Vivaro 1.9 diesel van injector question help
Discussion
My Vivaro 1.9 diesel van had become very hard to start when left over night and would only start if a squirt of brake clean in the air intake, would then fire up ok and run ok, I read on the net that it would be a good idea to do a leak back test, so purchased the kit and done a test, the test suggested to run the engine for 30 seconds and see if any of the vessels filled up quicker than others, 30 secs would not fill the tubes to the bottles so ran the engine for 2 mins, the containers filled very slightly as you can see in the photo and all fairly evenly, would you say that the injectors are fine after that test ?
I have also fitted a new mass air flow meter and a new battery a couple of weeks ago when the problem started just in case they were the problem, battery was getting sluggish and had a code reader put on and it said it had lots of faults for the maf so changed that too.
The other day the right side injector started leaking badly with a loud click/hiss and fumes coming up from the base of injector, van still drivable but noisy, purchased a second hand injector and new copper washers and today removed the injector and fitted new copper washer, the number on the injectors did not really match that well (see photos) so refitted original injector as the leak back test showed it was probably OK
If that injector had been leaking very slightly even though I could not hear it making a leaking noise cause the bad starting when cold?
What numbers on the injectors are the part numbers? I see both say 445 110 would you say that both of them are the same ?
I have also fitted a new mass air flow meter and a new battery a couple of weeks ago when the problem started just in case they were the problem, battery was getting sluggish and had a code reader put on and it said it had lots of faults for the maf so changed that too.
The other day the right side injector started leaking badly with a loud click/hiss and fumes coming up from the base of injector, van still drivable but noisy, purchased a second hand injector and new copper washers and today removed the injector and fitted new copper washer, the number on the injectors did not really match that well (see photos) so refitted original injector as the leak back test showed it was probably OK
If that injector had been leaking very slightly even though I could not hear it making a leaking noise cause the bad starting when cold?
What numbers on the injectors are the part numbers? I see both say 445 110 would you say that both of them are the same ?
Edited by snowwolf on Sunday 27th December 22:46
When you first come to it in the morning does the priming gland feel ok ? They can fail and let fuel drain back overnight . You didn't say which engine but as you've got an injector out I'm assuming it's the earlier belt version . Wiring harnesses are really bad for corrosion with the two multiplugs under the fuse box causing all manor of issues. I've had one with similar issues caused by the harness rubbing through on top of the gearbox after a gearbox swap causing some odd temp sensor readings .
One thing that is a little unusual is the injector coding.
Diesel injectors can't be made to the tolerances modern diesels need, so when they are made, they are flow tested, and any differences are noted down as the injector coding.
In the first pic, it is that number ASZCCT.
Once the ECU knows how far away from ideal it is, it'll apply an adjustment to get it on track (and it also monitors it when running and applies a further correction to account for wear and tear)
The odd thing is the second picture doesn't have an injector code on it
The Bosch part numbers for those injectors are-
0445 110 110 (Bosch)/ 82 00 100 272 (Renault) for the top one
and 0445 110 146(Bosch) / 82 00 238 528 (Renault) for the bottom one.
The long and short of it is- they aren't the same injector, and if yours is the top one, you might need the injector coding to be done to let the ECU know the values are different.
You'd never come across one second hand with the same coding, and sometimes you might be lucky and it might handle a replaced injector if the adjustment was similar between them.
There aren't any decoders, so it's lucky dip, see how well it works, and see about getting the coding done to square everything up.
Diesel injectors can't be made to the tolerances modern diesels need, so when they are made, they are flow tested, and any differences are noted down as the injector coding.
In the first pic, it is that number ASZCCT.
Once the ECU knows how far away from ideal it is, it'll apply an adjustment to get it on track (and it also monitors it when running and applies a further correction to account for wear and tear)
The odd thing is the second picture doesn't have an injector code on it
The Bosch part numbers for those injectors are-
0445 110 110 (Bosch)/ 82 00 100 272 (Renault) for the top one
and 0445 110 146(Bosch) / 82 00 238 528 (Renault) for the bottom one.
The long and short of it is- they aren't the same injector, and if yours is the top one, you might need the injector coding to be done to let the ECU know the values are different.
