Power steering working intermittently
Discussion
Can anyone please help suggest what might be causing intermittently working power steering? Sometimes it will work when turning the wheel right but not left and sometimes it will just cut in and out randomly in both directions.
The pump assembly came loose today, the exhaust style clamps holding the brackets onto the chassis came loose but I didn't notice until I started checking things over to what may have cuased the problem. The pump coming loose might be a coincidence and nothing to do with the problems with the power steering but I doubt it.
I’ve had to disconnect the power to the pump for now as it comes on and off unpredictably making it dangerous to drive. I’m going to have to go over the car this week in my garage and see if I can narrow down the fault. The relay seems to work, the pump comes on every time the ignition is turned on (it buzzes), the fluid hasn’t dropped, the pump seems to be pumping even when the power steering doesn’t seem to be working (breifly had someone listening to the pump this afternoon while turning the wheel). So I'm not sure where to look next. As it works most of the time I'm guessing it isn't a fuse.
I have no idea about how the steering rack works so I’ll have to poke about and see if I can find anything loose.
I've run the car for some of today with no power steering, it is drivable but at lower speeds it gets very heavy! I'm due to do some driver training on Friday and want to try and sort this myself if possible as no garage will be able to fit me in before Friday!
The pump assembly came loose today, the exhaust style clamps holding the brackets onto the chassis came loose but I didn't notice until I started checking things over to what may have cuased the problem. The pump coming loose might be a coincidence and nothing to do with the problems with the power steering but I doubt it.
I’ve had to disconnect the power to the pump for now as it comes on and off unpredictably making it dangerous to drive. I’m going to have to go over the car this week in my garage and see if I can narrow down the fault. The relay seems to work, the pump comes on every time the ignition is turned on (it buzzes), the fluid hasn’t dropped, the pump seems to be pumping even when the power steering doesn’t seem to be working (breifly had someone listening to the pump this afternoon while turning the wheel). So I'm not sure where to look next. As it works most of the time I'm guessing it isn't a fuse.
I have no idea about how the steering rack works so I’ll have to poke about and see if I can find anything loose.
I've run the car for some of today with no power steering, it is drivable but at lower speeds it gets very heavy! I'm due to do some driver training on Friday and want to try and sort this myself if possible as no garage will be able to fit me in before Friday!
Hi,
I had a similar fault. I overcame it temporarily by removing the power steering relay (weather proof grey cap on mine - clear to see when you remove engine cover) I then filed the relay down as I could see the contact was poor. This gave me another journey or two out of it until I got a new relay. repeat process as many times as you like until the relay will not allow you to file it anymore.
Used a nail file from the other half. Had to break it down to get a thin section of grit paper to fit in to the relay.
Good luck.
I had a similar fault. I overcame it temporarily by removing the power steering relay (weather proof grey cap on mine - clear to see when you remove engine cover) I then filed the relay down as I could see the contact was poor. This gave me another journey or two out of it until I got a new relay. repeat process as many times as you like until the relay will not allow you to file it anymore.
Used a nail file from the other half. Had to break it down to get a thin section of grit paper to fit in to the relay.
Good luck.
Thanks, it looks like the relay is working as far as I can tell. I may see if I can get hold of another one just to be safe, I believe it is a Peugeot part? I took the relay off last night, the housing came off and left the relay in place and when I tried to remove it with fingers I kept knocking it and it kept powering up the pump, I was more careful after this and managed to prise it out. The contacts look good but I'll have a closer look tonight.
The relay can work, but as pointed out the contacts can fail, on the first relay that was fitted to my Tuscan S only half the contact face was actually making. An up-rated one (55 amps instead of 45 amps) is available from Renault part No is 8200253922, although you have to remove the relay internals from this and fit them into the water resistant case.
Thanks, I have detached the power steering pump this evening and checked connections etc. The relay seems to be making a good connection every time from what I can see. Should the pump just run constantly when the engine is on as this is what it seems to be doing. When I manually push the arm of the relay with the engine off and ignition off(as I did to my surprise when trying to remove the relay after the waterproof housing came off leaving the innards of the relay in place) there is contact and a bit of a spark and the pump runs.
With the engine running I can feel constant movement / vibration through the pressured braided pipe coming from the pump as if there is a constant flow of fluid through there. This doesn't change when someone is moving the wheel. Does this mean the pump is working correctly?
Could there be air in the system? This might have happened when the whole PAS pump and reservoir came loose and was being thrown about in the engine bay while I was going sideways, backwards, in circles etc. during the airfield driver training day I was on yesterday.
Is it worth me bleeding the system and replacing with fresh fluid if it looks very dark? Could air cause intermittent power steering?
With the engine running I can feel constant movement / vibration through the pressured braided pipe coming from the pump as if there is a constant flow of fluid through there. This doesn't change when someone is moving the wheel. Does this mean the pump is working correctly?
Could there be air in the system? This might have happened when the whole PAS pump and reservoir came loose and was being thrown about in the engine bay while I was going sideways, backwards, in circles etc. during the airfield driver training day I was on yesterday.
Is it worth me bleeding the system and replacing with fresh fluid if it looks very dark? Could air cause intermittent power steering?
NickT said:
Thanks, I have detached the power steering pump this evening and checked connections etc. The relay seems to be making a good connection every time from what I can see. Should the pump just run constantly when the engine is on as this is what it seems to be doing. When I manually push the arm of the relay with the engine off and ignition off(as I did to my surprise when trying to remove the relay after the waterproof housing came off leaving the innards of the relay in place) there is contact and a bit of a spark and the pump runs.
With the engine running I can feel constant movement / vibration through the pressured braided pipe coming from the pump as if there is a constant flow of fluid through there. This doesn't change when someone is moving the wheel. Does this mean the pump is working correctly?
Could there be air in the system? This might have happened when the whole PAS pump and reservoir came loose and was being thrown about in the engine bay while I was going sideways, backwards, in circles etc. during the airfield driver training day I was on yesterday.
Is it worth me bleeding the system and replacing with fresh fluid if it looks very dark? Could air cause intermittent power steering?
Might be worth a check in the battery hidey hole. Green wire is the power supply to the pump. Could be poor connection(s) on the +ve from the battery?With the engine running I can feel constant movement / vibration through the pressured braided pipe coming from the pump as if there is a constant flow of fluid through there. This doesn't change when someone is moving the wheel. Does this mean the pump is working correctly?
Could there be air in the system? This might have happened when the whole PAS pump and reservoir came loose and was being thrown about in the engine bay while I was going sideways, backwards, in circles etc. during the airfield driver training day I was on yesterday.
Is it worth me bleeding the system and replacing with fresh fluid if it looks very dark? Could air cause intermittent power steering?
I shall have another dig around tonight. It feels to me like the pump is constantly working while the engine is running which leads me to believe that the power supply to the engine is working fine. Maybe I'll disconnect power while the engine is running tonight and see if I can feel a difference on the pipes as I may be thinking I can feel the pump working when actually it is something else.
Does the power steering pump just work constantly while the engine is running? Does something kick in and out when you turn the wheel?
Thanks for eveyone giving me things to look at here, I'm booked on a training day on Friday and I'm trying to get the car running well for that.
Does the power steering pump just work constantly while the engine is running? Does something kick in and out when you turn the wheel?
Thanks for eveyone giving me things to look at here, I'm booked on a training day on Friday and I'm trying to get the car running well for that.
NickT said:
I shall have another dig around tonight. It feels to me like the pump is constantly working while the engine is running which leads me to believe that the power supply to the engine is working fine. Maybe I'll disconnect power while the engine is running tonight and see if I can feel a difference on the pipes as I may be thinking I can feel the pump working when actually it is something else.
Does the power steering pump just work constantly while the engine is running? Does something kick in and out when you turn the wheel?
Thanks for eveyone giving me things to look at here, I'm booked on a training day on Friday and I'm trying to get the car running well for that.
Electric pump, runs all the time when the engine is running.Does the power steering pump just work constantly while the engine is running? Does something kick in and out when you turn the wheel?
Thanks for eveyone giving me things to look at here, I'm booked on a training day on Friday and I'm trying to get the car running well for that.
Shep
NCE 61 said:
The relay can work, but as pointed out the contacts can fail, on the first relay that was fitted to my Tuscan S only half the contact face was actually making. An up-rated one (55 amps instead of 45 amps) is available from Renault part No is 8200253922, although you have to remove the relay internals from this and fit them into the water resistant case.
I went out to the local Renault supplier and got a new relay just to be certain that this isn't the issue. It cost £22 so not too bad. Thanks for the info on the replacement part.The relay didn't make a difference 
I've checked all wiring including down by the battery (green wire), I can't see an obvious fuse but when I disconnect it the pump stops working and when I connect it the pump works again. All other connections look sound.
I've done some further testing with the engine running and the PAS connected up. I notice that when the PAS is working correctly the pump (I assume it is the pump) makes a low pitched whirring noise but when the PAS suddenly stops working the noise becomes higher pitched. I'm guessing the pump is struggling then which is causing the PAS to not work? I'm wondering if this points to needing a new pump!?
I've noticed my PAS fluid is a muddy red wine colour rather than a nice translucent cranberry juice kind of colour as it looks when new. Could this be causing a problem and would flushing the system and refilling with new fluid help?
I've checked all wiring including down by the battery (green wire), I can't see an obvious fuse but when I disconnect it the pump stops working and when I connect it the pump works again. All other connections look sound.I've done some further testing with the engine running and the PAS connected up. I notice that when the PAS is working correctly the pump (I assume it is the pump) makes a low pitched whirring noise but when the PAS suddenly stops working the noise becomes higher pitched. I'm guessing the pump is struggling then which is causing the PAS to not work? I'm wondering if this points to needing a new pump!?
I've noticed my PAS fluid is a muddy red wine colour rather than a nice translucent cranberry juice kind of colour as it looks when new. Could this be causing a problem and would flushing the system and refilling with new fluid help?
I fully flushed the system and replaced the fluid with new Dextron II automatic transmission fluid but this didn't make a difference.
I also managed to get a new pump from eBay, the part seems to be identical to a Mk2 Citroen Saxo PAS pump apart from a slightly different reservoir bottle. So I replaced the pump as it wasn't very expensive to do. Unfortunately this didn't help either
I now think it is the steering rack which has a problem. Maybe the seals have gone. Car going to TVR Power tomorrow now to try and sort it out. Oh well, at least I understand the power steering a little more now.
I also managed to get a new pump from eBay, the part seems to be identical to a Mk2 Citroen Saxo PAS pump apart from a slightly different reservoir bottle. So I replaced the pump as it wasn't very expensive to do. Unfortunately this didn't help either
I now think it is the steering rack which has a problem. Maybe the seals have gone. Car going to TVR Power tomorrow now to try and sort it out. Oh well, at least I understand the power steering a little more now.
Got my car back today and my wallet is just shy of £1k lighter
My steering rack was sent off to be repaired, it had new seals etc. put in it at a cost of around £300. Cheaper than a new one I suppose! Unfortunately the labour cost, realignment (full geo and corner weighting) and a few other bits such as oil (due to having to take oil tank out) then stung me for the other £650.
The car seems to be ok now although I'm not 100% sure, probably just me being paranoid that something isn't quite right. I'm sure it is pulling to the right...
My steering rack was sent off to be repaired, it had new seals etc. put in it at a cost of around £300. Cheaper than a new one I suppose! Unfortunately the labour cost, realignment (full geo and corner weighting) and a few other bits such as oil (due to having to take oil tank out) then stung me for the other £650.
The car seems to be ok now although I'm not 100% sure, probably just me being paranoid that something isn't quite right. I'm sure it is pulling to the right...
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