power to weight
Discussion
I drove the mighty 'ro to RapidGB today to get the smaller pulley fitted and a service. On the way I came across a black 52 plate M3, traffic was light and we had bit of a drag race out of the roundabout. I was surprised how evenly matched our cars were up to 120+ in spite of the on-paper differences. According to the LSV dyno mine is making 440bhp and 580lbs torque and his M3 would be making I guess about 338bhp and 270lbs. How can this translate to bugger all difference in the real world? After it's finished mine should make 550fwbhp but I'm really not sure how much difference it should make against something like an M5 if I can't see off its little brother 
Just done some sums: 2005 CV8 weighs 1692kg giving mine 260bhp/tonne with 440bhp. With 550 bhp it will have 325bhp/tonne. E46 M3:229 bhp/tonne, M3 CSL:270 bhp/tonne. Weight really is a killer!
Just done some sums: 2005 CV8 weighs 1692kg giving mine 260bhp/tonne with 440bhp. With 550 bhp it will have 325bhp/tonne. E46 M3:229 bhp/tonne, M3 CSL:270 bhp/tonne. Weight really is a killer!
Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 11th November 15:57
Any M3's Ive seen, tend to run high 13's at best over the 1/4, at maybe a tad over 100mph on a good run.
A friend had one, regular manual version a few years ago. Not a rocket by any means.
I seen a new model V10 M5 at Santa Pod once, it was pulling off mid-high 12s runs...
From that, they are 2 very different animals. The M5 is even more impressive, give its weight !!
A friend had one, regular manual version a few years ago. Not a rocket by any means.
I seen a new model V10 M5 at Santa Pod once, it was pulling off mid-high 12s runs...
From that, they are 2 very different animals. The M5 is even more impressive, give its weight !!
Think you`ll find that the numbers that really count such as rear wheel BHP per Ton would close the gap considerably as the BMW loses far less power through its drivetrain.
Daz, you forgot to say you were using second gear as well as having a fatty in the car with you.
You did kinda make him look like he was going backward though.
Daz, you forgot to say you were using second gear as well as having a fatty in the car with you.
You did kinda make him look like he was going backward though.
I have to admit I outdragged 2 or maybe 3 M3s before the supercharger. In NA mode it was fairly close until 100mph and then I just pulled away without trying too hard. Imagine my surprise today when flat out, approaching 140 I looked in the mirror and he was still there!
Either the others weren't trying, my car has broken...badly, or there was something different about this M3.
Either the others weren't trying, my car has broken...badly, or there was something different about this M3.
I have no s/c and only a mind tune. Doing the furball I was able to make some interesting comparisons:
RS4 - Nothing in it... and I mean nothing.... from standstill until 165, done many many times.
360 - 'Tis quicker off the line but from 60 to 165, nothing in it.
Esprit V8 - ditto.
993 C2 - Slower, not by much but noticeable.
996 Turbo - Much quicker!
When it got twisty, it was interesting how some of the 'supercars' were slower than the 2/4 door barges. Probably down to having more confidence I guess.
In standard tune, I have dragged a AMV8 from 40 - 130 and lost (just), now I think there would be nothing in it.
RS4 - Nothing in it... and I mean nothing.... from standstill until 165, done many many times.
360 - 'Tis quicker off the line but from 60 to 165, nothing in it.
Esprit V8 - ditto.
993 C2 - Slower, not by much but noticeable.
996 Turbo - Much quicker!
When it got twisty, it was interesting how some of the 'supercars' were slower than the 2/4 door barges. Probably down to having more confidence I guess.
In standard tune, I have dragged a AMV8 from 40 - 130 and lost (just), now I think there would be nothing in it.
ukvoyager.info said:
I have no s/c and only a mind tune. Doing the furball I was able to make some interesting comparisons:
RS4 - Nothing in it... and I mean nothing.... from standstill until 165, done many many times.
360 - 'Tis quicker off the line but from 60 to 165, nothing in it.
Esprit V8 - ditto.
