how reliable is f1 g/box on 355
Discussion
hi guys have read few threads regarding the two types of gearbox and have taken this on board,but would like some feedback on how reliable the f1 type is,as i would have thought if it does go wrong its going to be expensive,i am looking round at the mo so need to decide which one to go for cheers ancol
My F1 box is great but somewhat lower miles at 28k. Bear in mind the gearbox and clutch are in effect the same as a manual, the only differences there is a hydraulic pump that drives the actuators.
The pumps can fail, normally due to the relay sticking closed and allowing the pump to run continuously and burn out. These days though you can buy the pumps cheaply as an Alfa or Maserati part or have them repaired for not much money
The pumps can fail, normally due to the relay sticking closed and allowing the pump to run continuously and burn out. These days though you can buy the pumps cheaply as an Alfa or Maserati part or have them repaired for not much money
I had the F1 in the last of the 99 series.
The pump can fail, as the previous poster pointed out, the relay is not up to the job, gets hot and sticks- the result is that a pump that is not classed as continuous running- runs continuously and burns out the pump. My understanding now is that the 360 pump can be used in its place when it fails.
Its not just the pump though, its the electronics, solenoids, actuators that leak( even when new) you can spend as much sorting out these peripherals when it goes wrong than rebuilding the entire gearbox.
Having said that the system in the 355 is dire- even when adjusted properly and, with the benefit of hindsight I would never suggest that one buys an F1 car of that era. the problem with all the electronic systems is that technology dates them so badly. in that unit there is a dreaful lack of consistency which makes it- well plain nasty
The pump can fail, as the previous poster pointed out, the relay is not up to the job, gets hot and sticks- the result is that a pump that is not classed as continuous running- runs continuously and burns out the pump. My understanding now is that the 360 pump can be used in its place when it fails.
Its not just the pump though, its the electronics, solenoids, actuators that leak( even when new) you can spend as much sorting out these peripherals when it goes wrong than rebuilding the entire gearbox.
Having said that the system in the 355 is dire- even when adjusted properly and, with the benefit of hindsight I would never suggest that one buys an F1 car of that era. the problem with all the electronic systems is that technology dates them so badly. in that unit there is a dreaful lack of consistency which makes it- well plain nasty
Edited by 355f on Wednesday 13th July 16:21
Edited by 355f on Wednesday 13th July 16:46
Totally disagree ..I have an F1 355, having owned a BMW CSL/M6 fezza 612 etc etc when I wanted a 355 i wanted an F1. I cannot be bothered with that wiggle stick anymore, and to be honest at 6'5" I knew I would struggle for knee room and it would be a hassle changing gear ( 36" inside leg ). I find the F1 fine, I like the fact it takes a little bit of 'nursing' and learning to get a good shift, it feels more like you are interacting with the car, rather than the current DSG/PDK twin clutch jobbies. Even space permitting I wouldnt have a manual...its so much nicer both hands on the wheel when flipping through the gears & cornering.
As for reliability, yes F1 pumps/clutches etc, but I am another without a problem as many have found, and in the forums I do not see a lot of bad news on the F1 box at all, so reliability is just not an issue as to which box to chose, go with what floats your boat.
Only thing I miss on the F1 box is that it is pre the lovely blips that SMG's/sequentials/etc do automatically on the downshifts, but heyho small matter
As for reliability, yes F1 pumps/clutches etc, but I am another without a problem as many have found, and in the forums I do not see a lot of bad news on the F1 box at all, so reliability is just not an issue as to which box to chose, go with what floats your boat.
Only thing I miss on the F1 box is that it is pre the lovely blips that SMG's/sequentials/etc do automatically on the downshifts, but heyho small matter
I had a similar nasty experience to 355f when I had a 355 F1 but it was many years ago (the car was approx four years old with 13k miles at the time). It shifted terribly, would cut out and do random things at odd moments.
Perhaps as the cars get older specialists have understood and worked through the various electronic issues? It was frustrating for me at the time that a certain Grey Pope John dealer kept getting the car in repeatedly and could not sort it.
It's interesting that now many people are saying good things about 355 F1's. This was not my experience at all.
Perhaps as the cars get older specialists have understood and worked through the various electronic issues? It was frustrating for me at the time that a certain Grey Pope John dealer kept getting the car in repeatedly and could not sort it.
