v12 vantage vs v8 (420)
Discussion
Has anyone got both or gone form the v8 to the v12 ? Just looking at road tests and the like and performance wise there is not as much in it as you would think,and when I drove them back to back it didn't seem like the vantage had near 100bhp more.Saying that I never got why the v12 v had significantly slower road test figures (about a second differenc eon the 0-100mph runs..by numerous magazines )than the dbs which has the identical engine/gearbox and weighs more.
I don't know about the road test to which you refer. Such tests often turn up some surprising (and hard to believe) results. Regardless, I used to have a 4.3 and I can tell you that the difference between that car and the V12V is night and day. I think you might need to test drive the V12 again, and don't forget to press the sport button. The low- and mid-range torque increase is what makes the biggest difference, and what makes the V12 more fun to drive (power available at nearly any rpm; no need to wind it up every time to go fast).
Another quick thought: although it is easy to obsess over the performance statistics, they really don't tell the whole story. Specifically, they don't tell you what it is like to drive the car, especially on a normal, day-to-day basis. For example, if a car is peaky, meaning most of the power is output near the rev limit, it could have very good performance numbers, but may not feel fast in the middle rpm range where 90% of your road driving is done.
From experience of owning both the 4.7 [10my] and the current V12V I must agree with our colonial friend that its
like night and day.IMHO go back for an extended test in the V12, because as good and refreshed as it is I didn't think the S is quite the same type of animal.
Everyone to their own but it would have to be the V12 for me unless you like that flappy paddle thing and that tinny
old V8 rumble.....
like night and day.IMHO go back for an extended test in the V12, because as good and refreshed as it is I didn't think the S is quite the same type of animal.
Everyone to their own but it would have to be the V12 for me unless you like that flappy paddle thing and that tinny
old V8 rumble.....
franki68 said:
Has anyone got both or gone form the v8 to the v12 ? Just looking at road tests and the like and performance wise there is not as much in it as you would think,and when I drove them back to back it didn't seem like the vantage had near 100bhp more.Saying that I never got why the v12 v had significantly slower road test figures (about a second differenc eon the 0-100mph runs..by numerous magazines )than the dbs which has the identical engine/gearbox and weighs more.
I had a 4.3 V8 and now have a 6.0 V12. Unless something crazy has happened between 4.3 V8 and 4.7 V8 I must humbly suggest that were not paying enough attention and/or not trying hard enough.My advice - get back in them and spank 'em! :-)
Had all three (4.3, 4.7 and 6.0). As said below, night and day.
And it is not all about torque and power either. I would swear the V12 is significantly more sure-footed and accurate than a 4.7 with sportspack. (its definately firmer). Also the gearbox is significantly more refined than a manual V8.
G
And it is not all about torque and power either. I would swear the V12 is significantly more sure-footed and accurate than a 4.7 with sportspack. (its definately firmer). Also the gearbox is significantly more refined than a manual V8.
G
Rex Racer said:
Another quick thought: although it is easy to obsess over the performance statistics, they really don't tell the whole story. Specifically, they don't tell you what it is like to drive the car, especially on a normal, day-to-day basis. For example, if a car is peaky, meaning most of the power is output near the rev limit, it could have very good performance numbers, but may not feel fast in the middle rpm range where 90% of your road driving is done.
+1 my last car was quicker and more agile but the V8VR is far more "entertaining" to drive I went from being a very happy owner of a 4.7 V8 to feeling I must own a V12V following an extended test drive. I too looked at the statistics and thought "hmmm, there cant be that much in it to justify the price difference". One good test drive later and I realised what all the fuss was about - I had to have one! The car is indeed night and day different (better!) to the V8V, which is inself a mighty car, indeed up to that point it was the best car I have ever owned.
Please read my thread going from V8V to V12V http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=892...
I am still "buzzing" about being able to own a V12V, which must surely be one of the greatest cars available at this time!
Please read my thread going from V8V to V12V http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=892...
I am still "buzzing" about being able to own a V12V, which must surely be one of the greatest cars available at this time!
Adam2S said:
Please read my thread going from V8V to V12V http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=892...
Your Vantage looks exactly like mine Adam, except for your steering wheel being on the wrong side. 
+1 to the above comments - I was very excited and happy to be the owner of a V8V (4.7) - it was the the car of my dreams and as my first aston the day I picked it up I will never forget (stupidest grim ever).
I thought it was a keeper...... but then got curious about the V12, initially looked to hardcore (or was it too expensive at the time) - I didn't take a V12 out for a test drive until I knew I could afford it (for obvious reasons) and knew after the first couple of bends I was done for....V12 any day....for me it was like chalk and cheese. What surprised the most was that on every day driving I found the V12 easier to drive than the more "muscular" V8 + then you get the rush when you hit the right pedal...amazing
But, as always, I guess it depends what you want and I still think the V8 was a wonderful car and would have one any day....over a 1M!!
I thought it was a keeper...... but then got curious about the V12, initially looked to hardcore (or was it too expensive at the time) - I didn't take a V12 out for a test drive until I knew I could afford it (for obvious reasons) and knew after the first couple of bends I was done for....V12 any day....for me it was like chalk and cheese. What surprised the most was that on every day driving I found the V12 easier to drive than the more "muscular" V8 + then you get the rush when you hit the right pedal...amazing
But, as always, I guess it depends what you want and I still think the V8 was a wonderful car and would have one any day....over a 1M!!
I have a 4.7 Sports Pack manual Coupe. It's a truly great drive. IMO, the 4.3 is a great car, but the difference to the 4.7 is quite significant, especially at low and mid revs. The 4.7 does not need to be revved hard to be very quick, whereas the 4.3 does.
I took a very good test drive in the V12V, and I've read the performance figures for the V12 and both V8s with great interest. The test figures show that there is, obviously, a difference between the 4.7 and the V12 but that, through the gears, the difference is not that great, around 3-ish mph through a 1/4 mile. Not a small difference, but not that big either. Interestingly, the figures show a bigger difference between the 4.3 and the 4.7 V8 (around 6 mph through a 1/4 mile) than between the 4.7 and the V12. Also, tests I've seen have shown the V12V to be slightly quicker than the DBS, which makes sense.
And yet... The V12V feels like a complete beast. It feels faster in the way you would expect it to feel, more so than what the figures show. The low and mid-range torque in simply massive. The ride is noticeably firmer, though, and I imagine it needs to be in order to control the significant extra weight over the nose and be able to handle comparably to a V8V Sports Pack. I drove my 4.7 down the same challenging road I tested the V12 on, and both felt superb.
I still completely love my 4.7 V8V. I also can't help but think about the V12V. Of course, the V12 doesn't have the V8's dry sump, so the V12 is clearly inferior
I took a very good test drive in the V12V, and I've read the performance figures for the V12 and both V8s with great interest. The test figures show that there is, obviously, a difference between the 4.7 and the V12 but that, through the gears, the difference is not that great, around 3-ish mph through a 1/4 mile. Not a small difference, but not that big either. Interestingly, the figures show a bigger difference between the 4.3 and the 4.7 V8 (around 6 mph through a 1/4 mile) than between the 4.7 and the V12. Also, tests I've seen have shown the V12V to be slightly quicker than the DBS, which makes sense.
And yet... The V12V feels like a complete beast. It feels faster in the way you would expect it to feel, more so than what the figures show. The low and mid-range torque in simply massive. The ride is noticeably firmer, though, and I imagine it needs to be in order to control the significant extra weight over the nose and be able to handle comparably to a V8V Sports Pack. I drove my 4.7 down the same challenging road I tested the V12 on, and both felt superb.
I still completely love my 4.7 V8V. I also can't help but think about the V12V. Of course, the V12 doesn't have the V8's dry sump, so the V12 is clearly inferior
I had a test drive of a V12V early last year when they first came out - in the wet! It was just scary on the P Corsa's with so much low down torque. Every bend and roundabout exit was 'interesting' - and in Sport mode - well that was fun!
I found the 4.7 V8V had plenty of poke without trying to throw you off the road at every turn. The 4.7 is definately more torquey than its predecessor.
Graham
I found the 4.7 V8V had plenty of poke without trying to throw you off the road at every turn. The 4.7 is definately more torquey than its predecessor.
Graham
I am concentrating on straight line speed,and trust me I know there is more to a car than that.But the question is specific,I dont want to know about the handling,I know enough about that.I ask becasuse it does seem to me the difference between the v12 v and the 4.7 is actually less than the difference between the 4.3 and 4.7,and the dbs figures are consistently stronger than the v12 v in every road test I ever read.! Surely the vantage should be faster ,same engine etc better power to weight ,just curious .
