Is Timeless Worthless?
Discussion
I am beginning to think so. I’m not naming and shaming here but recent experiences have left me very disillusioned with the brand and main dealers.
About 6 weeks ago I part exchanged a pristine V12 Vantage for a Vanquish Volante. Long story short the car had so many faults I ended up rejecting it for a full refund. My Vantage was not offered back so had been moved on.
I have been looking for the right car since then and yesterday drove 120 miles to view an allegedly beautiful Vanquish S that is placed a holding deposit on. When they pulled off the cover it took all of 3 seconds to decide the car wasn’t for me. It looked as if it had spent every one of its miles following a gritter!
Now I’ve read the timeless inspection and standard and spending this sort of money on a timeless vehicle should not be anything less than an amazing memorable experience. I think it goes something like ‘aesthetically and mechanically as good as when it got its famous wing badges at our Global Headquarters’.
My recent experiences would beg to differ.
About 6 weeks ago I part exchanged a pristine V12 Vantage for a Vanquish Volante. Long story short the car had so many faults I ended up rejecting it for a full refund. My Vantage was not offered back so had been moved on.
I have been looking for the right car since then and yesterday drove 120 miles to view an allegedly beautiful Vanquish S that is placed a holding deposit on. When they pulled off the cover it took all of 3 seconds to decide the car wasn’t for me. It looked as if it had spent every one of its miles following a gritter!
Now I’ve read the timeless inspection and standard and spending this sort of money on a timeless vehicle should not be anything less than an amazing memorable experience. I think it goes something like ‘aesthetically and mechanically as good as when it got its famous wing badges at our Global Headquarters’.
My recent experiences would beg to differ.
I was very sorry to read your post David.
Your unfortunate experience must be made worse, because (your profile photo) you have lost your beautiful V12V.
There are many used AMs which are pampered by their proud owners, so we just have to hope some of those appear for sale when we are looking. Unfortunately it can be a time consuming task.
I have heard of dealers putting sub-standard AMs into auction, but perhaps it is a rarity.
The ‘Timeless‘ sales scheme does smack a little of marketing.
The giveaway is their choice of the phrase ‘certified pre-owned‘. There is an ironic ambiguity in those words.
Hope that you can find what you want.
I think to some degree it depends on the specific dealership.
I recently purchased a Vanquish Volante from HWM and the whole experience totally met my expectations. Not only was the car immaculately prepared, but the after sales service has also been 10/10.
Sorry to hear it wasn't the same for you.
GG33
Having just come back into the AM fold I was looking for a Vantage V12SR, there were a few about and most poorly prepred with the dealers stating that if I purchased all would be sorted, not good enough.
In the end I went for a low mileage Vanquish Volante with not one stone chip, as any panels that needed rectifying were resprayed before being offered for sale.
Maybe not what you want to hear but very common in the motor trade.
It could be that the car you looked at was on sale or return as the timeless warranty does not take into account stone chips, in fact when you read the T & C for the Timeless warranty you have to ask is it worth having?
Look at other dealers I am sure that you will find a decent one.
In the end I went for a low mileage Vanquish Volante with not one stone chip, as any panels that needed rectifying were resprayed before being offered for sale.
Maybe not what you want to hear but very common in the motor trade.
It could be that the car you looked at was on sale or return as the timeless warranty does not take into account stone chips, in fact when you read the T & C for the Timeless warranty you have to ask is it worth having?
Look at other dealers I am sure that you will find a decent one.
Yes that quote about being like new is nonsense! Definitely over-selling but it's such a shame your hopes were raised and travel wasted by inaccurate description. I suppose some are less critical when they look at a car.
I do not put much store on Timeless inspection but the warranty is very good.
I do not put much store on Timeless inspection but the warranty is very good.
Mmmm......from what ive read on the Timeless scheme there are minimum requirements for consumables, condition etc. That does sound like the individual dealer is not following it by slapping a Timeless warranty on a car without sorting the paint out first. You may expect a few chips on a used car, but not the full on shotgun effect you see on a car that has been on track or high road mileage.
I would continue your search and try another dealer. I've experienced service at half a dozen dealers over the last 12 years, a couple of them I continue to use. The others all did something that would cause me not to return again.
I would continue your search and try another dealer. I've experienced service at half a dozen dealers over the last 12 years, a couple of them I continue to use. The others all did something that would cause me not to return again.
It for me really depends on the dealership. My car had a 'Timeless' warranty and I sent it back after two days with a very serious fault that was clearly evident and they tried to fob me off. The more unscrupulous will (did) put a warranty on a faulty car to get rid knowing that the fault will be covered by the warranty rather than fix it themselves in the first place. That is my experience with the supplying AM dealer 
Subsequently my local AM dealer has been superb as have Aston Martin themselves who have not only rectified the fault but put an extended Aston Martin on the car to restore my faith in the brand. AM customer care for me is superb however, some dealerships can tarnish the reputation by acting like Arthur Daley. It all depends on who did the inspection and passed it off. So sadly 'buyer beware'.
Subsequently my local AM dealer has been superb as have Aston Martin themselves who have not only rectified the fault but put an extended Aston Martin on the car to restore my faith in the brand. AM customer care for me is superb however, some dealerships can tarnish the reputation by acting like Arthur Daley. It all depends on who did the inspection and passed it off. So sadly 'buyer beware'.
Edited by macdeb on Sunday 13th October 12:20
Edited by macdeb on Sunday 13th October 12:22
A very sad affair as your Vantage was pristine and cherished.
Any dealer offering to immediately cart a new purchase away for weeks to fix many issues to the initial standard expected clearly kills the feel good factor and denies you the car itself. That makes the purchase more pointless than timeless.
Surely prepping a car to a good standard (inc fixing oil leaks
,and detailing paint) in anticipation of any £100k sale would be more productive and positive all 'round?
Any dealer offering to immediately cart a new purchase away for weeks to fix many issues to the initial standard expected clearly kills the feel good factor and denies you the car itself. That makes the purchase more pointless than timeless.
Surely prepping a car to a good standard (inc fixing oil leaks
,and detailing paint) in anticipation of any £100k sale would be more productive and positive all 'round? Oil leaks eh? How could they possibly miss that in the Timeless check? 
The supplying dealer of my first Vantage insisted that the oil leak from the gearbox oil cooler wasn't there when I left the dealership having collected the car. Up until the point I sent them this photo I had taken when I first viewed the car. I was obviously annoyed I hadn't spotted it at the time but it really is their job to do this not the buyer's. They never apologised but fortunately my local dealership sorted out this and all the other problems they'd left me with.
Both my Vantages have taken me about 6 months to get perfect post purchase. The warranty has meant this has not cost me any money but it certainly cost me in time and inconvenience. So my opinion is that the warranty is quite good but the inspections are often poor.
The supplying dealer of my first Vantage insisted that the oil leak from the gearbox oil cooler wasn't there when I left the dealership having collected the car. Up until the point I sent them this photo I had taken when I first viewed the car. I was obviously annoyed I hadn't spotted it at the time but it really is their job to do this not the buyer's. They never apologised but fortunately my local dealership sorted out this and all the other problems they'd left me with.
Both my Vantages have taken me about 6 months to get perfect post purchase. The warranty has meant this has not cost me any money but it certainly cost me in time and inconvenience. So my opinion is that the warranty is quite good but the inspections are often poor.
My last used Vantage bought 4 years old with 30k miles on it was prepared immaculately by Newcastle AM, it really was like a new car. There were probably 3 stone chips that had been touched up professionally, wheels unmarked and fresh or nearly new consumables. Within the first 6 months the chrome on side strake corroded and diamond cut wheel finish deteriorated, neither officially covered under Timeless warranty, but all fixed without fuss by the dealer.
If you see a poorly prepped car its down to the individual dealers standards. A few years back I had my car serviced and MOT at a dealer in SW as it was convenient when flying on business trip.When I returned I was kept waiting 90 mins or so whilst my car was washed and I sat having a coffee watching a staff member wipe down all the used stock with the same old chammy leather, probably 25-30 cars without even rinsing the cloth. I gave my own car a good check over when it was ready and never went back.
If you see a poorly prepped car its down to the individual dealers standards. A few years back I had my car serviced and MOT at a dealer in SW as it was convenient when flying on business trip.When I returned I was kept waiting 90 mins or so whilst my car was washed and I sat having a coffee watching a staff member wipe down all the used stock with the same old chammy leather, probably 25-30 cars without even rinsing the cloth. I gave my own car a good check over when it was ready and never went back.
I do remember the dealer chuckling when i went on my hands and knees under my Rapide some 5 years ago. I was then very worried about the 'new' barcode sticker on the rear ARB, but soon realised TADTS! I'm convinced this is a far better approach than a Timeless tick box mind - Pete would surely agree!
Its not an Aston thing of course. I spent £1000 on my Macan 2 months into ownership as the front left tyre was down to the canvas - a 14 month old Porsche approved MD car... Had to change 2 tyres and get a high end independent alignment check done. A blowout was a horrendous thought as had the b thing at 130 in Germany. Then the oil lamp came on in the middle of a hyper busy day of 5 different meetings - they dont even check the OIL LEVEL???
You will get a nice one Dave - I'll get on my hands and knees to ensure it!
Its not an Aston thing of course. I spent £1000 on my Macan 2 months into ownership as the front left tyre was down to the canvas - a 14 month old Porsche approved MD car... Had to change 2 tyres and get a high end independent alignment check done. A blowout was a horrendous thought as had the b thing at 130 in Germany. Then the oil lamp came on in the middle of a hyper busy day of 5 different meetings - they dont even check the OIL LEVEL???
You will get a nice one Dave - I'll get on my hands and knees to ensure it!
It does seem that a bit like landrover products you either get a good Aston Martin or a bad one. It does make you worry if you have a good car and you are considering a change to a different one. Thank god I can’t be tempted out of my V12 Vantage having just come back from an epic Highlands trip. Sorry to hear about your trouble David
I just bought a timeless v12v. I saw the car before it had been certified as a timeless car. They spent a good deal on bringing the car up to scratch, reconditioned alloys, replaced the waterfall dash, replaced rear light cluster and refreshed the door seels. As others have said it must be dealer dependant but I was impressed by how much they cared. The car looked stunning on presentation.
Got to say, I've had three "timeless covered" cars from Works now, and all of them were spot on. The odd niggle yes (and I mean minor), but each and every one sorted out quick smart by Works under the warranty.
It appears that different dealers seem to view the pre-purchase check in different ways. I know when it comes to chips etc, I think there's a guide that if the chip/scratch can be seen from a defined distance (a couple of meters I think) in normal conditions, then it needs sorting.
At the end of the day any dealer is going to try and get away with what they can, regardless of the Marque. I've seen some terrible Ferrari's sitting in showrooms over the years (paint actually peeling on a F430). I suspect this will get even worse if the economy starts to take a hit.
OP - do not loose heart, I'd like to think there's more good examples out there than rough ones. As for a Volantes, I think some will now be holding off selling until spring, unless they have no choice. Surely nobody voluntarily sells a convertible in winter ?
It appears that different dealers seem to view the pre-purchase check in different ways. I know when it comes to chips etc, I think there's a guide that if the chip/scratch can be seen from a defined distance (a couple of meters I think) in normal conditions, then it needs sorting.
At the end of the day any dealer is going to try and get away with what they can, regardless of the Marque. I've seen some terrible Ferrari's sitting in showrooms over the years (paint actually peeling on a F430). I suspect this will get even worse if the economy starts to take a hit.
OP - do not loose heart, I'd like to think there's more good examples out there than rough ones. As for a Volantes, I think some will now be holding off selling until spring, unless they have no choice. Surely nobody voluntarily sells a convertible in winter ?
Minor issues maybe, mine was delivered with big ends knocking and I sent them a video, they tried to tell me it was injector noise and nothing to worry about! Then they inferred it must have happened overnight (on the ferry, on delivery truck to be delivered?). The car had also gained a mysterious 300+ miles on speedometer since my viewing 
I should've chucked it back at them there and then. AML have since taken it upon themselves to resolve issues and it's been running sweet since, but it should not have happened that way.
I should've chucked it back at them there and then. AML have since taken it upon themselves to resolve issues and it's been running sweet since, but it should not have happened that way.Edited by macdeb on Monday 14th October 19:01
I’ve never had that experience with Aston Martin. I bought a used DBS from an AM dealer and it was genuinely better than new if anything - I think a lot of that may have been down to the previous fastidious owner, a PH member by the way.
I have however bought an approved used Jaguar from a well known dealer in the North East, and the official Jaguar warranty was a joke. Fortunately I have a sense of humour, though I would never but never deal with them again.
I looked at a very highly specced AMG GT C demonstrator a little while back. It had about 5k miles and every option under the sun including ceramic brakes. It was less than 12 months old, and around 100k against a list price which must have been around 175k. The photographs looked great. I asked them about chips and blemishes and they said it was pristine, subject to two small chips which they sent me photographs of. I asked them to hold it and I drove the length of the country to see it at a prominent official AMG dealer in the South West.
Well. f
k knows what had happened to that car. They had it under a silk drape when I arrived clearly expecting me to part with the cash without even seeing it. I asked them to take it off. The front looked as if it had been on the front line on D -Day. There were chips everywhere including the windscreen. The front seat was marked and creased, and the side bolsters had been crushed. It looked as if it had been driven on five track days, by an elephant. I asked where the wind deflector was. The salesman said, there is no wind deflector. I said I can see that, but there is supposed to be. Then he seemed astounded and crestfallen when I told him that I was not interested in the car.
The moral of that story is that you should never ever buy a car without inspecting and driving it personally, first. You cannot trust a dealer’s description, and you cannot buy unseen.
I have however bought an approved used Jaguar from a well known dealer in the North East, and the official Jaguar warranty was a joke. Fortunately I have a sense of humour, though I would never but never deal with them again.
I looked at a very highly specced AMG GT C demonstrator a little while back. It had about 5k miles and every option under the sun including ceramic brakes. It was less than 12 months old, and around 100k against a list price which must have been around 175k. The photographs looked great. I asked them about chips and blemishes and they said it was pristine, subject to two small chips which they sent me photographs of. I asked them to hold it and I drove the length of the country to see it at a prominent official AMG dealer in the South West.
Well. f
k knows what had happened to that car. They had it under a silk drape when I arrived clearly expecting me to part with the cash without even seeing it. I asked them to take it off. The front looked as if it had been on the front line on D -Day. There were chips everywhere including the windscreen. The front seat was marked and creased, and the side bolsters had been crushed. It looked as if it had been driven on five track days, by an elephant. I asked where the wind deflector was. The salesman said, there is no wind deflector. I said I can see that, but there is supposed to be. Then he seemed astounded and crestfallen when I told him that I was not interested in the car.The moral of that story is that you should never ever buy a car without inspecting and driving it personally, first. You cannot trust a dealer’s description, and you cannot buy unseen.
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