993 C2 - Slower, not by much but noticeable.
996 Turbo - Much quicker!
When it got twisty, it was interesting how some of the 'supercars' were slower than the 2/4 door barges. Probably down to having more confidence I guess.
In standard tune, I have dragged a AMV8 from 40 - 130 and lost (just), now I think there would be nothing in it.
RS4 - Nothing in it... and I mean nothing.... from standstill until 165, done many many times.
360 - 'Tis quicker off the line but from 60 to 165, nothing in it.
Esprit V8 - ditto.
993 C2 - Slower, not by much but noticeable.
996 Turbo - Much quicker!
When it got twisty, it was interesting how some of the 'supercars' were slower than the 2/4 door barges. Probably down to having more confidence I guess.
In standard tune, I have dragged a AMV8 from 40 - 130 and lost (just), now I think there would be nothing in it.
Thats all pretty much what I'd expect.
RS4 - similar power, lighter weight but more mechanical drag from the 4wd.
360/Esprit - much lighter and mid engined so much more traction off the line.
993 C2 - prob quick off the line (911's are) and it does an awful lot with not much (relative) power.
996 Turbo - Very quick car. Nuff said.
As for the twisties - you're average exotic will be driven at say 7/10ths where as a barge might be 8 or 9/10ths. Having the engine behind you changes the dynamics of the car considerably. If anybody hasn't tried a lightweight/mid engine car then it's worth it just to show how unforgiving it can be. I remember the esprit especially - stunning car and a joy to drive but you *knew* the car hated you... At the first opportunity it would try to go backwards on fire into a hedge if you stepped so much as a fraction over the limit.
I'm still quite surprised how easy and fun it is to throw 1800kg's around esp after coming from a 'ittle 700kg elise.
It's completely different - the elise you had to work with the car at all times to get the most out of it but with the VXR8 it's more of a "chuck in - power out - ride the tail slide - grin for miles"
Edited by ads_green on Monday 12th November 11:20
)Before mine was supercharged it was producing 379 fwbhp and feels much, much quicker now probably because the torque has gone up by around 200 lbs which helps pull the tall gearing to get you off the line.
I thought 9psi/550-580 bhp would feel plenty but now I'm thinking 12psi & I can see how people start engine rebuilds to 7+ litres; it's addictive and too much, it seems is never enough. The trouble is we are not the only people modifying, there are plenty Supras etc out there that would make you feel very silly indeed!
I thought 9psi/550-580 bhp would feel plenty but now I'm thinking 12psi & I can see how people start engine rebuilds to 7+ litres; it's addictive and too much, it seems is never enough. The trouble is we are not the only people modifying, there are plenty Supras etc out there that would make you feel very silly indeed!
That is the problem with mods, you are always looking for that bit more power. I was happy with my standard Monaro, happy with my Wortec'd Monaro, happy with my 6psi Monaro then finally happy with my 12psi Monaro.
Am I happy now?
Well I would be if I had more power!
I am currently thinking about one of the most absurd things you have heard! Get something like a Fiesta/Corsa or the like and run it for a while, then I can start the "ever increasing horsepower" round again
Am I happy now?
Well I would be if I had more power!
I am currently thinking about one of the most absurd things you have heard! Get something like a Fiesta/Corsa or the like and run it for a while, then I can start the "ever increasing horsepower" round again
I've been thinking about the same ever since I saw a MK1 Escort Mexico with a 2 litre Sierra Cosworth engine fitted. There's a firm local to me that do ground up restorations, I recon for 15 grand you could commission a real monster. I was also thinking of putting a GSX-R engine in a Smart Car but somebody has already done that!
I also once saw a Fiesta XR2 with a small block chevy installed!
I also once saw a Fiesta XR2 with a small block chevy installed!
Edited by anonymous-user on Monday 12th November 19:10
wormus said:
The trouble is we are not the only people modifying, there are plenty Supras etc out there that would make you feel very silly indeed!
That sums it up..... supercharged M3 would be very quick or even an old heavily chipped cosworth.... I used to just get the bike out but thats gone now! sob sob.Gassing Station | HSV & Monaro | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff