pre-heat ICE car / oil before starting worthwhile?

[OctaneV8]

has anyone come up with a way to pre-heat an internal combustion engine car before starting the engine?



is it possible to significantly reduce engine wear by pre-heating the oil somehow by induction...

vs. cold-start followed by shortly driving off as gently as possible

[GeniusOfLove]

Electric block heaters are a thing in a lot of the world, Webasto fuel fired heaters that use petrol/diesel to pre heat the coolant (and cabin), and putting a little burner under the sump are all things.

None of which are worthwhile in the UK, when did you last hear of an engine actually wearing out in a passenger car?

[andy43]

You used to be able to buy a flat heater element sheet that would stick onto the sump and plug into mains power to preheat the oil. That’d be easier than a full Nordic preheater install but probably rubbish.

[AndySheff]

Only -4 here in Sweden, but I'm about to start my diesel cabin and engine heater. Soo nice getting into a toasty warm car

[alabbasi]

block heaters are common in colder climates for gasoline engine cars, and common everywhere for diesels. It's a factory open for many manufacturers. I even had one on an old 75 Mercedes Benz 300D (240D 3.0 in Europe).

[996TT02]

OctaneV8 said:

is it possible to significantly reduce engine wear by pre-heating the oil

What engine wear? This is not F1 where pistons are super super tight in bores and car can't be started before block is heated up to operating temperature, because clearances are designed for operating temperature.

Road cars - good clearances when cold, and technically too much when hot.

[stevieturbo]

OctaneV8 said:

has anyone come up with a way to pre-heat an internal combustion engine car before starting the engine?



is it possible to significantly reduce engine wear by pre-heating the oil somehow by induction...

vs. cold-start followed by shortly driving off as gently as possible

Plenty of ways available, but unless you live in the arctic, largely pointless.

[leef44]

andy43 said:

You used to be able to buy a flat heater element sheet that would stick onto the sump and plug into mains power to preheat the oil. That’d be easier than a full Nordic preheater install but probably rubbish.

This is what I had for my TVR. It would get it up to 60 degrees but normally I just heat it up to 40 degrees because it takes so long and is only heating a small portion of the oil. There is a general procedure of revving to a certain limit until the oil temperature reaches certain levels. This helped minimise that time and cold temp wear and tear.

Of course as soon as you turn it on and the engine is idling that temperature will start to drop as it circulates but I would say that it did help because it was a shorter time to get up to temp.

[Super Sonic]

Don't F1 cars run hot water through the engine before starting?

[PushedDover]

I click the button on the app to defrost the car and heat cabin and sorts it out.
If feeling precious, I also ‘start the car ‘ via the app too



Also great when leaving the airport / restaurant / cinema on an evening of course, not just on a morning.

[leef44]

PushedDover said:

I click the button on the app to defrost the car and heat cabin and sorts it out.
If feeling precious, I also ‘start the car ‘ via the app too



Also great when leaving the airport / restaurant / cinema on an evening of course, not just on a morning.

But where's the fun in that? I get to go out in the freezing cold an hour before I need to drive and walk down to the garage block where I force the frozen garage door open and plug the heater on.

Don't you feel you're missing out?

[OctaneV8]

leef44 said:

This is what I had for my TVR. It would get it up to 60 degrees but normally I just heat it up to 40 degrees because it takes so long and is only heating a small portion of the oil. There is a general procedure of revving to a certain limit until the oil temperature reaches certain levels. This helped minimise that time and cold temp wear and tear.

Of course as soon as you turn it on and the engine is idling that temperature will start to drop as it circulates but I would say that it did help because it was a shorter time to get up to temp.

Thanks for your replies, great to hear from someone that's actually tried it, how did you mount it to the sump, how long would it take to get to 40 / 60 deg C, how did you stow away the wires/plug when not in use?

I've found a few silicone pads on demon tweeks, amazon, some come with 3-pin plug.

[MB140]

I spent some time in a place called Goose Bay in N&L Canada. In winter it was not uncommon to see temperatures of -30 and lower.

Most public parking places had a small post at the front that you could plug you car in (with engine block heater.

