k miles/pa)?
Lastly, does anyone know if any cars have come onto to hire market yet (or even if any of the dealers will offer extended test drives, even if there's a cost, to someone serious about a purchase)? I know there was a thread a while ago which drew a blank but I'd ideally like to spend a day or two with one before committing.
Thanks in advance for any comments - all very appreciated.
Exotica (in the form of early Astons) aside, for the past 15 years there have been two cars that I repeatedly come back to with an irrational (?) desire to own. One is a hot 7, the other is a Cerbera. Both very different propositions I know, but there's something immensely attractive about proper cars... cars that force you to think for yourself. This year, assuming a new garage also becomes a reality, I should be in a position to make one of these arrive so I'm spending the next couple of months exploring both in more detail.
My gut feeling is that I'd get more track time with a Cat but would, overall, get more use out of a Cerb through increased road time (small child will fit in back, thus making it suitable for the days I need to drop him off at childcare or for the 3 of us at weekends - not to mention the unpredictability of the British weather and the impact that might have on one's propensity to leave a Cat outside work all day).
Budget seems to be in line with what folk are selling for via the classified (or even some dealers). However, I was hoping a couple of you might be able to shed some light on the potential downsides/reality of ownership... for example:
o What are the big bills that come along (either planned or unexpected)?
o Has parts availability become an issue?
o Does unwanted attention outweigh positive attention - or is this simply addressed by common sense?
o If well cared for, just how true is the stereotype about reliability? (SWMBO convinced that every other journey will involve the AA - which I rather doubt)?
o Having looked at some of the rebuild threads, is the issue of body-off chassis repairs becoming a fairly frequent occurrence as the cars age and to what extent can this be pre-planned and what does this sort of work usually cost?
o Are there any "avoid at all costs" variants?
Also in terms of purchase/upkeep:
o Are Cerbs generally "honest" when viewed or are any rust traps and the such well hidden (or is it easy for vendor to hide a dog of a car)? And lastly, particularly if there are owners around Cheshire, is there anyone in the NW who you'd trust to pre-purchase inspect and/or maintain a Cerbera or is it a case of using the firms still around Blackpool (which I'm more than open to)? (I'm honest enough with myself that I probably have neither the time nor expertise to do the car justice without extra support)
o Given that I see little point in buying one and having it rot around me, how realistic is an annual maintenance budget of say £3k (probably ~3k miles/pa)?
Lastly, does anyone know if any cars have come onto to hire market yet (or even if any of the dealers will offer extended test drives, even if there's a cost, to someone serious about a purchase)? I know there was a thread a while ago which drew a blank but I'd ideally like to spend a day or two with one before committing.
Thanks in advance for any comments - all very appreciated.
LooneyTunes said:
o What are the big bills that come along (either planned or unexpected)?
Clutch is about £1K and services are not cheap but otherwise no different to any other car.
o Has parts availability become an issue?
No
o Does unwanted attention outweigh positive attention - or is this simply addressed by common sense?
Never had any unwanted attention
o If well cared for, just how true is the stereotype about reliability? (SWMBO convinced that every other journey will involve the AA - which I rather doubt)?
Looking through the history of my car In the last 112 years the number of breakdowns has been one for a burst water hose. I have only owned it for 2 years but it has never let me down. There are cars owned by people on here that have done over 100K Miles and are still strong relaible cars.
o Having looked at some of the rebuild threads, is the issue of body-off chassis repairs becoming a fairly frequent occurrence as the cars age and to what extent can this be pre-planned and what does this sort of work usually cost?
Chassis replacement £3-4K, but there are plenty of cars out there that have no chassis problems at all.
o Are there any "avoid at all costs" variants?
No, the SP6 models are best if they have had an engine rebuild either at TVR Power or STR8SIX as the original lump had some issues that are fixed in the re-build.
Mine lives out side on the drive and is dry inside. I can hold a conversation with my passenger at 90+ and drive for hundreds of mile across Europe with out feeling tired. The cars you are thinking of are very different but the same as well, both will make you grin insanely but in the Cerb you can do it every day and you will not get bored, the Cerb is a true GT the Cat is a true sports car. This said I do actually get bored but only when I have reached my destination, I just want to get back in and drive home again;-)Clutch is about £1K and services are not cheap but otherwise no different to any other car.
o Has parts availability become an issue?
No
o Does unwanted attention outweigh positive attention - or is this simply addressed by common sense?
Never had any unwanted attention
o If well cared for, just how true is the stereotype about reliability? (SWMBO convinced that every other journey will involve the AA - which I rather doubt)?
Looking through the history of my car In the last 112 years the number of breakdowns has been one for a burst water hose. I have only owned it for 2 years but it has never let me down. There are cars owned by people on here that have done over 100K Miles and are still strong relaible cars.
o Having looked at some of the rebuild threads, is the issue of body-off chassis repairs becoming a fairly frequent occurrence as the cars age and to what extent can this be pre-planned and what does this sort of work usually cost?
Chassis replacement £3-4K, but there are plenty of cars out there that have no chassis problems at all.
o Are there any "avoid at all costs" variants?
No, the SP6 models are best if they have had an engine rebuild either at TVR Power or STR8SIX as the original lump had some issues that are fixed in the re-build.
Thanks - that's useful. And it the ability to use everyday is most definitely part of the appeal (although isn't the main factor by far).
Out of interest, do the SP6 problems tend to be terminal if not addressed prior to rebuild - i.e. if I see a tidy SP6 which hasn't had a rebuild, do I effectively need to add this in to the purchase price to avoid the costs of a whole new engine?
Out of interest, do the SP6 problems tend to be terminal if not addressed prior to rebuild - i.e. if I see a tidy SP6 which hasn't had a rebuild, do I effectively need to add this in to the purchase price to avoid the costs of a whole new engine?
Do what I do, have both 
They're different beasts, and neither can do what the other can for you. The Cerb's more practical, more comfortable, can have my lad in the back, is faster at high speed and scares me silly. The 7 handles like a Cerb never could and turns you into a driving god at any speed.
The 7 can cost as much or as little as you chose to own - basic costs are low and little will *need* doing but you can do so much with it. The Cerb is unlikely to be cheap in comparison...
They're different beasts, and neither can do what the other can for you. The Cerb's more practical, more comfortable, can have my lad in the back, is faster at high speed and scares me silly. The 7 handles like a Cerb never could and turns you into a driving god at any speed.
The 7 can cost as much or as little as you chose to own - basic costs are low and little will *need* doing but you can do so much with it. The Cerb is unlikely to be cheap in comparison...
LooneyTunes said:
Thanks - that's useful. And it the ability to use everyday is most definitely part of the appeal (although isn't the main factor by far).
Out of interest, do the SP6 problems tend to be terminal if not addressed prior to rebuild - i.e. if I see a tidy SP6 which hasn't had a rebuild, do I effectively need to add this in to the purchase price to avoid the costs of a whole new engine?
An SP6 could be solid but it would be worth keeping a few grand in the bank just in case.Out of interest, do the SP6 problems tend to be terminal if not addressed prior to rebuild - i.e. if I see a tidy SP6 which hasn't had a rebuild, do I effectively need to add this in to the purchase price to avoid the costs of a whole new engine?
A rebuilt SP6 can also be made extreamly powerful in the right hands, Jason at STR8SIX is brilliant with these and his rebuild comes with a multi year warrantee.
supersix said:
Do what I do, have both
Not an unlikely scenario given time - a case of creeping boundaries, my good chap! I have a figure I'm comfortable spending every few years on cars but with my daily driver having done very few miles I see no reason to change it any time soon. Hence a little more cash available for toys.
My current thinking is to look at buying a Cerbera sooner rather than later whilst hiring Caterhams for track days.
gruffalo said:
An SP6 could be solid but it would be worth keeping a few grand in the bank just in case.
A rebuilt SP6 can also be made extreamly powerful in the right hands, Jason at STR8SIX is brilliant with these and his rebuild comes with a multi year warrantee.
Good to know - thank you.A rebuilt SP6 can also be made extreamly powerful in the right hands, Jason at STR8SIX is brilliant with these and his rebuild comes with a multi year warrantee.
Regular use prevents a lot of problems.Also check the condition of the chassis.They are now at an age where rot is beginning to appear in quite a few cars.
From my point of view.I would have seriously regretted never owning one.Any true car enthusiast must own one once in there life.I had six happy years with mine.
From my point of view.I would have seriously regretted never owning one.Any true car enthusiast must own one once in there life.I had six happy years with mine.
Graham 
o What are the big bills that come along (either planned or unexpected)?
If you look over the various threads - this will probably come down to three categories:
1. Engine / transmission: AJP engines generally reliable if well looked after. S6 has it's own thread - loads of info there but basically S6 Cerbs are generally a bit cheaper for equivilent age / mileage - keep the difference for potential engine bill; or look to buy one with a rebuild by reputable TVR specialist. Clutch replacement could be an unexpeced one - not sure of exact costs but budget a grand (and get upgaded raceproved one when you do)
2. Chassis: as frequently commented on - thie "hidden" issue that you should really have investigated when buying a Cerb.
3. Other general issues: brake master cyl or slave seems to be an issue; these are now getting on for 8 - 15 years old so budget for fuel lines, brake lines, brake overhaul etc to bring to tip top condition, and also if on original shocks will need replacing / upgrading by now
o Has parts availability become an issue?
No - plently of specialists out there.
o Does unwanted attention outweigh positive attention - or is this simply addressed by common sense?
Get used to being the centre of attention when driving a Cerbera - not for shy retiring sorts!! However, found that 99% positive - and that much of it is completely unexpected: ranging from being complimented on such a lovely car, to kids going "cor, a real TVR!"
o If well cared for, just how true is the stereotype about reliability? (SWMBO convinced that every other journey will involve the AA - which I rather doubt)?
It is a high performance car, and will need looking after more than an average car. However, with regular maintenance they shouldn't break down EVERY trip Seems to be issues like the "big fuse" that can leave you stranded (very cheap part best to treat as service replaceable item). I've been let down twice in two years, once by the big fuse, other by gearbox problem (but don't think this is common. This is over approx 10K miles
It's a great car to own and drive - suggest that you test drive a few (they all feel different) to see what suits you. Good luck
If you look over the various threads - this will probably come down to three categories:
1. Engine / transmission: AJP engines generally reliable if well looked after. S6 has it's own thread - loads of info there but basically S6 Cerbs are generally a bit cheaper for equivilent age / mileage - keep the difference for potential engine bill; or look to buy one with a rebuild by reputable TVR specialist. Clutch replacement could be an unexpeced one - not sure of exact costs but budget a grand (and get upgaded raceproved one when you do)
2. Chassis: as frequently commented on - thie "hidden" issue that you should really have investigated when buying a Cerb.
3. Other general issues: brake master cyl or slave seems to be an issue; these are now getting on for 8 - 15 years old so budget for fuel lines, brake lines, brake overhaul etc to bring to tip top condition, and also if on original shocks will need replacing / upgrading by now
o Has parts availability become an issue?
No - plently of specialists out there.
o Does unwanted attention outweigh positive attention - or is this simply addressed by common sense?
Get used to being the centre of attention when driving a Cerbera - not for shy retiring sorts!! However, found that 99% positive - and that much of it is completely unexpected: ranging from being complimented on such a lovely car, to kids going "cor, a real TVR!"
o If well cared for, just how true is the stereotype about reliability? (SWMBO convinced that every other journey will involve the AA - which I rather doubt)?
It is a high performance car, and will need looking after more than an average car. However, with regular maintenance they shouldn't break down EVERY trip
Seems to be issues like the "big fuse" that can leave you stranded (very cheap part best to treat as service replaceable item). I've been let down twice in two years, once by the big fuse, other by gearbox problem (but don't think this is common. This is over approx 10K milesIt's a great car to own and drive - suggest that you test drive a few (they all feel different) to see what suits you. Good luck
mikeinsheffield said:
Seems to be issues like the "big fuse" that can leave you stranded (very cheap part best to treat as service replaceable item).
Thanks - BTW, seen a few references to the "big fuse". In the event that you get caught out, is it field replaceable by the AA/RAC or such a swine to get to that the car needs to be up on stands/ramp?LooneyTunes said:
Thanks - BTW, seen a few references to the "big fuse". In the event that you get caught out, is it field replaceable by the AA/RAC or such a swine to get to that the car needs to be up on stands/ramp?
It sits at the back of the engine. The scuttle panel needs to be removed to get to it properly. No problem for yourself to do. Keep some spare.grahamn said:
Take the Cerb on track might well suprise you, mine will keep up with my mates caterham round Cadwell and he isn't slow.
Depends on the track and the 7 (ETA: and the drivers...), in my experience. The Cerb will hold up the 7 in the bends and pull away on the straights. I guarantee on any half decent b-road where vmax matters less the 7 will win 
BLUETHUNDER said:
t sits at the back of the engine. The scuttle panel needs to be removed to get to it properly. No problem for yourself to do. Keep some spare.
Thanks. Fortunately - and I may live to regret this - electrics don't tend to faze me too much but it does irritate at times when sometimes you need to rebuild half a car to change a super cheap component.supersix said:
Depends on the track and the 7 (ETA: and the drivers...), in my experience. The Cerb will hold up the 7 in the bends and pull away on the straights. I guarantee on any half decent b-road where vmax matters less the 7 will win
On B roads I will agree with you, but on track a well set up & driven cerb will stay with a caterham through the bends.Gassing Station | Cerbera | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff