Poly Bush kits Tamora-Winter proj.
Discussion
HI Tref.The car's running new nitrons/ebachs but I've changed out the bushes on everything I've owned(2nd car wise) It provides much better feel/input/handling for me. It's not the full RD polys I'm looking for just the elast2 I hate mushy rides & of most of the TVRs I've driven which has been a good few having worked for a TVR dealership...its just a personal thing.
Buzz
Buzz
Ironballs said:
If anything I'd be looking for something that gives more compliance and a softer ride, I was struggling to lose a van the other day on a very rough moorland road
If your running oem shocks and springs there's a good chance its crashing into or running on the bumpstops so effectively giving you extremely stiff/almost solid suspension. I do find these comments a bit strange as most other TVR owners that have upgraded have reported sharper improved handling with no added harshness. This includes several Tuscan owners.
I don't know whether these comments come from real experience or Chinese whispers but there are several points to this. The first is that not all poly bushes are the same. The original types used poly as a replacement for the rubber material and relied on the metal sleeve and poly surface to provide the bearing surface. The problem is that the if the poly is soft to cushion the ride, it usually results in more wear. If it is harder then the wear improves but it becomes very harsh. With this type of bush, it is not uncommon to have different grades for different applications. e.g. road, track, race. Fitting a harder grade can make the ride harsh and this has led to a general belief that "all poly bushes increase the ride harshness".
The Powerflex bushes that I use in the T car set I provide uses an internal glacier bearing which means that the poly itself does not provide the bearing surface and can be chosen for its ride characteristics rather than wear. This also means that the bearing has virtually zero friction allowing the wishbones to move freely up and down. This is one of the big differences compared to the metalastic bush where the sleeve is clamped and the movement is provided by the rubber distorting. It is bonded to the inner and outer sleeves and has to twist to allow the wishbones to move. This means that the bush is acting as a spring/shock in its own right. The problem is that you don't know by how much. This also explains the woolyness you get compared to the Powerflex bushes as the wishbone control is not solely by the shock and spring.
The concensus amongst the TVR owners that have fitted Powerflex bushes is that they are a big improvement without introducing ride harshness. I have used them for years on my road TVRs and far from ruining the ride have improved it.
I don't know whether these comments come from real experience or Chinese whispers but there are several points to this. The first is that not all poly bushes are the same. The original types used poly as a replacement for the rubber material and relied on the metal sleeve and poly surface to provide the bearing surface. The problem is that the if the poly is soft to cushion the ride, it usually results in more wear. If it is harder then the wear improves but it becomes very harsh. With this type of bush, it is not uncommon to have different grades for different applications. e.g. road, track, race. Fitting a harder grade can make the ride harsh and this has led to a general belief that "all poly bushes increase the ride harshness".
The Powerflex bushes that I use in the T car set I provide uses an internal glacier bearing which means that the poly itself does not provide the bearing surface and can be chosen for its ride characteristics rather than wear. This also means that the bearing has virtually zero friction allowing the wishbones to move freely up and down. This is one of the big differences compared to the metalastic bush where the sleeve is clamped and the movement is provided by the rubber distorting. It is bonded to the inner and outer sleeves and has to twist to allow the wishbones to move. This means that the bush is acting as a spring/shock in its own right. The problem is that you don't know by how much. This also explains the woolyness you get compared to the Powerflex bushes as the wishbone control is not solely by the shock and spring.
The concensus amongst the TVR owners that have fitted Powerflex bushes is that they are a big improvement without introducing ride harshness. I have used them for years on my road TVRs and far from ruining the ride have improved it.
shpub said:
I do find these comments a bit strange as most other TVR owners that have upgraded have reported sharper improved handling with no added harshness. This includes several Tuscan owners.
I don't know whether these comments come from real experience or Chinese whispers but there are several points to this. The first is that not all poly bushes are the same. The original types used poly as a replacement for the rubber material and relied on the metal sleeve and poly surface to provide the bearing surface. The problem is that the if the poly is soft to cushion the ride, it usually results in more wear. If it is harder then the wear improves but it becomes very harsh. With this type of bush, it is not uncommon to have different grades for different applications. e.g. road, track, race. Fitting a harder grade can make the ride harsh and this has led to a general belief that "all poly bushes increase the ride harshness".
The Powerflex bushes that I use in the T car set I provide uses an internal glacier bearing which means that the poly itself does not provide the bearing surface and can be chosen for its ride characteristics rather than wear. This also means that the bearing has virtually zero friction allowing the wishbones to move freely up and down. This is one of the big differences compared to the metalastic bush where the sleeve is clamped and the movement is provided by the rubber distorting. It is bonded to the inner and outer sleeves and has to twist to allow the wishbones to move. This means that the bush is acting as a spring/shock in its own right. The problem is that you don't know by how much. This also explains the woolyness you get compared to the Powerflex bushes as the wishbone control is not solely by the shock and spring.
The concensus amongst the TVR owners that have fitted Powerflex bushes is that they are a big improvement without introducing ride harshness. I have used them for years on my road TVRs and far from ruining the ride have improved it.
We use std bushes in our race sag, the powerflex ones crack the std ones dont and are up to the job of running slicks under race conditions, why change them ?I don't know whether these comments come from real experience or Chinese whispers but there are several points to this. The first is that not all poly bushes are the same. The original types used poly as a replacement for the rubber material and relied on the metal sleeve and poly surface to provide the bearing surface. The problem is that the if the poly is soft to cushion the ride, it usually results in more wear. If it is harder then the wear improves but it becomes very harsh. With this type of bush, it is not uncommon to have different grades for different applications. e.g. road, track, race. Fitting a harder grade can make the ride harsh and this has led to a general belief that "all poly bushes increase the ride harshness".
The Powerflex bushes that I use in the T car set I provide uses an internal glacier bearing which means that the poly itself does not provide the bearing surface and can be chosen for its ride characteristics rather than wear. This also means that the bearing has virtually zero friction allowing the wishbones to move freely up and down. This is one of the big differences compared to the metalastic bush where the sleeve is clamped and the movement is provided by the rubber distorting. It is bonded to the inner and outer sleeves and has to twist to allow the wishbones to move. This means that the bush is acting as a spring/shock in its own right. The problem is that you don't know by how much. This also explains the woolyness you get compared to the Powerflex bushes as the wishbone control is not solely by the shock and spring.
The concensus amongst the TVR owners that have fitted Powerflex bushes is that they are a big improvement without introducing ride harshness. I have used them for years on my road TVRs and far from ruining the ride have improved it.
cwin said:
We use std bushes in our race sag, the powerflex ones crack the std ones dont and are up to the job of running slicks under race conditions, why change them ?
Interesting... I've not known them to crack on a road car. Did you talk to Powerflex about this as they offer a lifetime warranty on their products, which includes motorsport use. They would be very interested in knowing what happened.
If you need a contact let me know. They have been very helpful in the past when we have had "tvr related problems' in the past - usually sudden changes to dimensions!
Going back to the original points - they provide a better bearing which sharpens up the suspension and improves the handling without making the ride harsher.
At last some sensible comments 
When I said 'poly bushes' it was a generic term like Hoover and yes the powerflex do seem to be the bush of choice. I ran/run Poly bushes/Powerflex on the V8 Westfield and my Genesis race car & were very good ok the Westy was 300kg lighter/Genesis 506kg lighter than the chubby Tamora so I'm assuming the shore hardness was less on the Westy/Genesis due to the difference in weight but I would bet the handling would be much improved on the Tamora. But I'd rather here from people who have experienced this other than as rightly said Chinese whispers...
Buzz
When I said 'poly bushes' it was a generic term like Hoover and yes the powerflex do seem to be the bush of choice. I ran/run Poly bushes/Powerflex on the V8 Westfield and my Genesis race car & were very good ok the Westy was 300kg lighter/Genesis 506kg lighter than the chubby Tamora so I'm assuming the shore hardness was less on the Westy/Genesis due to the difference in weight but I would bet the handling would be much improved on the Tamora. But I'd rather here from people who have experienced this other than as rightly said Chinese whispers...Buzz
Edited by Buzz Billsberry on Thursday 8th September 10:01
Just an update on this subject. I've been speaking with various members in the race and sprint community and a long local TVR dealers and the general consensus is leave it standard other than when the diff bushes are due for replacement stick with the standard metallistc bushes, as it will basically reduce the quality of the ride for a road going car
So standard it is then!
Thanks for every bodies input on this
Regards
Buzz
So standard it is then!
Thanks for every bodies input on this
Regards
Buzz
I really find this hard to believe that fitting Powerflex poly bushes makes the ride quality harsher. It certainly is not the experience I and others have seen on the other TVR models that preceeded the Tamora and that have the same or similar suspension design/architecture. It is not the comment I had back from the owners that have had them fitted. So where all this negativity has come from I simply don't understand?
According to my sales records, all of the poly kits I have sold have gone to road car owners of whom none have come back and said that was a terrible decision. The ride is too harsh.
The reason I developed the set for the T cars was because I was asked for them by many owners, who had them on on their previous TVRs and wanted them on their T cars because they had the same woolyness that they had suffered before fitting.
Again I wonder how much is based on "Chinese whisper" rather than real experience.
According to my sales records, all of the poly kits I have sold have gone to road car owners of whom none have come back and said that was a terrible decision. The ride is too harsh.
The reason I developed the set for the T cars was because I was asked for them by many owners, who had them on on their previous TVRs and wanted them on their T cars because they had the same woolyness that they had suffered before fitting.
Again I wonder how much is based on "Chinese whisper" rather than real experience.
shpub said:
I really find this hard to believe that fitting Powerflex poly bushes makes the ride quality harsher. It certainly is not the experience I and others have seen on the other TVR models that preceeded the Tamora and that have the same or similar suspension design/architecture. It is not the comment I had back from the owners that have had them fitted. So where all this negativity has come from I simply don't understand?
According to my sales records, all of the poly kits I have sold have gone to road car owners of whom none have come back and said that was a terrible decision. The ride is too harsh.
The reason I developed the set for the T cars was because I was asked for them by many owners, who had them on on their previous TVRs and wanted them on their T cars because they had the same woolyness that they had suffered before fitting.
Again I wonder how much is based on "Chinese whisper" rather than real experience.
Fair comment Steve and its like anything else I guess until you have actually experienced them yourself etc its all subjective. I find it hard to believe too. The only issue I had with any road car was with a 2.8i 4x4 sierra twin turbo and it basically destroyed the handling it was a mare! Admittedly they may have been other areas to address on that.According to my sales records, all of the poly kits I have sold have gone to road car owners of whom none have come back and said that was a terrible decision. The ride is too harsh.
The reason I developed the set for the T cars was because I was asked for them by many owners, who had them on on their previous TVRs and wanted them on their T cars because they had the same woolyness that they had suffered before fitting.
Again I wonder how much is based on "Chinese whisper" rather than real experience.
You commented that your customers have nothing but praise for the kits ability to increase the dynamics of the handling then you have it 1st hand and you can't compete with that knowledge.
I guess I'll still have to consider the purchase
Buzz
Buzz
Dear all,
after a first test ride over the weekend with new RG polybushes at front I could not feel any harder ride or other disadvantages. The car feels sharp and precise, and the poly bushes feel not the make the ride quality harsher. There is no sign of a reduction in the quality of the ride for a road going car. Maybe this is different on a field lane but this is not where I use to drive!
However, in my opinion shocks and springs are responsible for any driving comfort!
after a first test ride over the weekend with new RG polybushes at front I could not feel any harder ride or other disadvantages. The car feels sharp and precise, and the poly bushes feel not the make the ride quality harsher. There is no sign of a reduction in the quality of the ride for a road going car. Maybe this is different on a field lane but this is not where I use to drive!
However, in my opinion shocks and springs are responsible for any driving comfort!
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