As a Brit, first time I saw them I wondered what the hell they were. For use in the uk complete overkill.

[leef44]

OctaneV8 said:

leef44 said:

This is what I had for my TVR. It would get it up to 60 degrees but normally I just heat it up to 40 degrees because it takes so long and is only heating a small portion of the oil. There is a general procedure of revving to a certain limit until the oil temperature reaches certain levels. This helped minimise that time and cold temp wear and tear.

Of course as soon as you turn it on and the engine is idling that temperature will start to drop as it circulates but I would say that it did help because it was a shorter time to get up to temp.

Thanks for your replies, great to hear from someone that's actually tried it, how did you mount it to the sump, how long would it take to get to 40 / 60 deg C, how did you stow away the wires/plug when not in use?

I've found a few silicone pads on demon tweeks, amazon, some come with 3-pin plug.

I'm a complete numpty with these things so I took it to my TVR specialists back then (David Batty in Godalming) but he has retired since.

I bought it online. It was a pad which you stuck to the bottom of the pan. I had it wired so that there was a connector which led to the passenger footwell. I would then plug that into the wall socket an hour before using the car.

Depending on how cold it was the times vary for the heating. I vaguely remember it was something like 20-30 mins to get up to 40 deg and 40-60 mins to get up to 60 deg. This was over a decade ago so technology may have improved since then.

[Jaz2000]

In the 80s I had a heater plumbed into the water pipes on my car that was then plugged into the mains on a timer.

Looking back it was a bit of a gimmick as I lived in a fairly warm part of the UK and the car was parked in a garage overnight.

[thatdude]

Start up, half-throttle, half-revs max for the first 5-10 mins.

You're not just having to warm up the engine, by the way. The transmission and other components need time to warm up as well.

Modern oils, modern metals and other materials and modern engineering practices mean that wear and tear from cold start is pretty much a non-issue providing the engine regularly does get up to temperature. In th UK we dont get the sorts of regular temps where accesories to heat the block etc are required.

I could understand more performance-orientated cars needing some care when cold starting.

[smn159]

PushedDover said:

I click the button on the app to defrost the car and heat cabin and sorts it out.
If feeling precious, I also ‘start the car ‘ via the app too



Also great when leaving the airport / restaurant / cinema on an evening of course, not just on a morning.

I tell Alexa to pre heat mine

[Pica-Pica]

thatdude said:

Start up, half-throttle, half-revs max for the first 5-10 mins.

You're not just having to warm up the engine, by the way. The transmission and other components need time to warm up as well.

Modern oils, modern metals and other materials and modern engineering practices mean that wear and tear from cold start is pretty much a non-issue providing the engine regularly does get up to temperature. In th UK we dont get the sorts of regular temps where accesories to heat the block etc are required.

I could understand more performance-orientated cars needing some care when cold starting.

Agreed. My 335d has used the glow plugs about three times in 8 years.
As for me, adipose tissue warms me up.

[GeniusOfLove]

Pica-Pica said:

thatdude said:

Start up, half-throttle, half-revs max for the first 5-10 mins.

You're not just having to warm up the engine, by the way. The transmission and other components need time to warm up as well.

Modern oils, modern metals and other materials and modern engineering practices mean that wear and tear from cold start is pretty much a non-issue providing the engine regularly does get up to temperature. In th UK we dont get the sorts of regular temps where accesories to heat the block etc are required.

I could understand more performance-orientated cars needing some care when cold starting.

Agreed. My 335d has used the glow plugs about three times in 8 years.
As for me, adipose tissue warms me up.

Modern cars are often using them on the sly without putting the light on. You don't know how much work they're doing until one or more fails, and then you really see how important they still are!

[Crudeoink]

Always thought it a waste of energy to allow an engine and gearbox to sit there on the drive cooling down. If the heat from the engine and gearbox could be recycled into the house in the evening after the commute home and the warm 60°c radiator temps used in the opposite direction to pre-heat an engine on cold mornings you'd see less warm-up enrichment, wear etc. Obivously you'd need to run your whole house on glycol and inducing air into the coolant loop would be an issue but thats for an engineer smarter than me to sort