GPM3D said:
I had a test drive of a V12V early last year when they first came out - in the wet! It was just scary on the P Corsa's with so much low down torque. Every bend and roundabout exit was 'interesting' - and in Sport mode - well that was fun!
Graham
Is the V12V really that hard to handle in the wet? Can any V12V owners comment? I fancy a V12V in a couple of years when I can hopefully afford one, but if they are that hard to handle in the wet then that wouldn't work for my lifestyle.Graham
franki68 said:
I am concentrating on straight line speed,and trust me I know there is more to a car than that.But the question is specific,I dont want to know about the handling,I know enough about that.I ask becasuse it does seem to me the difference between the v12 v and the 4.7 is actually less than the difference between the 4.3 and 4.7,and the dbs figures are consistently stronger than the v12 v in every road test I ever read.! Surely the vantage should be faster ,same engine etc better power to weight ,just curious .
Straight line speed or whatever, trust me the V12V feels a LOT faster and more fun than the V8V.Its possible that the DBS -v- V12V performance stats are affected by the gearbox ratios. Again who cares, drive a DBS and a V12V and see which cars character suits you best. Stats really mean nothing other than bragging rights at the pub. Aston's are so much more than that!
Mr Overheads said:
Is the V12V really that hard to handle in the wet? Can any V12V owners comment? I fancy a V12V in a couple of years when I can hopefully afford one, but if they are that hard to handle in the wet then that wouldn't work for my lifestyle.
There is nothing wrong with the V12V in the wet per se, the issue is with the pirelli corsa system tyres which are fitted as standard. They are a summer / track tyre with a semi slick tread pattern and as such are far from their best in the wet. Plenty of threads on here about alternative tyres, so do a quick google and get the V12V bought! That said I drive mine all year round, every day of the week come rain or snow and its ok - you just have to be sensible when the conditions are poor, but that goes for any 500BHP car really!Edited by Adam2S on Friday 15th July 13:21
Adam2S said:
There is nothing wrong with the V12V in the wet per se, the issue is with the pirelli corsa system tyres which are fitted as standard. They are a summer / track tyre with a semi slick tread pattern and as such are far from their best in the wet. Plenty of threads on here about alternative tyres, so do a quick google and get the V12V bought! That said I drive mine all year round, every day of the week come rain or snow and its ok - you just have to be sensible when the conditions are poor, but that goes for any 500BHP car really!
Ive driven both,I dont like the dbs,i love the v12 vantage.Edited by Adam2S on Friday 15th July 11:57
Adam2S said:
Straight line speed or whatever, trust me the V12V feels a LOT faster and more fun than the V8V.
Couldn't agree more. franki68, IMO you really need to stop focusing on performance stats. As everyone keeps saying, there is a huge difference between the V8 and the V12. As far as the DBS, if you don't like it, don't worry about the DBS vs. V12V stats. On track the V12V is faster than the DBS by quite a bit. It has to do with the gear rations but also the speed that you can carry into the corners. The weight distribution of the V12V is perfect so it propels itself out of corners and as a result can take higher cornering speeds than the more GT style DBS. Due to the torque of the V12 and the grip provided by the Pirelli Corsas it was at par with the GT3/GT4 race cars on the circuit on that particular day.
The Pirelli P-Zero Corsas are indeed tricky in the wet but in their element they are fantastic. In the wet the rear end will come out quite easily but it is a predictable movement which is easy (and fun) to control. Also they need to get up to working temperature before they work so straight out of the garage they demand respect. I use winter tyres from end Oct to March for that reason. (also because i feel stupid being left with spinning wheels at the traffic lights by an Opel Corsa when the going is wet/cold).
The Pirelli P-Zero Corsas are indeed tricky in the wet but in their element they are fantastic. In the wet the rear end will come out quite easily but it is a predictable movement which is easy (and fun) to control. Also they need to get up to working temperature before they work so straight out of the garage they demand respect. I use winter tyres from end Oct to March for that reason. (also because i feel stupid being left with spinning wheels at the traffic lights by an Opel Corsa when the going is wet/cold).
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