Pure Meth - pre S/C
Discussion
TerryS said:
Probably one for Stevie, but in theory this is a good idea, just wondered if anyone had tried Meth injection pre-Supercharger? I wondered if it would cause any significant damage to the charger over time?
Ive never injected pre-compressor.Whilst some suggest its a good place...there are 2 reasons I dont agree.
First and foremost, as methanol can be corrosive to aluminium....it seems a bad place to squirt it.
And as the air entering there is already fairly cool...whats the point ?
And if the nozzle broke off....ouch lol
Injecting it after the intercooler, into a hot airstream ( not mega hot, but still hot ) really does help cool the air.
Although if you tune it for pure meth, if the system fails.....you can be in trouble. I'm tending towards 50/50 from now on, as you become less reliant on the stuff. Pumps/seals last longer, and its cheaper, although meth isnt overly expensive. Its also safer, as pure meth is nasty stuff.
Boosted LS1 said:
Are there any gains in using pure meths over say a 50% water mix? I guess you have to also consider if it attacks lubricants on the rotor tips. I assume they're teflon or something like that with a lubricant embedded to help with sealing.
I think 100% Meth would actually be better as it would "flash" pretty instantly there where as water wouldn't.stevieturbo said:
TerryS said:
Probably one for Stevie, but in theory this is a good idea, just wondered if anyone had tried Meth injection pre-Supercharger? I wondered if it would cause any significant damage to the charger over time?
Ive never injected pre-compressor.Whilst some suggest its a good place...there are 2 reasons I dont agree.
First and foremost, as methanol can be corrosive to aluminium....it seems a bad place to squirt it.
And as the air entering there is already fairly cool...whats the point ?
And if the nozzle broke off....ouch lol
Injecting it after the intercooler, into a hot airstream ( not mega hot, but still hot ) really does help cool the air.
Although if you tune it for pure meth, if the system fails.....you can be in trouble. I'm tending towards 50/50 from now on, as you become less reliant on the stuff. Pumps/seals last longer, and its cheaper, although meth isnt overly expensive. Its also safer, as pure meth is nasty stuff.
Chances of nozzle failure are rare. And I guess if it broke off after the IC, before the TB..it'll go through the engine.
Safest place is probaboy post SC, pre IC, then it would only ever stick in the IC.
This might be a good palce for cooling too, as the air would be very hot, but there is a chance methanol might pool in the IC core itself, although given the temps involved, its probably very unlikely.
Just dont know where the most efficient location for water/meth cooling actually is.
If you want a water/meth spray to enter the combustion chamberm, which I believe is the best...the only way to acheive that will be with the jet after the IC.
You'll never achieve it in front of the blower.
And I still dont see how injecting water/meth pre SC will help it that much. Although I think that was the preferred method years ago with the Spitfires etc ??
Safest place is probaboy post SC, pre IC, then it would only ever stick in the IC.
This might be a good palce for cooling too, as the air would be very hot, but there is a chance methanol might pool in the IC core itself, although given the temps involved, its probably very unlikely.
Just dont know where the most efficient location for water/meth cooling actually is.
If you want a water/meth spray to enter the combustion chamberm, which I believe is the best...the only way to acheive that will be with the jet after the IC.
You'll never achieve it in front of the blower.
And I still dont see how injecting water/meth pre SC will help it that much. Although I think that was the preferred method years ago with the Spitfires etc ??
Methanol has extreme cooling properties (there are methanol based cooling systems). I actually thought of doing this over the installation of an IC but I like the fact the IC will "always be there for me".
I found this whilst looking for tanks
http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.com/a40/Where-D...
I found this whilst looking for tanks
http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.com/a40/Where-D...
wallsjay said:
Terry sorry to hijac your thread but what are you doing with ur vortec ? are uupgrading then intercooler ? i fitted my own intercooler but seam to b esuffering with loss in psi so would be interested in what you have
Cheers mate
Pressure loss where and why ??Cheers mate
If the IC is very small, it will be restrictive, and you may see a pressure drop at the engine.
Or on the other hand...depending on how its installed, you may simply have a leak.
wallsjay said:
Terry sorry to hijac your thread but what are you doing with ur vortec ? are uupgrading then intercooler ? i fitted my own intercooler but seam to b esuffering with loss in psi so would be interested in what you have
Cheers mate
Hi mate, I have fitted a huge 4 row IC to the car now, but I can't say I noticed any loss in pressure as I dropped a pulley size at the same time.Cheers mate
email only works if you go through pistonheads to view the forum, been like that for a while now. If you use www.hsv.org.uk and get the red background you wont be able to email folk through their profile.
I am Just about to try an Alkycontrol system on mine, I’ve just got to wire in the 2 bar map sensor and it’s finished.
My install is slightly different from your Vortec I am running a Harrop 112 PD blower spraying just in front of the throttle body at selected boost Pressures.
The Plan is to spray 50% distilled water and 50% methanol; I am led to believe that this mix offers the best cooling effect.
I am not tuning for methanol this is purely for cooling, if I gain some power from the fuel content of the meth or not having timing pulled at high AIT that will be a bonus.
100% methanol is great at reducing or even eliminating knock and allowing high boost pressures. the down side however as someone has already pointed out, its quite a nasty chemical to have driving around with you in any quantity. Also if you tune for it and the system fails there is a possibility of engine damage.
With regard to rotor damage I have read some alleged claims of stripped Teflon from rotors, but nothing that categorically confirms it. I will only be using it off road occasionally anyway, so hardly likely to be an issue to me.
If you are using meth a lot you might want to also consider Klotz Uplon Fuel Lube to guard againt the long term effect of methanol on your valves guides etc.
My install is slightly different from your Vortec I am running a Harrop 112 PD blower spraying just in front of the throttle body at selected boost Pressures.
The Plan is to spray 50% distilled water and 50% methanol; I am led to believe that this mix offers the best cooling effect.
I am not tuning for methanol this is purely for cooling, if I gain some power from the fuel content of the meth or not having timing pulled at high AIT that will be a bonus.
100% methanol is great at reducing or even eliminating knock and allowing high boost pressures. the down side however as someone has already pointed out, its quite a nasty chemical to have driving around with you in any quantity. Also if you tune for it and the system fails there is a possibility of engine damage.
With regard to rotor damage I have read some alleged claims of stripped Teflon from rotors, but nothing that categorically confirms it. I will only be using it off road occasionally anyway, so hardly likely to be an issue to me.
If you are using meth a lot you might want to also consider Klotz Uplon Fuel Lube to guard againt the long term effect of methanol on your valves guides etc.
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