You'd never come across one second hand with the same coding, and sometimes you might be lucky and it might handle a replaced injector if the adjustment was similar between them.
There aren't any decoders, so it's lucky dip, see how well it works, and see about getting the coding done to square everything up.
Definitely a giveaway there with the injector codes - one being coded and one not means one of those injectors is not intended for your engine.
The leak-off quantities you have there seem to show unacceptable levels of variation - suggesting one or more injector(s) is worn and leaking fuel back to the return line. This would certainly cause difficult starting. I would have them all out and have them reconditioned or replace with a reconditioned set (with appropriate testing to produce new injector codes, if indeed it turns out your engine takes the coded type injectors)
The copper washer on the bottom of the injector is simply the compression seal against the cylinder pressure - the fact one starting 'blowing-by' is more than likely coincidence and is unrelated to internal injector wear. It also wouldn't stop you starting, even with the compression seal leaking badly one one injector, the engine would simply start and run on three cylinders.
The leak-off quantities you have there seem to show unacceptable levels of variation - suggesting one or more injector(s) is worn and leaking fuel back to the return line. This would certainly cause difficult starting. I would have them all out and have them reconditioned or replace with a reconditioned set (with appropriate testing to produce new injector codes, if indeed it turns out your engine takes the coded type injectors)
The copper washer on the bottom of the injector is simply the compression seal against the cylinder pressure - the fact one starting 'blowing-by' is more than likely coincidence and is unrelated to internal injector wear. It also wouldn't stop you starting, even with the compression seal leaking badly one one injector, the engine would simply start and run on three cylinders.
It would be a good idea to get the live data readings first thing when cranking to see what the fuel pressure is.
As above I would imagine there is a leak in the plastic diesel supply pipework letting air in overnight.
Can try priming it with the bulb and see if that improves things as a basic test
As above I would imagine there is a leak in the plastic diesel supply pipework letting air in overnight.
Can try priming it with the bulb and see if that improves things as a basic test
Sorry to bring back an old post but my problem is directly relevant to this one.
My Vivaro 1.9 is difficult to start in the morning and my leak off test fills #2 in 5 minutes at idle, 1 & 3 go to 9.5 and 4 to 9. This gives me a leak off flow rate of double what the original post had so I am concerned that I may have all 4 injectors down. The van has done 150k and I wonder if all 4 dead at 150k normal enough or do I need to worry about the pump breaking up?
Thanks all.....
My Vivaro 1.9 is difficult to start in the morning and my leak off test fills #2 in 5 minutes at idle, 1 & 3 go to 9.5 and 4 to 9. This gives me a leak off flow rate of double what the original post had so I am concerned that I may have all 4 injectors down. The van has done 150k and I wonder if all 4 dead at 150k normal enough or do I need to worry about the pump breaking up?
Thanks all.....
Little Mark said:
Sorry to bring back an old post but my problem is directly relevant to this one.
My Vivaro 1.9 is difficult to start in the morning and my leak off test fills #2 in 5 minutes at idle, 1 & 3 go to 9.5 and 4 to 9. This gives me a leak off flow rate of double what the original post had so I am concerned that I may have all 4 injectors down. The van has done 150k and I wonder if all 4 dead at 150k normal enough or do I need to worry about the pump breaking up?
Thanks all.....
You're lucky they've lasted that long, most will have gone through several injectors by then.My Vivaro 1.9 is difficult to start in the morning and my leak off test fills #2 in 5 minutes at idle, 1 & 3 go to 9.5 and 4 to 9. This gives me a leak off flow rate of double what the original post had so I am concerned that I may have all 4 injectors down. The van has done 150k and I wonder if all 4 dead at 150k normal enough or do I need to worry about the pump breaking up?
Thanks all.....
If yours are original, they'll be well seized into the head ! even at half that mileage they're usually well stuck.
Stevieturbo, there are no mark suggesting anyone has pulled them before so I am guessing they are original. If they have to get swapped and they fight then I will pay someone with a puller to deal with extracting them.
Am I right to think the flow rate is massively to high or are they OK at that flow rate?
Am I right to think the flow rate is massively to high or are they OK at that flow rate?
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