engine in a cobra
Discussion
Hi
I'm pondering ideas...
I am building a GD 427 cobra. It has a chevy 350 v8 engine which is going to make it go like stink however under normal everyday use it will average 18-20 mpg.
My mate just bought a Honda Civic R which goes like stink, and under everyday use will get more like 40 mpg!
This got me thinking --- because I am not trying to build it as an authentic replica but more like a modern interpretation, why don't I put something like the Honda V-tech engine which is probably the most reliable engine around????
Problem: My cobra is rear wheel drive ---
Question to you guys
What engine is there that is rear wheel drive, reasonably economical, goes like stink when I want it to, and a special bonus would be if I can hook up my laptop & tune myself
Please don't suggest the GM LS range as I have been in and left that argument behind
I'm pondering ideas...
I am building a GD 427 cobra. It has a chevy 350 v8 engine which is going to make it go like stink however under normal everyday use it will average 18-20 mpg.
My mate just bought a Honda Civic R which goes like stink, and under everyday use will get more like 40 mpg!
This got me thinking --- because I am not trying to build it as an authentic replica but more like a modern interpretation, why don't I put something like the Honda V-tech engine which is probably the most reliable engine around????
Problem: My cobra is rear wheel drive ---
Question to you guys
What engine is there that is rear wheel drive, reasonably economical, goes like stink when I want it to, and a special bonus would be if I can hook up my laptop & tune myself
Please don't suggest the GM LS range as I have been in and left that argument behind
I run a tweeked SR20DET in a Sylva Phoenix kit, and its a fantastic engine, but while the Sylva may have a similar profile to a cobra, it is a lot lighter (620Kg) not sure haow it would work in car as heavy as a cobra, but I think I'd want the torques of the V8, and of course while the blow of valve going off is anice sound it is not waht you would associate with a Cobra.
daveymuso said:
Hi
I'm pondering ideas...
I am building a GD 427 cobra. It has a chevy 350 v8 engine which is going to make it go like stink however under normal everyday use it will average 18-20 mpg.
My mate just bought a Honda Civic R which goes like stink, and under everyday use will get more like 40 mpg!
This got me thinking --- because I am not trying to build it as an authentic replica but more like a modern interpretation, why don't I put something like the Honda V-tech engine which is probably the most reliable engine around????
Problem: My cobra is rear wheel drive ---
Question to you guys
What engine is there that is rear wheel drive, reasonably economical, goes like stink when I want it to, and a special bonus would be if I can hook up my laptop & tune myself
Please don't suggest the GM LS range as I have been in and left that argument behind
Why is real wheel drive a problem ? Anything can be bolted to anythung with a bit of work.I'm pondering ideas...
I am building a GD 427 cobra. It has a chevy 350 v8 engine which is going to make it go like stink however under normal everyday use it will average 18-20 mpg.
My mate just bought a Honda Civic R which goes like stink, and under everyday use will get more like 40 mpg!
This got me thinking --- because I am not trying to build it as an authentic replica but more like a modern interpretation, why don't I put something like the Honda V-tech engine which is probably the most reliable engine around????
Problem: My cobra is rear wheel drive ---
Question to you guys
What engine is there that is rear wheel drive, reasonably economical, goes like stink when I want it to, and a special bonus would be if I can hook up my laptop & tune myself
Please don't suggest the GM LS range as I have been in and left that argument behind
And I think you are deluded if you think firstly a Civic Type R will average 40mpg, and also deluded that you think such an engine will offer anything remotely performance orientated in something like a Cobra chassis..
What weight will your car end up ?
A well tuned LS variant could easily achieve 25-30mpg, less in heavy traffic. Even a heavy Monaro isnt difficult to get above 25mpg during normal use.
But if you really want some cheaper running, fit a decent modern turbodiesel. Say a 3.0 V6 or similar from whoever, or BMW Straight 6.
Or fit a good petrol engine and install an LPG kit, or to push a little further, make it LPG only.
But I cant see any petrol engine with good performance offering much above 30mpg no matter what you use. That's just the reality.
And if your Cobra is heavy, even the likes of an S2000 setup will feel crap.
daveymuso said:
This got me thinking --- because I am not trying to build it as an authentic replica but more like a modern interpretation, why don't I put something like the Honda V-tech engine which is probably the most reliable engine around????
Because you will remove one of the most important aspects of your Cobra, the sound. If you see a Cobra you expect to hear the god of thunder accompanying it, not a screaming four pot.daveymuso said:
What engine is there that is rear wheel drive,
There aren't any, engines don't have wheels. Within reason, and given sufficient time and effort almost any engine from a FWD car could be adapted for use in a RWD car.If you are using a standard LS engine without wild cams etc. and it's properly mapped (or even better running OEM management) then fuel economy should be pretty reasonable for a weekend toy.
I'm also at a bit of a loss as to why fuel economy would even start to become an important parameter in that type of car. If the aim is "saving money" then spending multiple thousands of pounds on a kit car is probably not the best starting point. The likely running costs (insurance, tyres, periodic (read "often" for that sort of car ;-) maintainance etc) will easily outweigh the fuel costs, especially as presviously mentioned, it's not going to be the sort of car in which you are going to do large mileages.
Also as mentioned, the best economy benifit would be to invest in a decently mapped EMS systemt to run a modern V8 efficiently. (something like a BMW 4l V8 would be relatively economical in the long run)
Also as mentioned, the best economy benifit would be to invest in a decently mapped EMS systemt to run a modern V8 efficiently. (something like a BMW 4l V8 would be relatively economical in the long run)
Max_Torque said:
I'm also at a bit of a loss as to why fuel economy would even start to become an important parameter in that type of car. If the aim is "saving money" then spending multiple thousands of pounds on a kit car is probably not the best starting point. The likely running costs (insurance, tyres, periodic (read "often" for that sort of car ;-) maintainance etc) will easily outweigh the fuel costs, especially as presviously mentioned, it's not going to be the sort of car in which you are going to do large mileages.
Also as mentioned, the best economy benifit would be to invest in a decently mapped EMS systemt to run a modern V8 efficiently. (something like a BMW 4l V8 would be relatively economical in the long run)
Max...sorry to change the subject....I dropped you over an email recently, did you receive it? Hopefully you're not going to tell me to get lost here...but I could do with chatting to you about a project if you are available?Also as mentioned, the best economy benifit would be to invest in a decently mapped EMS systemt to run a modern V8 efficiently. (something like a BMW 4l V8 would be relatively economical in the long run)
On a budget you could pick up an all alloy LS based 5.3 unit for less than $1000, much less probably.
It will still make a decent 3-350 with a little work, and being slightly smaller, potentially use a little less fuel than some of its larger counterparts ( and more expensive to buy counterparts )
Really, it's a no brainer.
Or as Max suggests a similar but more modern V8 say BMW or even Lexus.
Or you could just fill the entire car with batteries and fit an electric motor
It will still make a decent 3-350 with a little work, and being slightly smaller, potentially use a little less fuel than some of its larger counterparts ( and more expensive to buy counterparts )
Really, it's a no brainer.
Or as Max suggests a similar but more modern V8 say BMW or even Lexus.
Or you could just fill the entire car with batteries and fit an electric motor
daveymuso said:
I'm now thinking the honda would be too weak for a cobra. What I am contemplating is the option of LPG. It will burn much more efficiently & cleaner, will be equivalant to 45mpg (unless the gov rip us off there too!!!) yet I will retain the v8 sound, torque & bhp...
If you've got to go through IVA then I'd stick to something as simple and compliant as possible, then modify/swap it later on once you've got it on the road.I also agree with the comments about a proper V8, not only is it probably cheaper and easier to do than engineer your own solution but will increase he value of the car.
Well first off you should ask yourself what yopu're trying to acheive. If ytou want fuel econmoy, then don;t build a Cobra. If you want a Cobra you HAVE to install a V8. End of story.
Next you're thinking of LPG conversion.
OK, let's examine some facts. Car "as is" will do what 20mpg? Let's say with a LPG conversion it'll do 30. On an average annual 6,000 miles, and I bet there's very very few kit cars, especially open ones that do 6K a year, you'll save £600 a year in fuel at today prices. You do the maths but it's 1365 litres as against 910. And it'll cost you what £1,000 for the conversion? So in just under 2 years you'd be in profit. No brainer.
Seems like a good deal to. You retain the V8 AND you've got an additional talking point with the LPG fitted AND when it comes time to sell it it's a unique point for future buyer.
So IMHO save the new engine cost and keep the V8 but use the cash on an LPG conversion.
Next you're thinking of LPG conversion.
OK, let's examine some facts. Car "as is" will do what 20mpg? Let's say with a LPG conversion it'll do 30. On an average annual 6,000 miles, and I bet there's very very few kit cars, especially open ones that do 6K a year, you'll save £600 a year in fuel at today prices. You do the maths but it's 1365 litres as against 910. And it'll cost you what £1,000 for the conversion? So in just under 2 years you'd be in profit. No brainer.
Seems like a good deal to. You retain the V8 AND you've got an additional talking point with the LPG fitted AND when it comes time to sell it it's a unique point for future buyer.
So IMHO save the new engine cost and keep the V8 but use the cash on an LPG conversion.
Max_Torque said:
Also as mentioned, the best economy benifit would be to invest in a decently mapped EMS systemt to run a modern V8 efficiently. (something like a BMW 4l V8 would be relatively economical in the long run)
I was the first guy to put a BMW 4.4 litre V8 in a Cobra in the UK and even with the 5 speed tiptronic box I was getting 35 mpg on cruise coming back from Le Mans. A six speed manual would get around 38 mpg in similar circumstances I reckon. Cheers,
Tony
davepoth said:
Lexus V8 maybe?
Following the BMW exeprience I then built another Cobra with the Lexus 4 litre V8 (and four speed auto box) and fuel consumption started out at 25 mpg which was a bit dissapointing given the Beemer consumption. However 5000 miles later the ECU has been retuning itself over time and I'm now getting 31 mpg on a mixture of around town, gentle cruising and the odd traffic light grand prix.
Hope all that helps.
Of course with a GD you're stuck with either the LS or a boat anchor Chevvy, they wouldnt entertain the thought of fitting anything other than yank engines when I was first looking at Cobra kits.
Cheers,
Tony
( PS ever thought about about the Audi V8?)
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