It's interesting that now many people are saying good things about 355 F1's. This was not my experience at all.
Thanks for replies guys a bit of a mixed bag,will mull it over,I suppose in reality I will buy the car on condition, history etc so could be either really but ws nice to have feedback, that's what I like about these forums there's a lot of knowledge that's comes through, it's a bit like tvr stories of woe I have had a cerbera now fir six years and hardly had any problems luck of the draw I suppose, but time to change now gotta scratch the Ferrari itch.
Get that itch scratched!...What I was trying to say is that I think with the F1/manual choice dont decide based on reliability as I just dont see it as an issue. It would be a shame to go for a manual if you liked F1 shift just because you were unsure of its longevity.
To be honest most people are pretty distinct into one camp or the other,for exmaple I would never drive another manual if I get my way, but there are those that hate F1 style boxes and insist on manuals.
I used to have a BMW CSL & to be honest got fed up with all the scaremongering that went on with those & the iffy rear diffs, same thing when the M3 SMG first came out..' oh best get a manual, hose SMG boxes wont last'..utter tripe, people with limited knowledge trying to impress & scarmonger on internet forums.
You buy a 96 ferrari you may have some issues you may not, like many so far my 99 F1 GTS has performed faultlessly in 18 months 3k miles of ownership. As you rightly say try find a good one, if u get the chance drive an F1 and a manual and make your mind up then...but like I say DO NOT make it up becuase of internet forum scaremongering from the manual crowd!!
To be honest most people are pretty distinct into one camp or the other,for exmaple I would never drive another manual if I get my way, but there are those that hate F1 style boxes and insist on manuals.
I used to have a BMW CSL & to be honest got fed up with all the scaremongering that went on with those & the iffy rear diffs, same thing when the M3 SMG first came out..' oh best get a manual, hose SMG boxes wont last'..utter tripe, people with limited knowledge trying to impress & scarmonger on internet forums.
You buy a 96 ferrari you may have some issues you may not, like many so far my 99 F1 GTS has performed faultlessly in 18 months 3k miles of ownership. As you rightly say try find a good one, if u get the chance drive an F1 and a manual and make your mind up then...but like I say DO NOT make it up becuase of internet forum scaremongering from the manual crowd!!
No one a seriously suggest they are even close to the f1 gearboxes of today- for more valid info better to go on f chat, there are many stories there about the faults you may encounter.
Some owners do so little miles that its difficult to get valid opinions, the specialists can sort them out but my experience having been stuck in gear in london was not a good one
Some owners do so little miles that its difficult to get valid opinions, the specialists can sort them out but my experience having been stuck in gear in london was not a good one
Just remember cars are meant to be driven. The F1 pump is hydraulic and like anything hydraulic will fail with little or no use. Like the rams that hold your bonnet/boot up. You go a couple of years without opening the boot and when you do open it the thing starts to close on you. I had the same decision when changing to an F1 car. I had already had 2 man 355s. I looked through all the threads and noticed that all the problem cars had done very low miles. I even bought a used item from Eurospares as a backup, which is still sitting in the oil-filled protection bag some 6 years later. Mine is a very smooth change and runs perfectly. You just need them setting up right. Karl Verdi is a master.
JasonSF said:
Just remember cars are meant to be driven. The F1 pump is hydraulic and like anything hydraulic will fail with little or no use. Like the rams that hold your bonnet/boot up. You go a couple of years without opening the boot and when you do open it the thing starts to close on you. I had the same decision when changing to an F1 car. I had already had 2 man 355s. I looked through all the threads and noticed that all the problem cars had done very low miles. I even bought a used item from Eurospares as a backup, which is still sitting in the oil-filled protection bag some 6 years later. Mine is a very smooth change and runs perfectly. You just need them setting up right. Karl Verdi is a master.
indeed Karl is great, he did mine but it was still very poor- better get a manual car without the problems!mine was one of the last ever 355s made and i found the f1 box fine. You have to learn to drive it to get a smooth response but i liked that - something which has been progressively tuned out of the later versions. i always worried about the actuator going as at the time it was still expensive but didnt have any issues
355 f1 spider i would have again, i miss mine even though i have moved on to "better" cars since
355 f1 spider i would have again, i miss mine even though i have moved on to "better" cars since
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